Scarlet now or later?

[chadac]

I was wondering if it's smarter to save up for a Scarlet now or buy another camera (Panasonic HVX200/HPX170) and hold off on buying the Scarlet?

The reason I ask is because I'm afraid of the time it might take for people to accept the Scarlet from a rental perspective. Just like how it took some time for people to accept the Red One.

Thanks.

 

[JanneJansson]

I was wondering if it's smarter to save up for a Scarlet now or buy another camera (Panasonic HVX200/HPX170) and hold off on buying the Scarlet?

Any gear that make you money, is good gear. If a VHS cam would make me some $, I'd use that. Red is just anoter tool, but a gooooood tool

 

[Jason Murphy]

I was wondering if it's smarter to save up for a Scarlet now or buy another camera (Panasonic HVX200/HPX170) and hold off on buying the Scarlet?

The reason I ask is because I'm afraid of the time it might take for people to accept the Scarlet from a rental perspective. Just like how it took some time for people to accept the Red One.

Thanks.

Seems not unlikely that the Scarlet acceptance rate will be significantly faster than the RED One, since, while not universally loved, RED has carved a pretty decent niche for itself in many areas of the industry within the past year and a half. Also, the Scarlet will piggyback off all the RED One's workflow developments, which many people saw as the real hindrance to working with RED. And while some people may still have problems with the workflow, things only seem to be improving in that regard.

As to whether or not you should buy a camera now or wait for the Scarlet, depends on what work you need to do between now and then. The Scarlet will almost definitely produce significantly better quality images than either of the above cameras. The workflow is probably going to be more complicated though, so it really depends on your work and needs.

 

[David W. Jones]

I was wondering if it's smarter to save up for a Scarlet now or buy another camera (Panasonic HVX200/HPX170) and hold off on buying the Scarlet?

The reason I ask is because I'm afraid of the time it might take for people to accept the Scarlet from a rental perspective. Just like how it took some time for people to accept the Red One.

Thanks.

From a rental perspective... I would stock what my customers are asking for.
Do you have people calling you up asking if you stock a particular camera?

 

[Liam Hall]

I was wondering if it's smarter to save up for a Scarlet now or buy another camera (Panasonic HVX200/HPX170) and hold off on buying the Scarlet?

The reason I ask is because I'm afraid of the time it might take for people to accept the Scarlet from a rental perspective. Just like how it took some time for people to accept the Red One.

Thanks.

If you're having to save up for Scarlet you're not in the rental market.

 

[Zachary Marsh]

I had the same question but ended up finding an amazing deal online for an HVX package that I'm using to make money to purchase a Scarlet. The kit came with a camera, tripod (heavy duty tripod too, they didn't know what they were shopping for, thankfully some rich people don't care and just want the best for some reason!), extra P2 cards, microphone, boom pole, shoulder mounting for the HVX, and they had all the original packaging and the receipt. Everything for about $5k.

So now I have all I need when I do upgrade to a Scarlet, and I'm already taking on projects now that I wouldn't have been able to before.

Just like it was said earlier, it depends on if you need projects NOW or if you can wait. Also, JVC is releasing a new camera, the GY-HM100 next month. That's another /now/ option as it's in theory cheaper and better than the HVX -- and you won't be paying $800+ for the memory cards, only $50-$100 which is way better. And it shoots to .mov files so if you're editing with Final Cut it's an option...

But to also reiterate what someone else said, the Scarlet will blow any of these camera's away so if you can wait, then do.

Peace!

 

[RonLeibfreid]

I was wondering if it's smarter to save up for a Scarlet now or buy another camera (Panasonic HVX200/HPX170) and hold off on buying the Scarlet?

The reason I ask is because I'm afraid of the time it might take for people to accept the Scarlet from a rental perspective. Just like how it took some time for people to accept the Red One.

Thanks.

Don't forget to save up for a computer that can handle the files. Apropos your thoughts about rental... you might want to build a "ruggedized" editing computer and rent that along with the RED.

 

[PatC]

get an ex1. Capable of great images and you can get one right now.

 

[Daniel Browning]

I was wondering if it's smarter to save up for a Scarlet now or buy another camera?

I could understand the question if Scarlet was several days away. Or maybe 1-2 weeks.

But 6 months?

The whole idea is just foreign to me.

Fast forward 6 months. Scarlet came out, but Scarlet Mark II is just 12 months away. If you don't need a camera for 12 more months, then you should wait for Scarlet Mark II. If you need a camera, buy one now.

