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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Scarlet and Dragon...

Ha. That'd be neat. If the old Scarlet boards could be repurposed in a small $3k/3k consumer camera.

Mark Toia said:
With the price of the EPIC so low now... Why would you even worry about Scarlet sensor upgrade. Just move up to EPIC and get the whole enchilada.

Keep them cheap and simple I say.
Make a pocket Scarlet, discontinue this one.


My two cents worth.
Click to expand...
 
Jannard said:
Of course it makes sense that we will upgrade EPICs to the Dragon sensor before Scarlets. However, we are considering how to upgrade Scarlets to the Dragon.

There are several boards that need to be changed so the upgrade for Scarlet may be a bit more expensive than the upgrade to EPIC..

We are always thinking about our customers... just so you know.

Jim
Click to expand...
Good to know this isn't from the table. I know you find a good solution, so for now, i just sit back, relax and wait for whats coming. I think there is enough speculation going on here, i admit for a while it was fun, i also wrote down ideas and wishes in some other threads, but in the end i just trust you guys that your upgrade-offer will be awesome.

Until then i'll shoot with the great MX-sensor and hopefully play soon with my REDRAY. :)
 
Mark Toia said:
With the price of the EPIC so low now... Why would you even worry about Scarlet sensor upgrade. Just move up to EPIC and get the whole enchilada.

Keep them cheap and simple I say.
Make a pocket Scarlet, discontinue this one.


My two cents worth.
Click to expand...

That is an option we are exploring.. There becomes a point where you need to change so many boards that it doesn't financially make sense anymore for either of us. In Scarlet it's not just a swap of the ASIC and the Sensor, it is memory, IO boards, and a bunch of other things that make it different from an Epic.

That said.. we won't know till we know. The power of the Dragon is a bit difficult to harness... It is definitely living up to it's namesake.
 
I'm definitely ready to trade up to the Epic. Im just looking at the options. The other big factor is how much will an off the shelf epic dragon cost? Perhaps I just squeeze some more work out of the scarlet and then just leap frog to the epic-dragon? So many unknowns right now... But certainly exciting!

Jarred Land said:
That is an option we are working on.. There becomes a point where you need to change so many boards
that it doesn't financially make sense anymore for either of us. In Scarlet it's not just a swap of the ASIC and the Sensor, it is memory, IO boards, and a bunch of other things that make it different from an Epic.

That said.. we won't know till we know. The power of the Dragon is a bit difficult to harness... It is definitely living up to it's namesake.
Click to expand...
 
YEAHHH

man that Epic Dragon will be something

looking forward to 2013 its gonna be a fun work year and watch movies on the big screen

I guess time will tell

whats the first feature to shoot 6K 3D?
 
I would be totally up for that. The Scarlet has allowed me to learn a great deal of info about shooting RED. It's allowed me to meet so many people I would've probably not met otherwise. I think stepping up to the Epic-D would be a huge stepping stone.

The only question is how long after Epic would the Scarlet upgrade be done.

Jarred Land said:
That is an option we are exploring.. There becomes a point where you need to change so many boards that it doesn't financially make sense anymore for either of us. In Scarlet it's not just a swap of the ASIC and the Sensor, it is memory, IO boards, and a bunch of other things that make it different from an Epic.

That said.. we won't know till we know. The power of the Dragon is a bit difficult to harness... It is definitely living up to it's namesake.
Click to expand...
 
I suspect that the upgrade program with run concurrent with epic dragon sales, so people may factor that into their decision. If getting a dragon quickly is important, for those with high numbers on epic or Scarlets, they may want to look at selling what they have and starting fresh. Makes sense. Makes sense that red with be able to offer Epic Dragons before the upgrade program is complete.
 
Michael Dalton said:
I suspect that the upgrade program with run concurrent with epic dragon sales, so people may factor that into their decision. If getting a dragon quickly is important, for those with high numbers on epic or Scarlets, they may want to look at selling what they have and starting fresh. Makes sense. Makes sense that red with be able to offer Epic Dragons before the upgrade program is complete.
Click to expand...

