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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Some good 1080P news...

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Thank you Jim; I think this is the best solution of all; pure genius! I do remember it was suggested in the heat of the debate by one of the community; can't quite remember who, there were so many long posts. I don't think I have ever spent so much time on the board since the F verses T stop debate.

I have only recently joined this community after ordering my Red in April and I must say I have never experienced anything like this before. You don't just buy a camera from Red, you adopt it; you have a say in it's development; not just for now, but forever.
 
Jannard said:
Don... I don't see a reservation number next to your post. If you put in your order now I am quite certain that almost every feature you want will be available by the time we can ship you a camera.

Jim
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Yes, but first I want to shoot and test its performance and use for my work. I'll be renting. I have already scheduled a shooting with for the 4Q. Will it be available then? I mean: 4K RedCode RAW @ 25 fps / 2K scaled RedCode RAW @ 60 fps / 2K windowed RedCode RAW @ 100 fps?
 
Jannard said:
Don... I don't see a reservation number next to your post. If you put in your order now I am quite certain that almost every feature you want will be available by the time we can ship you a camera.
Click to expand...


Heh... I think there's a decent chance everyone concerned about it will have a 720P/1080P workflow figured out before you get it programmed into the camera. It may end up being no big deal.

But get the audio working! Do that WAY first. There's a lot of quick turnaround stuff a lot of us don't want to have to sync sound for.

Anyway - can't wait to get my paws on my RED fully working or not. Thanks for kickin' ass as usual!
 
Jim, Thank you for this post which hopefully also settles the discussion. Personally I can easily accept the strategy of RED you described. It is a fair play. Still, there are two issues I hope you could consider within your team

1) Is it possible to get even a preliminary schedule or a priority list in which the new things will possibly appear? For example, as you noticed already in the other thread, all of us who work in Europe desperately need the 25p format, and your words that it is already on its way, or under work and test, was a relief. The key point is, at this end we need to build our business, which is about planning and negotiating of the coming projects. It becomes rather difficult to make any serious plans on RED, if there's no idea when, or in which order, we may, at least preliminary, expect to see new options.

Now, I'm not talking of this format discussion which has been going for the last days. What I mean are questions like, will Redcine run in Windows machines, will it really be possible to convert to whatever format from Redcine, what kind of plans are there to get Redcode to the most comme NLEs and so on? This is to say, there's a bunch of questions which need some tentative answer before it becomes possible to build projects on RED.

2) Since you have this unsual business strategy, I hope you go this way as long and far as possible. That is, the change RED will make in cinema and EFP business depends on how much business the *owners* will be able to make with the camera. Is it wishful thinking if I believe, the more you open doors towards other companies, the more RED will win?

We are all victims of the business strategies which led to ridiculous situations such as that each of us probably has almost a sperate charger for each electronic device we own. For instance, I think we have at least twenty different kind of charges in our house; each mobile phone has its own, the portable dvds do, each laptop, and so on. Or, has any user ever gained anything by the competing dvd-R, dvd+R standards? Technically the lack of standards doesn't make sense. Nobody gains of the situation that the Canon 24/25f HDV format cannot be played back in Sony decks etc. Nobody really gains if company Blue makes bolts and those did not fit with the screws of manufacturer Yellow.

If I've got it right, there is currently no 4K standard, so RED has a unique chance to create one for digital cinema. In practice this meant one were able to convert from Redcode to others and vice versa. And now, I have here one important and selfish(?) wish; If there was a conversion between Redcode raw and Cineform raw, then it did not matter when Redcode appears to Adobe software and Windows. In the mean time, I knew for sure I may plan new projects immediately and start to do business on RED as soon as the camera arrives. Guess, I would not be the only one, but instead many would follow the same root at the first place.

Perhaps not all know, RED users should be thankful for a Belgium mathematician Ingrid Daubechies on her work on wavelets. The wavelet compression is one of the key issues and innovations behind RED, and Daubedics shared her knowledge and her unique findings for the rest of the world in the 80's for free as people customarily do in science. And now, RED and we all gain for what she did. Summing up, the local optimals are seldom global ones.
 
Jannard said:
Timecode is enabled now and being used in Spain on Soderbergh's movie. Audio will come after the 1st cameras are shipped. We are reworking the schedule so I can't tell you the current date.

Jim
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Oh shoot, I thought that'd be there. In order to get audio functional will I have to mail my Red back?
 
Shawn Nelson said:
Oh shoot, I thought that'd be there. In order to get audio functional will I have to mail my Red back?
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No. It is an email or download and upload to camera via CF or USB. Easy. We are making every feature enablement via this method. You'll send your camera in ONLY if there is a hardware issue (we hope that won't happen) or for someting major like a sensor upgrade.

Jim
 
Don King said:
Yes, but first I want to shoot and test its performance and use for my work. I'll be renting. I have already scheduled a shooting with for the 4Q. Will it be available then? I mean: 4K RedCode RAW @ 25 fps / 2K scaled RedCode RAW @ 60 fps / 2K windowed RedCode RAW @ 100 fps?
Click to expand...

