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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Secret Sauce.....

Great info Timur. Tungsten saves a lot of money on rentals. Can you provide us with an R3D still?
 
I sadly can't share any footage. Sesame is very strict.

The hacking is a malware that's in the cookies in your browser...... Clear your browser data.
 
Thanks Timur

This is one of the big reasons I am Interested in dragon. I have found I get much better color/skin tone when I feed the sensor with an 80b/c filter. But Loss of light has not always been a great option or trade off. With the extra sensitivity of dragon I feel this will be my go to setup
 
My thoughts exactly...

Another benefit is as mentioned in this thread, large tungsten units are very affordable, so getting punch isn't really a problem. We used for the sesame shoot, 1 12k tungsten fresnl, 2x 9light maxis, and one 2.5k HMI gelled tungsten for fill. The entire lighting order was under $750
 
Have you tried forgoing the 80C and just shooting the EPIC as tungsten? I've done that on a few shoots with fantastic results.
 
Virus...

Virus...

Timur, there is definitely a virus on your site. Just had my IT dept. clean it from my laptop.
Loved the article, though, thanks!
 
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I was hijacked, cleared my cookies and returned to your site OK. But when I put my device to sleep and returned to your site, I was hijacked again.
 
I had the same issue too. There's certainly something there.
 
jimhare said:
Have you tried forgoing the 80C and just shooting the EPIC as tungsten? I've done that on a few shoots with fantastic results.
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I've often seen that Red footage shot in Tungston lights makes the blue channel incredibly noisy. Unless pristinely exposed. The room for error is so minimal; if you're using a scope lens that eats 8 stops of light and you use Tungsten lights, there's just no room for error, and in fact you may already be boned. I've seen many wonderfully composed shots that are so full of noise that they are painful to look at, because the blue channel is just crushed so much that when you balance the Kelvin for it, it exacerbates all the imperfections.

Which is why I always try to shoot mine in Daylight or Daylight balanced. But, what Timur is laying out is pretty sound, from a technical perspective. Tweaks you that much closer to the "ideal" that the camera sensor "expects".

As I know far less about filters than I do about the sensor technology and color science, is there a filter that would kick 5600K light closer to 5000K? Wouldn't be as drastic of a filter as moving 3200K to 5000K, and also not doing quite the same transformation. But I wonder if pushing 5600K light towards 5000K would give a similar kick to the overall look and feel of the image?
 
Nick Pasquariello said:
As I know far less about filters than I do about the sensor technology and color science, is there a filter that would kick 5600K light closer to 5000K? Wouldn't be as drastic of a filter as moving 3200K to 5000K, and also not doing quite the same transformation. But I wonder if pushing 5600K light towards 5000K would give a similar kick to the overall look and feel of the image?
Click to expand...

Filters are subtractive. Blue filters, be it an 80C on camera or a CTB on a lamp are reducing other parts of the spectrum, thereby increasing the proportion of blue. The name of the game for silicon based image sensors is to raise the amount of energy in the blue portion of the spectrum without blasting the other parts of the spectrum. This is why filtering works. It doesn't matter to the sensor how you do it. Filtering the lens or the source work equally well so long as you have the necessary tools to do it well.

If you have big tungsten instruments and big A/C, then by all means go with an 80C.
 
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Since the Red One we have herd about the CMOS sensor wanting 5600 kelvin light. I don't disagree. But is this not true of all CMOS sensors? Canon, Nikon, Alexa? But yet no still or motion user complained except Red users.

Is it because of the color science? ( no criticism of Graeme here).

I don't know. But I do know that we shot Spider-Man under mostly 3200 degree lights and it was screened on giant screens. And John and I lit it fucking dark

So I'm just wondering if we are chasing something that doesn't need to be chased?

Open to comments. And Timur I respect all that you touch so don't be upset.

Cheers from Hong Kong,

Peter
 
Peter, do you remember what ISO you tended to shoot at on Spiderman? Most of the problems I've seen under Tungsten is when the camera is being monitored under 800ISO of higher; the overall image tends to be a hair underlit/underexposed, which, again, is exacerbated when you expand out the blue channel by shifting from 5600K to 3200K for white balancing. Shooting closer to 320ISO is one of the ways to prevent this issue.

Or, was there any noise reduction done in post?

If neither of those, then I may be stumped on the matter. But you certainly know what you're doing moreso than I do; I'm just trying to piece as much of this together as I can.
 
Peter Lyons Collister said:
Since the Red One we have herd about the CMOS sensor wanting 5600 kelvin light. I don't disagree. But is this not true of all CMOS sensors? Canon, Nikon, Alexa? But yet no still or motion user complained except Red users.

Is it because of the color science? ( no criticism of Graeme here).

I don't know. But I do know that we shot Spider-Man under mostly 3200 degree lights and it was screened on giant screens. And John and I lit it fucking dark

So I'm just wondering if we are chasing something that doesn't need to be chased?

Open to comments. And Timur I respect all that you touch so don't be upset.

Cheers from Hong Kong,

Peter
Click to expand...

Thanks Peter.

Its really more about exactly as the thread title says. Secret sauce. It's that last 5% that makes me happier. I mean, we've been shooting tungsten with a red for 3 years now, and everyone seems to be OK with its results. Its still fine, I just think this takes it to 11.
 
Oh and yea, I wanna change blog hosts. Gotta figure out how to port the blog over to another host. Any suggestions?
 
Timur Civan said:
My thoughts exactly...

Another benefit is as mentioned in this thread, large tungsten units are very affordable, so getting punch isn't really a problem. We used for the sesame shoot, 1 12k tungsten fresnl, 2x 9light maxis, and one 2.5k HMI gelled tungsten for fill. The entire lighting order was under $750
Click to expand...


plus 750usd for the power bill:)
 
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