Scarlet ergonomics

[Jaime Vallés]

First off, I think what you're planning to do with Scarlet is fantastic, at an unheard-of price. I'm definitely sold. Just wanted to discuss some of the aspects of the ergonomics of this little miracle-cam, since you're all still in prototype mode.

The Lens:
It doesn't bother me that it's non-removable. If that's what it needs to be to maintain a $3000 price tag, so be it. I'm more interested in how it handles in full manual mode.
1) Make it silky smooth, like the 18-85mm zoom for the RED ONE.
2) Witness marks on the lens would be fantastic.
3) Focus, iris & zoom gears (standard 0.8 film pitch) to use a follow-focus.
4) Please, PLEASE include hard stops on the focus ring! Don't let it spin around endlessly once you reach full wide or full telephoto!

Don't let the auto features get in the way of making the lens act like a proper manual lens. The auto stuff is icing on the cake. Basically, if you make the fixed lens look and feel like the Zeiss Ultra 16 lenses (pic attached below) then Scarlet will blow away anything remotely in the same price range.

The Body
Love the size! I'm not entirely sure how I'll hold her, though. Will it have a (removable) strap on the right side, like a handycam? Attaching giant RED ONE handgrips defeats the camera's size advantage. Maybe a small, wooden handgrip, like an Aaton grip?

I was thinking about a shoulder-mount option; sort of like the base production pack for the RED ONE, but this one made specifically for Scarlet. It could have a curved shoulder pad, with a base towards the front where the camera would rest, for easy viewing of the LCD and controls (a camera body that small can't be next to our head, it needs to float in front of us). On the rear of the shoulder pad, you could attach a RED Cradle, for an optional RED Brick (extended battery) and a RED DRIVE or RED FLASH, for longer record times. The added weight on the back would offset the front-heavy nature of a small camera on a shoulder mount. (See attached pic for inspiration)

Sound
Not sure where the XLR inputs are on the mock-up (Jim mentioned 2-channel audio), but it would be nice if there was a place to attach a shotgun mic on top of the camera, like a hot-shoe with phantom power. Also, if there's any way to include manual audio control knobs, instead of just menu-driven audio settings, that would rock. That's one thing Panasonic did really well with the DVX100.

That's the stuff off the top of my head at the moment. Any other ideas, folks? And, again, congrats Team RED for making yet another revolution possible! :biggrin:

 

[xshortx]

Id like to see its form changed to a more common for. I know Red are hardly in the business of making boring standard style cameras but a more traditional shape could make all the difference?

 

[Christopher Grant Harvey]

I like what I see.

 

[Jaime Vallés]

Also, if possible make the image on the LCD able to be flipped upside-down for use with 35mm adapters. The footage doesn't need to be recorded upside-down, just shown that way on the monitor.

This would also mean that you lose less light than with adapters that flip the image for you. Less light loss is always a good thing when dealing with a fixed lens camera.

The setting can be buried deep in some sub-menu, since it's not something that the user would be switching constantly.

I can totally picture a killer Scarlet shoulder-mount 35mm kit that looks like the pic attached (from redrockmicro's website).

 

[John Caballero]

It would be better if flip image was applied to the viewfinder and the footage also with software if possible.

 

[Dallas Zhen]

Those Zeiss Ultra 16 lenses are sexy.

I would imagine just one would be cost more than WHOLE scarlet........

So is MUCH better leave scarlet fixed lens.

 

[Jaime Vallés]

Those Zeiss Ultra 16 lenses are sexy.

I would imagine just one would be cost more than WHOLE scarlet........

So is MUCH better leave scarlet fixed lens.

Agreed. There's a reason Scarlet will have a fixed lens: It only costs $3000!!!!

Speaking of the lens, here are a couple more suggestions:

1) Built-in ND filter wheel between the lens and the sensor. Not sure if the size of the 2/3" chip is too big to accommodate this, but it would seriously rock if at all possible. I use the one on my DVX100 all the time. It's a lifesaver!

2) Incorporate /i metadata. It would be awesome if the recorded footage included all the metadata of the lens settings, like the upcoming Cooke /i tech in the RED ONE. Having that info on every single shot would be incredible!

