shooting stills with Scarlet

[Maik Müller]

I want to share my thoughts on shooting stills with Scarlet, because at first i thought i'll never use the 5k-mode, but looking at my R3D-files i realized that i use it more often.

I've made a preset that comes close to fill all my needs. It simply does this:
- REC-button on side-handle: half-press = single AF, full press = start recording, release = stop recording
(I leave the REC-button on the SSD-module at standard-behavior to have both)
- 5k, 12fps, 5:1
- shutter-mode to time (i mostly use angle for motion)
Make another preset for your favorite motion-settings and map that to the S/M-switch, works great.

I've also made presets for higher quality (8fps @ 3:1) and HDRx-shooting, but i mostly use 12fps @ 5:1. 4k 15fps with HDRx is another interesting combination.

So, then i have the shutterspeed selected and can quickly change it with the front-wheel on the side-handle. (My side-handle setup is based on RED's alternative preset.) I choose my desired aperture via the zoom rocker and compensate via shutter-speed, then i hunt for focus. 12fps without worrying about a puffer that gets full after seconds does really make things different. Catching a moment or a facial expression on a baby's face for example gets easier than ever.

Sure, there are drawbacks:
- AF is slow compared to DSLRs and it is disabled during recording at 5k. (Why?)
- There are no automatics at all, it's full manual photography. Some half-automatics like aperture-priority/shutter-priority would be nice to have.
- It makes you think about getting a EPIC, full DSMC must be fantastic. Sometimes i find it a bit hard to make the decision between stills and motion.

Sure on Scarlet we could shoot 24-30fps @ 4k to get DSMC, but having a fast enough shutter for stills and enough blur to not destroy motion at the same time is a bit hard to get. Thats why i prefer to drop the motion part when i shoot stills. DSMC is clearly EPICs territorial, the higher FPS and being able to use HDRx for motion at high resolutions are the key here.

I don't miss a DSLR that much and if, then mainly for their better AF and obviously the weight/size/battery-time.
So, try it, 5k stills really look great.

 

[stu aull]

Thanks for sharing Maik - this is an area I have yet to explore. The few stills I have pulled from a normal recording stream have been fabulous, but your idea of ready-made Preset makes best sense. Esp the rec stop-start on the REC button!

Stu Aull
SX 199
Alaska

 

[Jack Shanahan]

Good ideas. Thanks.

 

[Patrick Grossien]

Maik, would you mind sharing your setup with the camera when shooting stills? Do you shoot handheld or with a monopod? With LCD or viewfinder?

I still have yet to find a perfect way to hold the camera. I guess I'll have to "invest" in the outrigger handle to get it to make things easier. Any thoughts on that?

Thanks,
Patrick

 

[Maik Müller]

Patrick, i have to disappoint you because i have nothing fancy to share here. I mostly use my Scarlet handheld and for that, i keep it simple and as light as possible. It's the basic setup with the LCD on top and the DSMC-sidehandle and sometimes the dualbattery-module. I often have the back of the camera on my chest to get it more stable and the left hand is on the lens. Thats why i'm not convinced to buy the outrigger handle, unless you shoot with deep focus/hyperfocal or with defined distances the left hand needs to be on a focus ring or follow focus. I think something like a small chest-pad on the back of the camera would be nice, oh and of course a trustworthy strap for the sidehandle. I have to play around with a EVF one day to see how this feels, but the next thing i'm getting is the 9"-LCD, so the EVF has to wait. Currently for me its this barebone handheld-setup or a bigger one on a tripod.

I haven't played around with monopods so far. I'm thinking about getting a small shoulder-rig (Gunner). Something like Zacuto's Target Shooter or Striker comes in mind to, but i don't like that design enough to buy it.

I'm with you, i'm looking for a better way to hold my camera too, it's still not perfect for quick handheld stuff and a Scarlet is not really easy to carry around everywhere (which hurts a bit, because i really want to take it around with me more). The images make everything up, but there is room for improvement.

