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Shooting anamorphic with Epic

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Saba mazloum

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Any one has experience with 2x anamorphic lens on Epic?

would love to know how to do this to have optimize image quality, without cropping, 5k ana seems to be cropping the left and right.

thanks!
 
Yes, you'll always crop left and right if you want a 2.4:1 aspect ratio, since you're starting with an approximately 4:3 image. Same with originating 2x ana on any 16:9 sensor.

Bottom line: its doing what its supposed to do. Don't worry... just go out and shoot some 5k ana beautifulness!
 
would it be the same if i shot on Alexa 4:3 ?
 
Saba mazloum said:
would it be the same if i shot on Alexa 4:3 ?
Click to expand...

But why would cropping the sides be an issue? It shouldn't be, as such. What shooting on a sensor like the 4:3 Alexa's will give you over a super35 sensor is a wider field of view. So by all means, let things like Field of View, Resolution and other aspects of a given camera's image quality be deciding factors on which camera you use - but please don't let cropping be one of them. You're not "loosing" anything. You're simply not using "useless" parts of the sensor.

The more interesting questions are, "Is my FOV wide enough when I'm shooting 5k ANA" or "Is the 2.8K resolution from the Alexa XT enough for my needs"
 
Anamorphic lenses squeeze the image by a factor of two, thus projecting a 1.195:1 aspect ratio image onto the sensor. When using sensors that are natively 16:9 or even wider, it is necessary to crop the sides, resulting in a much smaller used sensor area and a different angle of view for the lens. With the ALEXA 4:3 cameras, the full area of the sensor is used which means more light per photosite, translating into greater sensitivity, less noise, more exposure latitude and sharper images - in short, a much higher image quality retained. Alternatively, the larger sensor area can be used for greater freedom in vertical repositioning when using spherical lenses. 

It is not possible to upgrade from any version of the ALEXA to the ALEXA Plus 4:3 since the yield for ALEXA 4:3 sensors is lower than that for 16:9 sensors.
 
Saba mazloum said:
Any one has experience with 2x anamorphic lens on Epic?

would love to know how to do this to have optimize image quality, without cropping, 5k ana seems to be cropping the left and right.

thanks!
Click to expand...

It also depends on your final output is if your going to cinema then 5k ana is what should be used to get the 2.35 image, but if you want to get more creative you can shoot 5k FF and get a wider field of view or in post zoom in a tiny bit so that the image is not so skinny. After you shoot 5k FF you have to squeeze the image by two resulting in a very skinny image that you can then zoom in to your liking. IF your going to web or sometimes TV this could be an option for you if your client is willing to go that way. I have seen some very high end commercials and music videos using this technique. Here are two spots I shot and Directed that use the 5k FF technique.


 
Thanks guys,

i guess for me, and for this project i really need more of the wider field of view than the pixle count. But i might not be able to rent a ALexa XT thats why im trying to know more about shooting on Epic.
 
Andreas Mendritzki said:
But why would cropping the sides be an issue? It shouldn't be, as such. What shooting on a sensor like the 4:3 Alexa's will give you over a super35 sensor is a wider field of view. So by all means, let things like Field of View, Resolution and other aspects of a given camera's image quality be deciding factors on which camera you use - but please don't let cropping be one of them. You're not "loosing" anything. You're simply not using "useless" parts of the sensor.

The more interesting questions are, "Is my FOV wide enough when I'm shooting 5k ANA" or "Is the 2.8K resolution from the Alexa XT enough for my needs"
Click to expand...

I dont really agree with the FOV, the whole point of shooting anamorphic is to have that wide FOV and obviously the other reason. So in fact, you are " loosing " your loosing the key element to using these lens.

Will Red make a 4:3 sensor ?
 
Saba mazloum said:
I dont really agree with the FOV, the whole point of shooting anamorphic is to have that wide FOV and obviously the other reason. So in fact, you are " loosing " your loosing the key element to using these lens.

Will Red make a 4:3 sensor ?
Click to expand...

why not back up 5 ft and get a wider field of view? haha There are ways to get around a wider FOV.

Not anytime soon....
 
Saba mazloum said:
I dont really agree with the FOV, the whole point of shooting anamorphic is to have that wide FOV and obviously the other reason. So in fact, you are " loosing " your loosing the key element to using these lens.

Will Red make a 4:3 sensor ?
Click to expand...