That's it for now. Keep 'em coming folks!

 

[mick doyle]

I like to look of scarlet and think that it will be a useful camera. I would like to see built in ND filter and the lens to be wide. Hard stops for focus would be great too. I think we have a lot to look forward to and I will be getting at least one, for sure.

 

[Marius V Graan]

I think the lens is too far above the base of the camera, this creates the problem of attaching standard matte-boxes that load trays from the top, and also for close pack type work tilting starts looking more like jibbing when on the wider side of the lens. The camera is near perfect but I think the body should be flipped upside down to keep the lens as close as possible to the tilt axis on the tripod.

As far as the lens goes, I assume that since the red team are already so forward thinking all the rings will have hard stops.

I can't wait, I'm holding my breath for this range of cameras

 

[Jaime Vallés]

Another cool thing would be to have a user setting where one can de-activate ALL controls on the lens (meaning that no matter if you move the focus or zoom rings, the actual focus and zoom don't change). This would help when using 35mm adapters so that one doesn't have to use gaffe tape to hold the focus & zoom rings in place once properly set for the ground glass.

This, plus the upside-down LCD image, would make using 35mm adapters a whole heck of a lot easier!

 

[P Andersson]

The Body
Love the size! I'm not entirely sure how I'll hold her, though. Will it have a (removable) strap on the right side, like a handycam? Attaching giant RED ONE handgrips defeats the camera's size advantage. Maybe a small, wooden handgrip, like an Aaton grip?

Yeah, wouldn't it be great if you could just hold it with a pistol grip like the old super 8 - it seems light enough. Holding my Canon A1 with one grip on the side and adjusting the lens with the other hand always makes my right wrist real tired, if the weight was pushing down from right above it would be a lot easier. Or why not squeeze it a tiny bit flatter and a little bit longer then you can fold your focusing palm under and weigh the camera on there like you do a Hasselblad.

For me, I would love it if it was small like that and you could just take it out of your bag and not have to attach a thing, and it would still be easy to hold in one hand and pull focus and aperture with the other hand.

My feeling is Jim is going this direction since he has been shooting a lot of stills where everything is compact.

Metal body is great, I love the grip you get from the newer Canon and Nikon bodies, you don't have to use a lot of power to get a good hold it kind of sticks to your hand. Like the special rubber on some of the Oakley shades.

 

[Jason Murphy]

One of the major advantages to RED's design philosophy/aesthetic is its modular nature, and I think this has the potential to pay off in a major way for Scarlet (in perhaps both creative and economic senses).

For those who want a real run and gun camera, you can pull the camera out of your pocket, flip open the viewscreen and just start shooting (depending, of course on what the boot time for the camera is). Nothing attached. (The built-in ND mentioned earlier in this thread would likely help a lot here).

An easily bolted-on grip (like the Aaton grip, or a Super 8 style pistol grip, or even perhaps a Hasselblad-style grip) would likely be pretty great. (and if you want to be really hardcore, this seems like it would pretty easy to fly on a Merlin or somesuch).

For those in a situation where significant audio control is needed, but a separate audio recorder is impractical, attach an audio module with full-size XLR inputs and manual controls onto the camera, mount a mic on the top, and go.

In another thread, I already mentioned my desire to see an EVF that would be compatible with the Scarlet, as I still prefer to shoot through a viewfinder than an LCD.

Another potential module could be used to Genlock two Scarlets together for shooting 3D. (Disclaimer: never shot 3D, so not sure if this would work, but seems like a good idea to my 3D-ignorant mind).

Also, a modular control for framerate in order to perform relatively complicated multiple ramps in-shot would be fantastic, particularly if it could communicate with the camera in such a way that it would be able to keep a consistent exposure throughout the shot. (Maybe a dial or a slider - still figuring out how this could be best implemented for multiple subtle framerate changes within a single shot, assuming such a thing is possible on the Scarlet).

And, of course, you could buy a full on production package type thing from RED to pimp out the Scarlet as seen in the NAB brochure.

All this said, it seems likely that there would be a decent market for specialized third party Scarlet modules, assuming that's something RED would want/allow/encourage. All just a thought.