Samsung UN55/65F9000 UHD display design

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Hehe, I know all about backlighting patents. I actually hold one myself that uses fiber optic mesh. Dolby does hold a few patents, but I don't see that being an issue as there are a multitude of approaches. One of which being dynamic contrast adjust both via zone and on a per-pixel basis for full-array LED and OLED backlighting, two patents which are actually held by Samsung. The patent for localized micro-dimming on edge-lighting, or one such patent, is also held by Samsung and they use it on their 8000 and 9000 series HDTV's, including these 4K models. IMO, what this all really comes down to is the economics of panel construction and the push to make displays thinner. It saves considerable weight and thickness at this time to go edge-lit. Edge-lighting has drastically improved over the past couple years and it does a pretty darn good job for most applications, especially on smaller displays. Talking with some of the Samsung engineers about a year ago, I know they all want to get away from edge-lighting, but they said it's going to be the dominant trend for the next few years. OLED backlighting will be coming in soon and will allow for the same thin-ness of display, even thinner in some circumstances, and contrast and brightness can be controlled at the pixel level. Although, it's yet again an intermediate step between current LED systems and a full-on OLED display. The latter of which is currently available at the 55" 1080p size for just under $9K street price.

FWIW, back on the subject of the Samsung 4K. I'm running the REDRAY now in my AV closet, sending 4K over CAT-6 via a GEFEN Toolbox HDBASE-T extender. Works just great, there's probably about 95 feet of CAT-6 in that run. I'm hoping the display will be upgradeable [easily] to HDMI 2.0 like Sony is claiming. I sent the 55" Sony back for a couple reasons, but all things considered, it may have been the slightly nicer display.

 

[Will Holman]

Hehe, I know all about backlighting patents. I actually hold one myself that uses fiber optic mesh. Dolby does hold a few patents, but I don't see that being an issue as there are a multitude of approaches. One of which being dynamic contrast adjust both via zone and on a per-pixel basis for full-array LED and OLED backlighting, two patents which are actually held by Samsung. The patent for localized micro-dimming on edge-lighting, or one such patent, is also held by Samsung and they use it on their 8000 and 9000 series HDTV's, including these 4K models. IMO, what this all really comes down to is the economics of panel construction and the push to make displays thinner. It saves considerable weight and thickness at this time to go edge-lit. Edge-lighting has drastically improved over the past couple years and it does a pretty darn good job for most applications, especially on smaller displays. Talking with some of the Samsung engineers about a year ago, I know they all want to get away from edge-lighting, but they said it's going to be the dominant trend for the next few years. OLED backlighting will be coming in soon and will allow for the same thin-ness of display, even thinner in some circumstances, and contrast and brightness can be controlled at the pixel level. Although, it's yet again an intermediate step between current LED systems and a full-on OLED display. The latter of which is currently available at the 55" 1080p size for just under $9K street price.

FWIW, back on the subject of the Samsung 4K. I'm running the REDRAY now in my AV closet, sending 4K over CAT-6 via a GEFEN Toolbox HDBASE-T extender. Works just great, there's probably about 95 feet of CAT-6 in that run. I'm hoping the display will be upgradeable [easily] to HDMI 2.0 like Sony is claiming. I sent the 55" Sony back for a couple reasons, but all things considered, it may have been the slightly nicer display.

Hey Jeff,
Why is the Sony 55" a slightly nicer display?

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Hey Jeff,
Why is the Sony 55" a slightly nicer display?

Build quality, mostly. The Samsung is a bit on the "cheap" side... Kinda like all their other displays and the speakers are typical crap flat-panel speakers. The Sony seems to be built a little better overall and it had a more well-balanced color palette, especially in terms of the amount of red in the image, right out of the box. The Samsung seems like it will be equal once I get it dialed in, but Sony's "TriLuminous" display may actually be a selling point here.

On the flip side of the coin, the Sony has those butt-ugly Dumbo-ear speakers on the sides. They do sound better than the crap typically built into most TV's these days, but IMO, they still sound like tinny ass-horns. So they're hardly a selling point, more of a deterrent as far as I'm concerned. The Sony display has some compatibility issues at this time. It was finicky about which 4K signals it would accept while I had it here. Worked OK with REDRAY though. It didn't like to work with Sony's own 4K Player (what a Joke that thing is).

All things considered, I do think I like the Samsung display a bit better overall. It also fits in my desired location vs. the Sony that would not fit where I wanted to put it in my newly remodeled office. Damn those side speakers. The Samsung does feel a bit cheaply made and more flimsy, but it's more pleasing to look at once it's hung on the wall. And so far it has digested every 4K source I've fed it -- REDRAY, OPPO and Sony 4K upscaling BluRay players, and secondary desktop out of my HP Z820 via GTX Titan video card.

I have not had access to a converter like the AJA Hi5-4K lately, so have not attempted running the RED Rocket into the Samsung. Not sure if I'll get around to that, but I do plan on connecting a Rocket-X card to it when it arrives.

 

[Sajeeth C.]

Hey Blair,
When you said:

the first gen box at least supports a 4x HDMI 1.4a connection immediately

Were you implying that the TV supports 4K 60p input via 4 1080p60 streams over 4 HDMI 1.4 cables?
Mind sharing where you got that information from? I can't find anything in the manual that says it has such support.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

It does not support multiple combined HDMI inputs for more abilities.

If anyone has any questions about the Samsung UN55F9000 UHD, let me know. I've been playing with it for over a week now. What I'm hoping for most is a very cheap, or possibly free, upgrade to HDMI 2.0. It seems that the Sony 4K panels will all be getting HDMI 2.0 ability as an upgrade. Panels shipping now can do it via firmware, some of the initial production units may need a board swap, but even in the case of a board swap, it's at no additional cost to the customer. Of course, with the price on these 4K displays, I wouldn't dare say that it's coming for "free".

Hoping Samsung offers up something similar...

Other than a few complaints mentioned above, the one real issue I have is with HDMI 1.4 and color at 4K. There is visible banding at 4K due to the restrictive 8bit depth of the 4K input. This has nothing to do with the Samsung and the issue is on the Sony 4K panels and every other 4K display out there taking in 4K via HDMI 1.4 right now...