 

[Bill Sepaniak]

... I haven't played around with monopods so far. I'm thinking about getting a small shoulder-rig (Gunner). Something like Zacuto's Target Shooter or Striker comes in mind to, but i don't like that design enough to buy it.

I'm with you, i'm looking for a better way to hold my camera too, it's still not perfect for quick handheld stuff and a Scarlet is not really easy to carry around everywhere (which hurts a bit, because i really want to take it around with me more). The images make everything up, but there is room for improvement.

We just returned from three (3) weeks of running-n-gunning in Northern Italy. Instead of lugging our carbon fibre Vinten tripod and Monfrotto 526 head, we took a Monfrotto 561 BHDV monopod. It has three (3) small retractable tripod-like feet at the bottom for additional stability that are connected to a "fluid-head" at the bottom of the monopod that allows semi-decent panning. It also has a tilt-head (of sorts) at the top of the monopod with a retractable side handle. We mounted our RED Universal mount with an Arri plate to the tilt head, and surprisingly enough it worked quite well. It folds down to nothing and sets-up in seconds, and one person could carry the camera and the monopod with relative ease ... however by the end of the day it was a bit tiring to carry both the monopod and the camera.

A frame grab taken with it is here:

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?87051-Scarlet-in-Northern-Italy



____________________________________
Scarlet X # 1859 “Bettie Page”
“… preparing to ‘whip’ the competition …”

Zeiss Lenses:

CY 21/2.8
ZF 28/2.0
CY 35-70/3.4
CY 50/1.4
ZF100/2.0

Nikon Lenses:
G 14-24/2.8
G 24-70/2.8
D 80-200/2.8

Tokina Lenses:

11-16/2.8

 

[stu aull]

wow - under-9-Lb limit on that, some impressive you could keep your scarlet trim enough to use!

Stu Aull
Alaska

 

[Jonas Kvist Jensen]

Can you actually set up you Scarlet to just shoot a single frame, when pressing the button? Like a normal DSLR would? I'm not sure I could get used to shooting sequences and then picking out frames afterwards.

 

[William Albertini]

wow - under-9-Lb limit on that, some impressive you could keep your scarlet trim enough to use!

Stu Aull
Alaska

A monopod would be able to safely support considerably more than its stated maximum because the weight is transmitted straight down.

 

[Bill Sepaniak]

A monopod would be able to safely support considerably more than its stated maximum because the weight is transmitted straight down.

True. I am sure that the camera with either our Nikon 14-24 or our 24-70 + a REDVOLT weighed considerable more than 9 lbs. Before we bought the monopod we read several reviews and there was a general consensus that the 9 lb weight limit was very, very conservative. While not a substitute for a "real" tripod, the little monopod worked just fine for us.

____________________________________
Scarlet X # 1859 “Bettie Page”
“… preparing to ‘whip’ the competition …”

Zeiss Lenses:

CY 21/2.8
ZF 28/2.0
CY 35-70/3.4
CY 50/1.4
ZF100/2.0

Nikon Lenses:
G 14-24/2.8
G 24-70/2.8
D 80-200/2.8

Tokina Lenses:

11-16/2.8

 

[Maik Müller]

Can you actually set up you Scarlet to just shoot a single frame, when pressing the button? Like a normal DSLR would? I'm not sure I could get used to shooting sequences and then picking out frames afterwards.

Trust me, thats the best part of it. It's like continuous shooting on DSLRs without the caching limits. Having multiple frames to choose from helps in many situations. The workflow in RCX is quick and easy and space-requirements are reasonable. It doesn't cost you much to shoot sequences instead of single frames.

A 1-frame-shot isn't possible yet, the only thing you can do is set the camera to 1fps and try to release the shutter-button within that second. Biggest drawback is the preview then, because the preview is always shown in the selected framerate, and 1fps is a bit hard to work with for focusing or when there is some action going on. I wish RED could enable a smooth preview, at least until recording is started.

@Bill: Thanks for sharing your experiences with the Manfrotto. I was looking into them after Patrick reminded me to look into Monopods again, but wasn't sure about the weight. It looks like a really interesting solution for a low price, i think i'll give it a tray.