Same with computers or anything else that has advancing technology / depreciation.

If you need one, buy one.
If you don't need one, don't buy one.

 

[Edwin T Merrick V]

I could understand the question if Scarlet was several days away. Or maybe 1-2 weeks.

But 6 months?

The whole idea is just foreign to me.

Fast forward 6 months. Scarlet came out, but Scarlet Mark II is just 12 months away. If you don't need a camera for 12 more months, then you should wait for Scarlet Mark II. If you need a camera, buy one now.

Same with computers or anything else that has advancing technology / depreciation.

If you need one, buy one.
If you don't need one, don't buy one.

I thought that the whole *modular* concept of SCARLET/RED cameras was to combat that poor (for the consumer) business model. When the "Mark II" comes out and you just have to have it, then you buy the Mark II brain and switch it out with the "Mark I", ready to go -- but this time you don't have to buy anything else to finish your camera's build. In fact, you could upgrade the rest of the camera too!

 

[Joseph Hutson]

I thought that the whole *modular* concept of SCARLET/RED cameras was to combat that poor (for the consumer) business model. When the "Mark II" comes out and you just have to have it, then you buy the Mark II brain and switch it out with the "Mark I", ready to go -- but this time you don't have to buy anything else to finish your camera's build. In fact, you could upgrade the rest of the camera too!

Correct.

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

It is the concept. But if you replace the brain you're still going to be out another 3-10k.

That's about 80% of the cost of the camera. And by then you'll probably want some fancy new CF Card replacement. And you'll want the new 4k viewfinder. And you'll want the new Dilithium power pack. And you'll want the new wireless I/O module. And you'll want the new...

RED might be doing the honorable thing by trying to not force you to upgrade. But that's not to say you won't be completely replacing the camera every 2 years.

I think the Scarlett Monstro is going to be 'good enough' for a very very very long time. It'll be the first digital camera I buy. But I also fully expect that within 2 years I'll probably have completely replaced it with a new 18 stop starlight sensor that saves to a 1TB microSD card.

 

[Zakaree Sandberg]

If you're having to save up for Scarlet you're not in the rental market.

agree'd

I keep telling people.. DONT buy a scarlet if your expecting to rent it..

it wont happen. not for any good amount of money at least.

red one's are a dime a dozen.. scarlets will be a dime a hundred

 

[J Davis]

But if you replace the brain you're still going to be out another 3-10k.

That's about 80% of the cost of the camera.

what makes you think this?

EDIT:
I say this because a red one body at $17.500 is about half of the $35k needed to get a
regular working red one camera package together. By separating the body into sensor, mount, IO etc
we minimize the module that depreciates the fastest – ie the brain


2nd EDIT
for example - I am budgeting $6000 for a working 2/3 cinema of which the $2500 cost of the brain
makes up 40%. I don't think this is an unreasonable projected estimate. (only one mini prime)

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

If you include lenses, support gear, rods, matte boxes... then we aren't talking about obsolete. That stuff never went obsolete before in the past either.

RED is saying their cameras are future proof because you can replace a brain. Which is true but the brain is the most significant cost. It may depreciate the fastest, but it's also the most expensive component.

We don't have real prices yet but if you spend $6k on a brain you'll probably spend another $6k on modules. If you spend $10k on a brain you'll probably spend $6k on modules. If you spend $23k on a brain you'll probably spend $6k on modules.

Now if you don't want to upgrade the sensor or get faster frame rates you DO save a lot of money with the module system because then you can buy a new recording block without having to rebuy the sensor.

The Sensor/Brain is the most expensive part. So if you want to upgrade that... then you're probably also upgrading the package.

If you include support gear then you could also say. "A F23 only costs $150,000 where as all of the support gear and lights can add up to a million. So it's only a small part of the kit."

I totally dig the modular nature of the camera. I don't think it'll be saving me any money since I only intend to buy one brain. My point is that upgrading the sensor by buying a new brain is not saving you a ton of money compared to previous systems.

In fact if you look at something like an F23: The recording system is modular. The VF or LCD is modular. The power system is largely modular. The F23 is almost as much just a Brain as the RED. But replacing the F23 with something new is going to be very expensive. And if you replaced the F23 with a new 4k F46 then you'll probably want a better recording system, monitoring solution etc etc etc..

Even if your FX1 was modular do you really want to use its HDV tape drive?