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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

second hand reds

Abu Reno said:
If history repeats itself and Red is only able to produce 50 cameras a month, I think the Epic will raise some interesting premiums.
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IIRC, Jim said that production for EPIC won't take as long as for the R1 and from the time to order to the time they're readily available will be a lot faster. ...All things subject to change as usual, I'm sure.

Evolve is right on about who is going to buy EPIC. It will be a different crowd to some extent. But if EPIC comes in around $40K, that's still cheaper than many high-end HD cameras and for those who already have a R1 that is working and making money, it almost seems like a no-brainer upgrade with the full value trade-in.

I personally feel that a used R1 body will go for about $15K or that will be fair market value for one that is out of warranty, but in perfect working condition because of the EPIC trade-in. I know there will be better deals out there to be had if someone gets in a bind and needs to sell. For someone willing to shop patiently, there are always deals to be had... I bet I can find one for $12K in a few months, but anyone who really keeps tabs on the market and isn't in a pinch where they have to sell is probably not going to sell that cheap.
 
What will happen if Canon announce a camera like 5D II but with 24p and Raw ? Ok, the R1 will still keep some advantage like certainly a higher frame rate but on the other hand, also important disadvantages..

I'm still thinking of getting a Red one for myself but on the other hand, but i guess if you are an independent filmmaker it's wise to wait at least a couple of more weeks to decide?


v*

Artist / Photograph / Author & Director
http://www.linkedin.com/in/vincentthomas
http://blog.myspace.com/bout_de_lune
 
viny said:
What will happen if Canon announce a camera like 5D II but with 24p and Raw ? Ok, the R1 will still keep some advantage like certainly a higher frame rate but on the other hand, also important disadvantages..

I'm still thinking of getting a Red one for myself but on the other hand, but i guess if you are an independent filmmaker it's wise to wait at least a couple of more weeks to decide?


v*

Artist / Photograph / Author & Director
http://www.linkedin.com/in/vincentthomas
http://blog.myspace.com/bout_de_lune
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wait for the future or live in the present

this is a speech...dont know if its true :)
 
Wouldn't sell my Red for $12K because at that point, it's worth keeping it and making money. Reality is the value will drop at some point, but until Epic surfaces, I agree with others that unless people are desperate to sell it, the value should hold at no less than $15K.

I think Epic will have a lot of upside for doing the upgarde, not the least of which is the form factor. It's a smaller camera. Those in the HD world will actually probably prefer it to the Red One if it's lighter, more portable. This is all subject to change of course, but from what I saw at NAB, it's an easier camera to run around with in its basic config.
 
#1 - (and listen closely) I expect EPIC to far surpass the expectations of even the biggest "Redhead fanboys" - it will be THE digital cinema camera.

#2 - I expect RED to make them FASTER, and have MORE quantity available when they are released. I doubt that EPIC DAY ONE (looking very forward to THAT!!) will be just 25 cameras. (But I'd sure LOVE it if was only 25 cameras!)

#3 - ALL HIGH END PRODUCTIONS - studio feature and commercials with budgets that typically shoot on 35mm will command EPIC over the RED ONE. Because everyone wants "a bigger gun" and I am sure the EPIC specs will simply speak for themselves.

The demand for RED ONE will DROP on the high end. 100% for sure.

SCARLET will be the DOC, ULTRA LOW-BUDGET INDIE, REALITY TV, INTERVIEW, SOCCER MOM, CRASH CAM camera. EVERYBODY AND THEIR DOG will own a SCARLET.

#4 - People who own RED ONE cameras and don't have the financial means to upgrade should entertain partnering with someone who does - assuming that their RED ONE is out there working.

#5 - People/companies who own GLASS and support gear will have the advantage on the service/rental side. Offhollywood has been in the camera rental business less than one year - and I can tell you ... it's about SERVICE and SUPPORT and VALUE ADD - not about owning a camera body.

#6 - I could be wrong about 1-4. You can take #5 to the bank.
 
Why do I have a feeling Jim is going open doors for another equal trade in value plus upgrade to another BAD ASS CAMERA! :w00t: I'm in all the way!!
 
Offhollywood said:
#3 - ALL HIGH END PRODUCTIONS - studio feature and commercials with budgets that typically shoot on 35mm will command EPIC over the RED ONE. Because everyone wants "a bigger gun" and I am sure the EPIC specs will simply speak for themselves.

The demand for RED ONE will DROP on the high end. 100% for sure.

SCARLET will be the DOC, ULTRA LOW-BUDGET INDIE, REALITY TV, INTERVIEW, SOCCER MOM, CRASH CAM camera. EVERYBODY AND THEIR DOG will own a SCARLET.
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I think you nailed it with this one; absolutely correct. The question then becomes "what happens to the RED ONE?" Is there really a market for the mid-range digital cinema camera? If Epic takes over 35mm Hollywood productions, and Scarlet does everything else, where does the R1 fit in?
 
#3 - ALL HIGH END PRODUCTIONS - studio feature and commercials with budgets that typically shoot on 35mm will command EPIC over the RED ONE. Because everyone wants "a bigger gun" and I am sure the EPIC specs will simply speak for themselves.


I indeed welcome Red venue but i still found not convinced when i heard that Red could compete with 35mm any day.. It's another step really in quality, Epic has still to prove it could satisfy very exigent Director and DOP...

Now, well sad to tell but like it happened a lot in the past, the cost and speed have more weight than quality...

v*
 
Offhollywood said:
#3 - ALL HIGH END PRODUCTIONS - studio feature and commercials with budgets that typically shoot on 35mm will command EPIC over the RED ONE. Because everyone wants "a bigger gun" and I am sure the EPIC specs will simply speak for themselves.

The demand for RED ONE will DROP on the high end. 100% for sure.
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How about rental? How much more could you charge for EPIC and stay competitive against film or F35?

Will we end up spending an extra $20K to retain clients and keep working?
 
Having a more advanced and more expensive option does not make the R1 obsolete.

As long as they don't abandon it and keep tinkering/adding features, it will never die!
 
wow. this all sounds so absurd to me. on one hand you have a company that has publicly committed to make sure its current product does not become obsolete. they announce a new product and everyone starts reacting in a panicky tone. let me just say that if they are offering upgrades to the 5k mysterium x sensor for the red one, what do you think the aim of monstro is? probably not 5k. probably aiming at 65mm film. at which point you have an imax camera. now hollywood may love this, but outside hollywood that is a pretty monstrous resource sucker to be putting into "Independent Features". Can't even imagine trying to manage those file sizes. no offense meant to any opinions on this board, i am just expressing my own. I love my 3 day old Red One. It makes Fantastically beautiful images. 5k will be amazing when it comes. can i keep up with hollywood. No. does that make my 4k camera soon to be obsolete. no. Be happy that we now have a tool that puts most to shame.
 
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