So $4K R1 is more capable than the more expensive Scarlet

[Damian Mizzi]

I don't see why with the decreased price of the Epic that the Scarlet will not get 5k unlocked. I think Red limited the Scarlets frame rate to make Epic owners not loss their minds. Now that Epic is only 2x as expensive I think 5k ws 25 fps will eventually be unlocked. So that would be a plus for the Scarlet crew.

Completely agree! Especially 5Kws looks quite realistically possible

 

[Freya]

Freya it is always nice to see your thoughtfulness and balance around here
.

Thanks for the nice words! I'm actually not as angry normally. Just had a few shocks to my system!
Probably good for me but I'd probably normally be a bit more balanced.
Gotta stop worrying about other people and start worrying about ME!
Have a bad habit of worrying about people who really don't need my concern! lol!

Great to see a Wim Wenders fan on here.

love

Freya

 

[Lliam Worthington]

It was my understanding that the ASICs were different between the Epic and Scarlet, if so, probably not just a firmware upgrade. If they are the same then only a firmware change. That would be cool. However, when the Epics get updated with the Dragon sensor, which requires a new electronic package (ASICs), there will be a pile of Epic "guts" lying besides the electronic operating table. Current Scarlets could undergo transplants to become Epics.

Of course that means that there would be grey Epics. Oh the confusion

)

Re different ASIC's yeah that was the understanding. Which is why I struggle to see how a change of innards for scarlet makes sense? What would you do... pay I don't know, 9K? They said it would have to be more expensive than the epics 6k for Dragon. But that would bring Scarlet up to almost the same price as an epic? And... what? The same specs as an epic? Then, why bother with a Scarlet Dragon? Lesser specs then? You'd just buy an epic.

So what, the answer is install new sensor and boards making it better than current epics, but not quite as good as Dragon epics. WIth a Dragon epic available for 25K, They'd have to charge about say 14K for a Scarlet dragon, when your demographic is the ones buying a sub 10K camera? I just don't see that making too much sense? All that hassle removing and replacing innards to produce two camears taht are almost the same for a few thousand in price differential?

I'm very happy to be enlightened though.

Also there's the not insignificant fact that RED has said Dragon epics will be executed first, leaving Scarlet where I'm really not sure? As we have just seen, a year can be a loooooong time in electronics...

So, that's why even though DR is probably the most holiest of grails in my eyes. I would think a simpler, cheaper, faster, Scarlet firmware upgrade would probably make more sense, by maxing out whatever can be achieved just with current boards. If anything can.

What's that old chinese curse... may you live in interesting times.


:thumbsup:

 

[Mike P.]

I don't see why with the decreased price of the Epic that the Scarlet will not get 5k unlocked. I think Red limited the Scarlets frame rate to make Epic owners not loss their minds. Now that Epic is only 2x as expensive I think 5k ws 25 fps will eventually be unlocked. So that would be a plus for the Scarlet crew.

You don't see why? How about the obvious reason: because it may not technically/technologically be possible? Scarlet uses Epic run-offs... chips that weren't good enough for Epic and are clock-throttled accordingly. That means the lowest common denominator is the slowest Scarlet out there (probably the earlier Scarlet numbers, when fabrication yields were lower than they are now.)

From my understanding, the ASICs in Scarlet are exactly the same as the ASICs in Epic, they just didn't pass the "Epic Throughput Tests" and were deemed unfit to handle Epic frame rates and compression ratios.

 

[Webster Miller]

)


What's that old chinese curse... may you live in interesting times.


:thumbsup:

lol. Well Lliam, I guess we were all cursed by some powerful little old Chinese dude. The key is to keep moving forward and figure out how to make the most of these interesting times.

Cheers!

 

[Damian Mizzi]

You don't see why? How about the obvious reason: because it may not technically/technologically be possible? Scarlet uses Epic run-offs... chips that weren't good enough for Epic and are clock-throttled accordingly. That means the lowest common denominator is the slowest Scarlet out there (probably the earlier Scarlet numbers, when fabrication yields were lower than they are now.)

From my understanding, the ASICs in Scarlet are exactly the same as the ASICs in Epic, they just didn't pass the "Epic Throughput Tests" and were deemed unfit to handle Epic frame rates and compression ratios.

I have to agree with you MIke, cause I believe you're right. The difference in frame rates and compression between Scarlets and Epics is massive, however if those ASICs did not make inside an Epic, I'd have to say that they can do much more inside a Scarlet. They have been locked to the current specs to protect the Epics. And that is fair, however it would be cool if Red had to give the Scarlets a bit more, and make them even more competitive with what's the other companies have available and coming out. And now that Epics are so much cheaper, I guess it makes even more sense. As I said in my original post. Currently the Scarlet cannot even pair to the Red One's speed. Again, the Epic won't be compromised by upgrading the Scarlets a bit, and considering the new prices now more than ever.

 

[Webster Miller]

I agree Damian. Hardware cannot be sped up with firmware. The electronics in the Scarlet are apparently not up to par with those in the Epic. So I doubt that the Epic frame rates can be matched in the Scarlet without a hw update. But it would be nice to get a bump in performance on the Scarlet. And as you say, the price differential is not as high between the two cameras.