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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Scarlet PC support

karapetkov said:
I think they eventually will enable PC support.

They have to, cause it's too much folk.

If we could edit with the QT proxies in Premiere too, it'd be very nice :).
Click to expand...

yes, times like this with all those choices out there, PC is a huge market just like the other one.
 
Once the SDK from RED is released Cineform will offer a conversion. This will allow for PC applications such as Sony Vegas 8b.
 
oh, no, not again.....no conversion, no transcoding, we want a workflow just like
the MXF workflow, copy, paste, edit.period
 
killfilm said:
oh, no, not again.....no conversion, no transcoding, we want a workflow just like
the MXF workflow, copy, paste, edit.period
Click to expand...

You don't get it. In order to shoot RAW you have to do conversion. RAW is a format just like the negative on film. It has to be processed to become something, before that it's a picture with as much information as it possibly can give you, therefor it's grey and dull. It's grey and dull because it contains as many values as possible for you to pull from. All variables are there. Think of it as the color white - it seems boring but it's white because all the colors are in there.

So RAW has to be processed in order for you to get something out of it. Shoot with a RAW Digital Stills camera and you'll understand. The pics you get in the LCD are jpegs - they're preview for you to look at, but they're only an approximation of what the image could be (just like the quicktime proxy files with RED, those are RED's preview). Then you take the RAW file to Photoshop or similar to make something of it - then the format is your choice, jpeg or tiff or whatever.

It's the same with redcode RAW. These are digital cinema cameras with the emphasize on CINEMA. They're not video where the compression is made in camera (of course there's a certain compression in redcode but only in it's native format).

To ask for anything else would defy it's purpose.

Fredrik Callinggard
 
RED will [hopefullly] release their QT component for Windows around the same time their SDK is done. This will allow the same level of native-QT access to the media that currently exists in OS X. How your NLE will work with that will depend on the NLE. In the case of FCP it utilises the QT component to provide direct and immediate access to the media. In the case of Avid, the file is converted to an Avid codec on import (with new media created) which will take a length of time (but can be batch processed). With other applications, I'm not sure. But essentially if it supports Quicktime it will be able to access the fast-debayer down-res QT RED proxies.

If you want better image quality you will still have to transcode/convert as you do currently in OS X. With the SDK companies like Cineform will be able to streamline that conversion process with direct access to the RED data, the options will expand.
 
weirdcrew said:
You don't get it. In order to shoot RAW you have to do conversion. RAW is a format just like the negative on film. It has to be processed to become something, before that it's a picture with as much information as it possibly can give you, therefor it's grey and dull. It's grey and dull because it contains as many values as possible for you to pull from. All variables are there. Think of it as the color white - it seems boring but it's white because all the colors are in there.

So RAW has to be processed in order for you to get something out of it. Shoot with a RAW Digital Stills camera and you'll understand. The pics you get in the LCD are jpegs - they're preview for you to look at, but they're only an approximation of what the image could be (just like the quicktime proxy files with RED, those are RED's preview). Then you take the RAW file to Photoshop or similar to make something of it - then the format is your choice, jpeg or tiff or whatever.

It's the same with redcode RAW. These are digital cinema cameras with the emphasize on CINEMA. They're not video where the compression is made in camera (of course there's a certain compression in redcode but only in it's native format).

To ask for anything else would defy it's purpose.

Fredrik Callinggard
Click to expand...

i understand you fredrik, i shot RAW photos before, here this is what i mean

http://www.red.com/red_mythbusters

on that same page it says "Drop 4K files directly into Final Cut Pro
No rendering, no transcoding"

thats what im talking about, is that you can drop those files into an app that SUPPORTS that format, just like MXF in premiere or vegas, you can directly import the RAW footage.

thanks
 
killfilm said:
on that same page it says "Drop 4K files directly into Final Cut Pro
No rendering, no transcoding"

thats what im talking about, is that you can drop those files into an app that SUPPORTS that format, just like MXF in premiere or vegas, you can directly import the RAW footage.
Click to expand...