Our existing customers always take priority... but we likely will sell new Epic Dragons at the same time we are doing upgrades as the parts wont be the bottleneck, it will be the upgrade process so selling new cameras will not slow down getting all you guys upgraded.
 
i own a scarlet....in order to get step up to epic i would have to sell the scarlet and make up the difference which is about 14000$ (tax incl.)....add 6000 for dragon makes it 20K....
i bought the scarlet with the promise that there would be a dragon upgrade path for it....i knew that it would be more then 6K and i am ok with that as long as it is under 10K....
i need to be able to pull stills for the footage, so the 6K (at hopefully24fps) is more important to me then 100fps at 5K that epic provides....especially if it saves me 10K....
in a way the price of the epic is in a range now that makes keeping the scarlet make more sense anyway....a backup, a second camera...
but regardless, a dragon scarlet, no matter how much would have to be changed, could still sit very neatly in the red line up.....even if it ends up costing as much as epic, it could provide better resolution, better ISO, better DR, but limited in fps and maybe even compression....and if someone needs 100fps at 5K, they will go with epic and upgrade from that later?

as a still shooter, the promise of a scarlet dragon is THE best reason to actually only shoot with red....making it a true DSMC
 
Jarred Land said:
Our existing customers always take priority... but we likely will sell new Epic Dragons at the same time we are doing upgrades as the parts wont be the bottleneck, it will be the upgrade process so selling new cameras will not slow down getting all you guys upgraded.
Click to expand...

agreed Jarred, your bottleneck will be incoming cameras etc, not sensors. So it is only logical that you'd build new cameras with Dragon. It's good that people know and recognize this so they don't get their panties in a knot. Some can even plan around it as it will make financial sense to get the sensor before their number comes up by selling and buying new.

The fact you guys made an upgradable camera shows that customers come first.
 
Good to know. Thanks for filling in the blanks :) Looking forward to seeing Dragon samples.

Jarred Land said:
Our existing customers always take priority... but we likely will sell new Epic Dragons at the same time we are doing upgrades as the parts wont be the bottleneck, it will be the upgrade process so selling new cameras will not slow down getting all you guys upgraded.
Click to expand...
 
Jarred Land said:
Our existing customers always take priority... but we likely will sell new Epic Dragons at the same time we are doing upgrades as the parts wont be the bottleneck, it will be the upgrade process so selling new cameras will not slow down getting all you guys upgraded.
Click to expand...

I inmediately thought of this. The very second Epic's price was brought down. It actually benefits everyone, because there is strength in numbers. More Epics means everyone benefits.

And I am happy to hear a mini RED is still a thought you guys are willing to entertain. Call it mini or something, a clear label, one that says this is not our film camera. A consumer camera that is so good it can easily be used for 4k television. 0.02
 
Jarred Land said:
That is an option we are exploring.. There becomes a point where you need to change so many boards that it doesn't financially make sense anymore for either of us. In Scarlet it's not just a swap of the ASIC and the Sensor, it is memory, IO boards, and a bunch of other things that make it different from an Epic.

That said.. we won't know till we know. The power of the Dragon is a bit difficult to harness... It is definitely living up to it's namesake.
Click to expand...

Interesting, makes sense. Don't suppose any idea how far into the Epic upgrade program you'll know about scarlets, or if it will be complete?
 
Jarred Land said:
That is an option we are exploring.. There becomes a point where you need to change so many boards that it doesn't financially make sense anymore for either of us. In Scarlet it's not just a swap of the ASIC and the Sensor, it is memory, IO boards, and a bunch of other things that make it different from an Epic.

That said.. we won't know till we know. The power of the Dragon is a bit difficult to harness... It is definitely living up to it's namesake.
Click to expand...

I'd be interested in an upgrade path to Epic-D as well.
 
Jarred Land said:
Our existing customers always take priority... but we likely will sell new Epic Dragons at the same time we are doing upgrades as the parts wont be the bottleneck, it will be the upgrade process so selling new cameras will not slow down getting all you guys upgraded.
Click to expand...
so will the price of epic dragons be?
 
When trying to get my head around time-travels I get confused after a minute - same with Scarlet-Dragon upgrade path.
As much as I'd like my Scarlet to have Dragon, I'm afraid managing all the upgrades might just be inefficient, both time and cost wise?!

Maybe just some kind of upgrade path to Epic, and from there to Epic Dragon?
 
Brandon J.F. said:
You can buy an Epic for $19k right now and upgrade it for $6k so my guess is the price will be the same as what a RED ONE MX went for. $25k.
Click to expand...

on one hand it was mentioned that the dragon upgrade should actually be more then 6k because of unforeseen costs, on the other it might be less because there is no "retrofitting" involved?
would just like to see the official answer....
 
Brandon J.F. said:
You can buy an Epic for $19k right now and upgrade it for $6k so my guess is the price will be the same as what a RED ONE MX went for. $25k.
Click to expand...

Don't forget $19K is an Epic brain only - $22.5K with PL/SSD.

Small difference, but important considering RED's new prices/margins etc.

My gut price points to an Epic-D at $28K & $35K for the version with mechanical shutter* :smile5:

*not that RED have announced such a version... but this would be an interesting move - and create a new top of the range Epic to satisfy renters and as competition for you know what.
 
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