 

[Steinar Andersen]

just had a revelation shooting stills with the Scarlet. It really does work better than I could imagine. Had a visit from my brother and my little niece this weekend and decided to take some "photos" with my Scarlet. Normally I dread taking pictures of babies, but this was just a great experience and I also got the bomus of having video of her standing up for the first time, in 4k no less. The images turned out great and i was also plesantly surpried with the sharpness of my zeiss 50mm f1,4.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/khmngzj4qaqwpcp/A001_C014_10204N.0000960.JPG

 

[Maik Müller]

Nice picture. Funny, i did my first tests with stills in exactly the same situation, when my brother came to visit us with my little nephew. Shooting the first steps and such things in 4k is something special. Well, i guess it will be pretty low-res for them, when they're old enough to watch it, hehe.

 

[Ryan Hamblin]

How does everyone feel about 4k for stills? I just did some tests against my canon and was very surprised at how it compares

 

[Patrick Grossien]

Well I usually use 5K for stills but for my taste 4K is still nice and it renders quite lovely.
I pulled stills from the last live event I recorded and these look really good.

Btw Maik, how do you like having the AF on the record button? I moved it to one of the side handle buttons. Do you eer accidentally trigger AF?

 

[Maik Müller]

Well I usually use 5K for stills but for my taste 4K is still nice and it renders quite lovely.
I pulled stills from the last live event I recorded and these look really good.

I'm mostly doing the same thing now, just shooting 4k motion and pulling stills from it. Besides of having motion it has also the advantage of offering AF, stutter-free preview and more frames to choose from. You just have to find the right shutter-speed to get the most out of it. Looking at 5k/12fps-streams just makes me want a EPIC, i was often enough thinking "damn i should have shot that in motion and with audio".

5k stills look great, but honestly, if i want to shoot only stills, i just grab the DSLR.

Btw Maik, how do you like having the AF on the record button? I moved it to one of the side handle buttons. Do you eer accidentally trigger AF?

Indeed, that did happen often enough to make me disable the AF. Well, that and the "not so good"-AF performance. It just feels i have never really lucky moments with it. But you are right, putting the AF on another button is a nice idea. Why didn't i think about that? (I'm using back-button-focus on my DSLR.)

 

[William Robinette]

I've gone to shooting pretty much 4k for everything and not upping to 5k much anymore. What's interesting is that I broke out my DSLR for the first time in a long time for Mother's Day and in taking the photos back to LR I wish I had shot stills on my RED. Here are just a few I shot on Scarlet earlier this year:

http://robinettefilms.tumblr.com/

I have my handle record trigger button set so a half depress toggles the focus check and my side SSD record button half depress gives me AF which I'm finding more and more useful with each firmware upgrade.

 

[Kemalettin Sert]

didnt know stills mode active on side handle

 

[Arthur Woo]

Anyone have experience making constant lighting mimic strobes? Strobes make everything have a very specific look which is very obvious when looking at photos. I don't do much photography anymore so I haven't really experimented with larger sources, but was wondering if anyone had any tips around it.

 

[Maik Müller]

What's interesting is that I broke out my DSLR for the first time in a long time for Mother's Day and in taking the photos back to LR I wish I had shot stills on my RED.

I know what you mean, i have the same feeling every time. Bought a 5DM3 lately and opening up the first images was just "hmmm, thats it? yeah, nothing really happened here". The MX sensor and REDRAW are so much better. I wish i had a RED in the form-factor of a 5D and with proper AF and long running batteries.

Here are just a few I shot on Scarlet earlier this year:
http://robinettefilms.tumblr.com/

Cool images.

I have my handle record trigger button set so a half depress toggles the focus check and my side SSD record button half depress gives me AF which I'm finding more and more useful with each firmware upgrade.

Ok, i guess i have to give the AF another chance, didn't test it for quite a while. Putting focus check on half press sounds like a nice idea, i have to try that. Thanks for the hint.

didnt know stills mode active on side handle

There is no official stills mode, and i guess it will never come. But you can setup the camera to a more stills-friendly shooting style, safe that to a preset and load this preset with the S/M-switch.