SlowMo Workflow after a 50fps Timebase Mistake

[Justin Viney]

I recently shot a music video shot entirely in 3K, 50fps at 1/100 shutter speed for a slow motion effect. Everything looks great, however I made the error of setting both the frame rate and time base on the RED camera to 50fps, so the clips need to be slowed down in post to fit a 25fps timeline.

The issue is that if I conform the clips to 25fps in Cinematools I will loose the timecodes and won't be able to reconnect the R3D media.

So I am wondering how I should treat my workflow. I am considering just doing an online edit with 2k footage. But then I am not sure how I will colour grade on top of that.

If anyone has any advice I would greatly appreciate it as I am still learning RED workflows and various tools. I am editing in FCP 7, but I also have Premiere CS4 in my studio.

Cheers,

Justin

 

[Ben Scott]

in premiere you can select the clip and modify the timebase to 25fps. no idea re fcp

 

[Justin Viney]

Right, I imagine it's okay to change the clips speed in a Premiere timeline because you are working with the native files, right?

I'd much prefer to use Final Cut Pro as my NLE system, has anyone been able to make it work? Surely there must be a way around it.

 

[Ryan Boyer]

Vegas Pro will be easy for you to mutate the timebase. Try downloading a different software and see if the problem still occurs.

 

[Michael Romano]

If you go right to a 2K online, I suggest correcting your white balance and setting your gamma space to REDLogFILM. The finish colorist will thank you.

 

[Justin Viney]

Vegas Pro will be easy for you to mutate the timebase. Try downloading a different software and see if the problem still occurs.

I appreciate the insight Ryan, though I don't have the time and cash to invest in a new editing system. In future I will certainly want to explore workflows with different programs but for now it is vital I operate within FCP.

If you go right to a 2K online, I suggest correcting your white balance and setting your gamma space to REDLogFILM. The finish colorist will thank you.

Michael, I tried a quick test exporting a 2k AppleProRes 4444 out of REDCINE-X PRO with the gamma space set to REDLOGFILM, and I found that when I tried doing a grade on the exports, I lost a lot of colour information when bringing back the contrast and saturation, this is why I was initially confused on how I should grade if I was to jump straight into an online edit as I should be grading the RAW files. Is there a particular colour grading program that might read the exports better or any other workflow ideas?

EDIT: Refer to the later post for image examples.

 

[Ben Scott]

Right, I imagine it's okay to change the clips speed in a Premiere timeline because you are working with the native files, right?

I'd much prefer to use Final Cut Pro as my NLE system, has anyone been able to make it work? Surely there must be a way around it.

Can't you just make a 50fps clip and play it back at 50% in FCP?

EDIT: Isn't there a gamma shift issue with mac/pro res encoding or has that been fixed?

 

[Dane Henry]

If you have FCP7 Studio you already have the program to do this. Cinema Tools

- After you have converted to your editing codec, most likely ProRes.
- Select all the clips you want to slow down
- Then right click and select Open with "Cinema Tools"
- you need to conform each clip to your desired timebase (25fps or 23.976). This is a destructive edit on the clip and will make the clip play slowmotion. So if you want to keep the original normal speed clip duplicate the clip before opening in Cinema Tools.

-dane

 

[JOÃO CRAVEIRO]

Sorry for the noob question and off topic, but u speek 3K 50fps...What camera did u used for achived 50fps, its possible be the Scarlet!?

 

[Justin Viney]

If you have FCP7 Studio you already have the program to do this. Cinema Tools

- After you have converted to your editing codec, most likely ProRes.
- Select all the clips you want to slow down
- Then right click and select Open with "Cinema Tools"
- you need to conform each clip to your desired timebase (25fps or 23.976). This is a destructive edit on the clip and will make the clip play slowmotion. So if you want to keep the original normal speed clip duplicate the clip before opening in Cinema Tools.

-dane

I was already familiar with this, as mentioned in my original post; "The issue is that if I conform the clips to 25fps in Cinematools I will loose the timecodes and won't be able to reconnect the R3D media." So the problem is that once I conform the clips I loose the ability to reconnect my media to the RAW data, so I'm unsure how I should grade my project and what workflow I should use. Thanks for your response however.

EDIT:

Sorry for the noob question and off topic, but u speek 3K 50fps...What camera did u used for achived 50fps, its possible be the Scarlet!?

We used a REDONE MX camera, we also reduced our REDcode to 28.

Can't you just make a 50fps clip and play it back at 50% in FCP?

EDIT: Isn't there a gamma shift issue with mac/pro res encoding or has that been fixed?

I think FCP jumps frames when importing 50fps into a 25fps timeline so when you slow it down you get poor result.