No, it doesn't. It supports the QT component available form RED that allows QT-aware applications direct access to a fast-debayered lower-resolution proxy version of the RED media. FCP has no access to the direct RAW data.
 
killfilm said:
i understand you fredrik, i shot RAW photos before, here this is what i mean

http://www.red.com/red_mythbusters

on that same page it says "Drop 4K files directly into Final Cut Pro
No rendering, no transcoding"

thats what im talking about, is that you can drop those files into an app that SUPPORTS that format, just like MXF in premiere or vegas, you can directly import the RAW footage.

thanks
Click to expand...

Yes and it does work and it will for you to. Just understand that they're not importing the RAW files, they're importing the proxies.

I don't understand what your whining about? Is it that you want it to go your workflow route?

It will have workflows but you are going to have to adapt one way or another, cause you're not shooting Mpeg/ DV anymore and for that you should be happy.

As said, get that kool Aid and relax there's at least one year if not two, before you have that camera in you hand.


regards,


Fredrik
 
weirdcrew said:
Yes and it does work and it will for you to. Just understand that they're not importing the RAW files, they're importing the proxies.

I don't understand what your whining about? Is it that you want it to go your workflow route?

It will have workflows but you are going to have to adapt one way or another, cause you're not shooting Mpeg/ DV anymore and for that you should be happy.

As said, get that kool Aid and relax there's at least one year if not two, before you have that camera in you hand.


regards,


Fredrik
Click to expand...

i dont like kool aid, i like pepsi, not coke though

anyways, as you may know there's an Apple/Red deal thats been there since day one and we hope that this deal aint applicable to the scarlet too.
Even with cineform, you have to transcode, and if we still alive by the time the scarlet is out, then the format would have matured. I know they're using proxies for final cut, but again, there's no conversion and no transcoding, any CCing, white balance etc changed in Red Cine will automatically update in FCP. Now thats a workflow.
 
killfilm said:
i dont like kool aid, i like pepsi, not coke though

anyways, as you may know there's an Apple/Red deal thats been there since day one and we hope that this deal aint applicable to the scarlet too.
Even with cineform, you have to transcode, and if we still alive by the time the scarlet is out, then the format would have matured. I know they're using proxies for final cut, but again, there's no conversion and no transcoding, any CCing, white balance etc changed in Red Cine will automatically update in FCP. Now thats a workflow.
Click to expand...

Now if you had done your homework and searched as you've been told. You would find that the agreement should have been ended long ago. That they probably will release the SDK for the redcode any day now. That the only reason the codec is still with RED is that (this is speculation) Apple wants more time to finish their native support for it.
Now this is something that doesn't benefit RED anymore so I bet you they want to release it and the truth is that all the "others" are already prepared (this is also speculation) and are simply sitting on finished products.

The probability that it takes no time for native redcode support to be up and running as soon as it's released is strong. They're just waiting for the go.

Understand that this is politics and that takes time.

Fredrik
 
alright crew, no sense of us repeating our selves, Jim and RED know whats best for the huge market. Will be waiting patiently.
 
killfilm said:
I know they're using proxies for final cut, but again, there's no conversion and no transcoding, any CCing, white balance etc changed in Red Cine will automatically update in FCP. Now thats a workflow.
Click to expand...

No. A limited number of changes you make in RED Alert will be reflected in your FCP sequence (once you rebuild the proxies). The same will be true of any application that uses the QT Component to access file media (although in some cases the file may need to be reloaded - in Avid for example, you'd have to Batch Import the file again, and Avid always creates it's own media - this may change if Avid can make use of the SDK in a way that works for them).
 
hmm, i see, i never been an avid fan, but thats a different topic

i hope this SDK will help all use the apps they wanna use, it'll be sweat not having to worry about using a specific tool just to be able to save time.
 
killfilm said:
hmm, i see, i never been an avid fan, but thats a different topic

i hope this SDK will help all use the apps they wanna use, it'll be sweat not having to worry about using a specific tool just to be able to save time.
Click to expand...

I didn't used to be an Avid fan. Then I learned to use it. Now nothing quite lives up to it for me.

As for the SDK - it'll help a lot, but I think the QT Component will make a bigger impact on the immediate usability of RED in Windows.
 
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