I mentioned in my previous post that 2K windowed REDCODE RAW @ 100 fps is Under Development. We are reworking the enablement schedule now. I recommend that you rent something else if we can't meet you schedule.

Jim
 
I thought the 1080p discussion was pretty professional on all sides. Insofar as this announcement, it's a cool compromise to losing 1080p. But, it's sort of like if you had a reservation on a revolutionary Mazerati that could switch from auto to manual, and then the manufacturer says that they're switching to manual, and may include the auto when they finish everything else. Customers thank the manufacturer for the privelege. Huh ?

Aaight, I get that we are gettting a much better camera than when I first put my reservation money down, and i fully appreciate ALL the benefits (price, design etc...) since I've been here since the first mention of the camera. Yet, I consider myself a realist. This is a compromise to a design step back and not an advancement, IMO. In that regard I appreciate the openess and honesty of RED and the whole team. Still on board. Enthusiastic to see the camera perform, and i hope we can get a specific schedule on updates (except for 1080p, 720p) before Sept. Obrigado.

Just me 3 pence :biggrin:
 
Jannard said:
We will not have all features enabled from the beginning. Actually we will never have all the features enabled because we will keep adding and changing as the needs dictate. Welcome to the World of RED.

Jim
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Hehehe! :)
That's the way to go! Thanks for creating a whole new world.
 
Jannard said:
I mentioned in my previous post that 2K windowed REDCODE RAW @ 100 fps is Under Development. We are reworking the enablement schedule now. I recommend that you rent something else if we can't meet you schedule.

Jim
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I see.

Can I count with the 4K RedCode RAW @ 25 fps / 2K scaled RedCode RAW @ 60 fps during 4Q, at least?
 
Excellent move! just what I wanted and then some.

So I assume that we could just have a different CF card for each firmware version on hand and have no problems switching between them on set if needs be. Or, could we put multiple firmwares on one cf card and then pick which one out of a menu? This would definitely make it more convenient.
 
There is a very knowkn swiss dealer of digital cameras and editing systems. One and a have year ago, I told him to visit www.red.com, explained him what RED could do for the industry. He just laughed and called me a dreamer. "Never", he said, "never will it be possible to build a camera in this short time, never ever." And he added: "Do you think, the technicians at SONY, Panasonic ASO wouldn't build such a camera when it is possible?" I then explained him, that RED is not an ordinary camera, RED is a philosophy a new way to think about high-tech, to put together the best brains and ideas from arround the world.
Until now this swiss dealer don't believe, that RED will deliver a working camera and call me a fool.
In some weeks I will be the luckiest fool, proud to be owner of such a cool tool. With the best features build in and the funiest service pack ever heard of: things may change....
 
If there is a group that NEEDS 720P and/or 1080P, given enough time we can provide that. There may well be two or three software options in the future. Pick one and load it. Change your mind and load another. That is certainly possible and we are now considering this as an option for the future.


Solomon, Jim... Solomon!
 
Don King said:
I see.

Can I count with the 4K RedCode RAW @ 25 fps / 2K scaled RedCode RAW @ 60 fps during 4Q, at least?
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My mistake... from the actual post, you can see we are not getting much sleep.

Here is the list for today:

4K REDCODE RAW @ 1-60 fps to RAW Port
4K REDCODE RAW @ 1-24 fps to Compact Flash or RED Drive

2K REDCODE RAW scaled @ 1-60 fps to Compact Flash or RED Drive (Under development)
2K REDCODE RAW cropped @ 1-100 fps to Compact Flash or RED Drive

Don... my recommendation is that you rent something else.

Jim
 
Jannard said:
Don... my recommendation is that you rent something else.

Jim
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Don doesn't seem like he really cares about renting, buying or whatever. He just wants to take a dig at Red, I think.
 
Jannard said:
...We value everyone's comments and needs. We are here to serve. It may come in a package we hadn't planned on. But this whole project has taken on a life we hadn't forseen in the beginning.

Jim
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Jim, we're obviously excited about your desire to improve the camera and change specs to meet demand, etc. However, being an empathetic business owner, I am concerned that your cost of goods is going up as well. I hope you feel free to adjust pricing to match features (for the future, obviously) and charge what you need to keep the company healthy. We want you around a long time not burned out or draining your personal resources. :)

Phil
www.artbeats.com
 
Thanks Jim...again,

I see this as bend over backwards for all your customers. It's admirable that you continue to be open. Unlike one post suggest that this is a set back (no doubt trying to goad you into a confrontation) I know a revolution when I've joined one.

We know that over at RED you'll "make it do what it (didn't) do" so... thanks again.

P.S. You actually sleep over at RED?
 
Stephen Webb said:
AUDIO???

What do you need audio for man? This a CINEMA camera, we don't record audio onboard! This is another of those EFP things, isn't it?

<TUMBLEWEED>

I'll get my coat.

TAXI!
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heheh you are either very brave or very drunk right now....its too easy I will
refrain from a serious reply.
 
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