Scarlet update in mid-May

[Rick Burnett]

Not exactly true because as I understand it the Epic uses that same firmware to control Nikon and Canon lenses as the Scarlet Cinema will.

So with the mounts now being completely tested and working as stated about a week ago, I could imagine this story to have some form of validity.

But the complexity of the fixed is not adding something that the Epic doesn't already know how to deal with either, AND, I am SURE the people doing the mechanical engineering on the fixed lens are not the same people as who are doing the software development. The fixed lens will essentially have mostly the same parameters to control as the other cameras, with one simplicity, it will be ONE lens instead of a variety of lens. I'd also say most of the code is going to be exactly the same with the difference being how the values are default ramped (which is true of all the lens).

I see the differences being;

1) The mappability of the ring on the fixed lens to whatever parameter you want to control.

2) The control of the build in ND filters

Other than those two things, every other programming task would be required of all the other cameras as well.

I really don't see this as the complexity that is going to take the most time. Things like autofocus, touch to focus, those are where I can see the most time taking. Once the firmware is done for the Epic, both the fixed and 2/3 are going to come out in no time. I don't see why the software wouldn't be done at the same time really.

 

[Lawrence Bansbach]

I don't think that is obvious. And I also don't think it is true. The cinema model controls canon and nikon lenses with interchangeable mounts. I would think the software for the Cinema would be a little more complex to make sure the methods used from a variety of lens work okay with the nikon and the canon mounts.

At least working with the fixed, it is ONE lens therefore pretty straightforward.

True, but for the fixed to work properly, the software would have to work, since it's largely controlled electronically. The Cinema could even be released without much in the way of electronic lens control, as plenty of old glass wouldn't require it. The code to control more modern lenses could probably be added via firmware as it becomes available. As long as Red makes that clear to would-be Cinema owners, I don't see a problem with a phased-in approach.

 

[Rick Burnett]

True, but for the fixed to work properly, the software would have to work, since it's largely controlled electronically. The Cinema could even be released without much in the way of electronic lens control, as plenty of old glass wouldn't require it. The code to control more modern lenses could probably be added via firmware as it becomes available. As long as Red makes that clear to would-be Cinema owners, I don't see a problem with a phased-in approach.

It was my understanding they weren't going to go this route anymore. I'd prefer to get a product where all the major operations were complete and not have to wait for firmware for things that should be there in the beginning.

For instance ALL my Canon glass and half my Nikon glass have no aperture control. These will require electronic control always. Given the amount of work that it sounds like is going into the focus and touch screen capabilities, it sounds like they are releasing a FULL featured camera with all the bells and whistles they've announced. I prefer this release path myself.

 

[Subhadip Sen]

Unlike the One and Epic, Scarlet will be mass-produced. I don't think the approach would work for Scarlet at all. Sure, there will be constant firmware upgrades, but they must ensure that the camera is stable and feature-complete right off the shelves.

If the Scarlet were to follow a "phased-in approach", probably many of us would be playing with it already.

 

[Lawrence Bansbach]

It was my understanding they weren't going to go this route anymore. I'd prefer to get a product where all the major operations were complete and not have to wait for firmware for things that should be there in the beginning.

I'm sorry, I should've said that I don't know what their approach will be. You may be right. But releasing the Cinema only with all the lens-control profiles completed could delay release. But I'm guessing.

For instance ALL my Canon glass and half my Nikon glass have no aperture control. These will require electronic control always. Given the amount of work that it sounds like is going into the focus and touch screen capabilities, it sounds like they are releasing a FULL featured camera with all the bells and whistles they've announced. I prefer this release path myself.

But the touch-screen controls will work only with electronically controlled lenses. There are a lot of people (like David Rasberry) who have collected older glass. If the Cinema could be released by a certain date without all the electronic controls or, say, two months later with them, wouldn't it be better to have it sooner even if some (maybe even many) lenses couldn't be used at first? In other words, for those two months either a partial solution for you (and a complete solution for others) or nothing at all.

Again, I don't know any details, so you may be right.

 

[Lawrence Bansbach]

Unlike the One and Epic, Scarlet will be mass-produced. I don't think the approach would work for Scarlet at all. Sure, there will be constant firmware upgrades, but they must ensure that the camera is stable and feature-complete right off the shelves.

If the Scarlet were to follow a "phased-in approach", probably many of us would be playing with it already.

The fixed Scarlet is more that "commodity" camera. With the Cinema, with all the lens possibilities out there, there are more variables to contend with. But again, you may be right.

 

[Rick Burnett]

I'd say no, I would not want them to release the Cinema until all the operations were functional because not all problems can always be fixed with firmware. Given, as mentioned, they are going to be mass produced, getting everything functioning BEFORE full production is important. If anything is currently in the process of being mass produced, I am SURE they've tested all the hard stuff already.

Most of the work is probably in the interface design, the human factors, and getting in those parts for what all the cameras will use. In all UI design I've worked on, that's always been the hardest part. The menus, what the menus functions, the nesting, the actual controls used to change parameters.

While many people would be okay if the automatic controls weren't in there, a lot of other people would be complaining that the camera is not finished.

 

[Jeffrey T. Morgan]

Lawrence, I actually empathize with your point, but think that Red should be careful with their image. There is a bit of a bad opinion of Red, mostly with those who don't know what they are talking about, but its also founded in the opinions people formed with early release problems. I hear these things all the time when getting producers to think about Red, then some random person who is not a camera person who heard someone else talk about the one problem they had that one time says "Red Effing sucks" and the producers get nervous. No matter how much you try to be calm and factual.

I think Red should be careful this time around, and release something that just FLIES from the get go. Because they deserve all the success they can have.

Even if these cameras are red 2.0 and 3.0, the release will be watched closely by naysayers, too.

.......... that said, i would gladly use a prototype Scarlet and find work arounds while waiting for firmware updates, lol.

Jeff

 

[Lawrence Bansbach]

While many people would be okay if the automatic controls weren't in there, a lot of other people would be complaining that the camera is not finished.

That was my question. And, again, you're probably right that the Cinema will be released only after all the lens-control stuff is finished. But in a sense I hope that the 2/3-inch Scarlets are never finished -- that, virtually flawless upon release, they are always work-in-progress, improved with every (not infrequent) firmware update.

 

[Rick Burnett]

That was my question. And, again, you're probably right that the Cinema will be released only after all the lens-control stuff is finished. But in a sense I hope that the 2/3-inch Scarlets are never finished -- that, virtually flawless upon release, they are always work-in-progress, improved with every (not infrequent) firmware update.

On that aspect I do hope as well. In other words, they are released with all the bells and whistles we expect now, but then, down the road they continue to add features.

In the music work, the company Access does this with their Virus TI synthesizers. I bought one I think 4 years ago and they are STILL releasing new versions of the OS with HUGE additions to the synth. It is awesome and makes me ready to buy their hardware HANDS down. If I had to pick ONE synth to keep, it would be it as it is supported so well.

I cannot imagine RED not following this in the camera world either, as it appears they have a track record for doing this already. Add to that their open API with working with the camera from a computer or possibly other hardware that can talk through the network connections (not sure if it works through other interfaces), it becomes more than just a camera, but a system that can be augmented.

I am a programmer. This excites me to NO end.

 

[Andjelko Novosel]

"Scarlet update in mid-May"

Can somebody specify year?

 

[Dave Barak]

"Scarlet update in mid-May"

Can somebody specify year?

Ne...




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