I shoot anamorphic and FOV has nothing to do with why. In fact, I don't know of anyone who shoots digital ana for that reason (OK, maybe music videos who aren't after 2.35) - especially when nearly all the sensors on the market lack height as they do. It's 'the look' I love which has more to do with the DOF in relation to FOV among other wonderful anomalies. McTiernan said it this way, "It's the cheapest of all special effects". He's right because it makes small movies look big. FOV is another matter.
 
A 4:3 sensor would be great. Hope dies last.
Until that, we can use the 1.3x hawks for example. they use most of the sensor and the Images seem to look nice.
 
Rick LaLonde said:
I shoot anamorphic and FOV has nothing to do with why. In fact, I don't know of anyone who shoots digital ana for that reason (OK, maybe music videos who aren't after 2.35) - especially when nearly all the sensors on the market lack height as they do. It's 'the look' I love which has more to do with the DOF in relation to FOV among other wonderful anomalies. McTiernan said it this way, "It's the cheapest of all special effects". He's right because it makes small movies look big. FOV is another matter.
Click to expand...

Bingo: "DOF in relation to FOV"
 
Matt Ryan said:
why not back up 5 ft and get a wider field of view?
Click to expand...

Or use a shorter focal length.

I don't buy that the reason to use anamorphic is to get a wider FOV when there are plenty of shorter spherical focal lengths, more to choose from than with anamorphic lenses, so it's EASIER to get a wider FOV when shooting spherical.
 
Matt Ryan said:
why not back up 5 ft and get a wider field of view? haha There are ways to get around a wider FOV.

Not anytime soon....
Click to expand...

how do i back up in a room when i cant due to the size of the room?
 
And guys, obviously i know what anamorphic gives, that dreamy look, the softness it brings to the face, the beautiful oval bokeh, the coma effect of the horizontal lines, the flare etc. I understand all that, and thats exactly why i want to shoot with anamorphic.
when you tell me that FOV isnt so important when in fact you can get it with ALexa's 4:3 sensor, and get the full use of the lens, then yes FOV is important to me, without the anamorphic FOV, its like a incomplete anamorphic experience.

Also i dont have that many choices in focal length in china, im struggling to find a 35mm Elite, for now my widest is 40mm Arriscope.

Maybe i should be asking is, is it possible to mix spherical lens with a predominant footage shot on anamorphic. Like maybe for some wider shots i can shoot them on a spherical lens? And no i dont want to use anamorphic back Zoom lens.
 
I think the crop factor (I hate even uttering such a word) is something like 1.2, so the field of view really isn't as big a deal as you think. If you can get your hands on a 35mm I think you will be just fine. I recently finished project that we shot 5k Ana and many of the sets and locations were small. Including a tiny bathroom, and two jail cells. I didn't feel limited at all by the lenses. I had with me an 11-16 in case I needed a big stupid wide, but never used it. I used spherical telephotos, and they cut in fine, I think spherical wides would look out of place.

Cheers,

Nick
 
Saba mazloum said:
And guys, obviously i know what anamorphic gives, that dreamy look, the softness it brings to the face, the beautiful oval bokeh, the coma effect of the horizontal lines, the flare etc. I understand all that, and thats exactly why i want to shoot with anamorphic.
when you tell me that FOV isnt so important when in fact you can get it with ALexa's 4:3 sensor, and get the full use of the lens, then yes FOV is important to me, without the anamorphic FOV, its like a incomplete anamorphic experience.

Also i dont have that many choices in focal length in china, im struggling to find a 35mm Elite, for now my widest is 40mm Arriscope.

Maybe i should be asking is, is it possible to mix spherical lens with a predominant footage shot on anamorphic. Like maybe for some wider shots i can shoot them on a spherical lens? And no i dont want to use anamorphic back Zoom lens.
Click to expand...

Well, as Nick suggests below, you should make sure you get that 40mm on the Epic before you make any judgement calls. Our 40mm Kowa is plenty wide for "normal" shooting. If you want a more 'special effect' lens, then you're either going to have to find some Hawks or yes, mix spherical with ana. Test it out for yourself and see if you're satisfied with the way they match.
 
Have you seen any RED features shot on anamorphic? Like Total Recall or Elysium? These were shot on 2x anamorphics and none of the DP's were complaining about it.... Check out the music videos and commercials of Chris Probst who shoots with Epic and Kowa anamorphics... People have been shooting anamorphic on RED without issue, so rest assured, it's been done. Give it a try...

Those films did mix a bit of spherical in, mainly in the telephotos, but no one would notice. I don't think mixing is an issue until things like bokeh come into play (at least for practical purposes).
 
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