Shutter spped

[Ershov Kirill]

Hi guys) i am a little bit confused with choosing the right shutter speed when filming....

Maybe something is with my camera but i don't think so....

few weeks ago i posted this test shot: https://vimeo.com/56299838

password: qwerty

somebody from this forum told me that there is too much motion blur and i also think so....

than i made some more tests shooting only people walking, talking and drinking tea and some times i ave the same situation...

i was filmin at 24fps 4k according to 180 rule - so my shutter speed was 48

so maybe there is anything i don't know?))) cause when i was shooting with 5d i didn't have such problems with people just standing and singing...

maybe it is better to increase shutter speed and forget about 180 rule?

and another question is about ISO)

is it true that even if i am filming with red scarlet in bright sunny day i have to make it 800 even in such conditions? some people say so...

thanx

 

[Ben Scott]

Have the ISO at whatever works best for you. People tend to use ISO 800 so as to give themselves a bit of protection from not shooting too brightly as to clip. They then adjust the ISO in the edit to whatever they want.

 

[Ershov Kirill]

Have the ISO at whatever works best for you. People tend to use ISO 800 so as to give themselves a bit of protection from not shooting too brightly as to clip. They then adjust the ISO in the edit to whatever they want.

actually i also think so but some people really scream that we must use only 800, that it is a rule!)))

and what can you suggest about shutter speed?

 

[Nick Pasquariello]

The thing to realize about ISO is that, because the files the camera captures are Raw, the ISO doesn't actually change the data that's recorded; it only changes what you are seeing. If you want to change how bright or dark the image that you are recording is, then adjust your aperture, ND filtration, shutter speed, or lighting. Bumping the ISO way up to 2000 can help you see what's happening in the shadows, but IT DOES NOT change what the camera is recording; your image will look really, really bad if you have to shoot at 2000 ISO in order to see anything. Conversely, if you shoot at 250 ISO, it is really easy to clip the highlights and blow things out in the image, since on your monitor you probably won't be able to tell that it's even an issue.

So, the rule of thumb is to shoot between 320 and 800 ISO, depending on who you ask.

But again, the ISO is only for visualization purposes; whether you change the ISO in camera, or in post (using RedCine-X or most grading software packages), you will get the EXACT SAME RESULT.

I stress this because most of the bad Red footage I have seen come from set is due to a complete lack of understanding of how Raw and ISO work in the camera. My personal preference is to get an image that looks correct at 640 or 500 ISO; at 800 I can see noise a bit too much, and at 320 it's too easy to clip some highlights. Changing the ISO to capture your image is the same as saying "Eh, we'll fix it in post," and every time you say that, an editor looses a week of his life.

 

[Robino_J]

actually i also think so but some people really scream that we must use only 800, that it is a rule!)))

and what can you suggest about shutter speed?

There's no iso rules. Do whatever you like - 800 is just fine for daylight. Test your camera at 320,500, 800, there's no better way to understand.

For the "by the book" shutter settings use 1/48th for 24fps.. Just double the fps to figure out shutter. (if shooting 48 fps use 1/96th)

There's no rules for shutter either it depends on what style you are after.

 

[Ben Scott]

I didn't notice any issue with the shutter speed on that clip other than what you would normally associate with shooting at 24fps.

 

[Ershov Kirill]

so and if i am filming a running person at 24fps i also have to stay at 1/48?

for example here: https://vimeo.com/56073400

i don't think that the shutter is 1/48 in this video but it's just of course my opinion) just trying to understand)

 

[Ershov Kirill]

actually i know all that rules but currently i am working with red digital cinema camera and only for the first month so i want to find out every detail when working with such cameras, not to kill the quality....

 

[steven moreno]

so and if i am filming a running person at 24fps i also have to stay at 1/48?

for example here: https://vimeo.com/56073400

i don't think that the shutter is 1/48 in this video but it's just of course my opinion) just trying to understand)

That's not "normal" shutter - (1/48 or 180 deg) that's skinny (fast) shutter - like 45 degrees (1/250 I think)

 

[Eric Santiago]

That video looks like it was rendered at the wrong frame rate.

Just my take on it.

 

[Andrey B]

Hello, Kirill! To get sharper motion you can use shorter shutter speeds. 1/48 is usual. Try to get 1/200 or even more (lower) with your music videos. It adds some jerkyness to your films. Adds some energy and emotionality when fast motion occures. Try to not go too low with the settings. You need to achieve a compromise for motion blur and than you can get more stylish look.

Be careful and remember two important things when you cheat with shutter:
1. Lowering the shutter speed eats exposure. You just need more light.
2. Some flickering can occures from usual light sources like a bulbs and from cold industrial lights. To correct flicker you must use equal shutter to your framerate. If you plan to shoot with 24 fps then use next shutter speeds: 1/48, 1/96, 1/192 etc... Or you can buy special power source and lights (like Dedolight) but you will need several grands for this

To get accurate shutter speed in angle units you can simply devide 8640 number by your lower number of shutter speed. So if you need to get angular speed of 1/48 you need to devide 8640 by 48 = 180 degrees.

Here is the table for lazy boys:

270 = 1/32
180 = 1/48
172.8 = 1/50
144 = 1/60
90 = 1/96
72 = 1/120
45 = 1/198
22.5 = 1/348
11 = 1/696
8.6 = 1/1000

Just watched you video. I think the shutter in this case was too low.

 

[Ershov Kirill]

That's not "normal" shutter - (1/48 or 180 deg) that's skinny (fast) shutter - like 45 degrees (1/250 I think)

u know in this video shutter speed is 1/48....

so that's why i am asking such question....

 

[Ershov Kirill]

That video looks like it was rendered at the wrong frame rate.

Just my take on it.

well i was shooting at 4k 24fps than to redcine x - export to apple pro res 422 hq (1080p) - than final cut pro 7 - take projet settings to match clip settings - than export using quicktime conversion h.263, current frame rate and all that vimeo settings...

maybe i am doing something wrong

 

[steven moreno]

u know in this video shutter speed is 1/48....

so that's why i am asking such question....

So the Impulse Kitty/Luke Neumann test is 1/48 shutter speed? Did they mention that here on the forum? I didn't see that info in the description. Because that's the video that I was referring to as not normal shutter - but I don't know anything for sure. Your video does seem to have some blur...maybe export setting in quicktime