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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Saddest film scene ... EVER! Watch it!! I DARE YA'!!!! ;D

Brice Ansel said:
I don't think looking deeper into that bit of movie will change anything, what is the point quoting Stanley Kubrick and Clint Eastwood,
those two directors are in another league.
And by the way the strings are so big than you are even not surprise by the "ironic twist" as you call it.
For me it's just an obvious twist to make you cry.
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I don't know that you'd ever get my point. I think you are completely trapped in the idea that cliché=bad.

You don't cite the best directors in order to equate a piece of work with their work, but rather to draw attention to the best examples of craft and art.

This is clearly not the work of a director in the same league as Kubrick and Eastwood, but that doesn't mean you can't be informed by the best directors when looking at it critically. In fact I'd argue that you'd be a fool not to think of the best works when being critical of any work.

Clichés are tools that can be well used. This clip is not the best example of the craft of film making for many reasons, but its use of cliché makes it very effective. I'd argue its more effective than if you struggled to avoid using any clichés at all.

I cited these other directors because they made effective use of cliché, both as story telling tools, and as objects of subversion often both at once.

Just like this film.

As to the obvious strings ... well we are film makers. You should be aware that our job is to know and understand the use of every meretricious artifice of our craft and to be able to deploy whichever suits our story best at the time. My point here is not that we must learn to use and subvert cliché (which is true, but not my point), but rather that we are also much more keenly aware of the use of various tricks of our craft. What is obvious chicanery to us is just a good heart wrenching scene to typical audiences.

The Champ is unlikely to be regarded as fine cinema, but this scene is effective. If you don't believe that read the comments here.

You do want to build effective scenes don't you?
 
Alexander,
I do care building effective scenes,
it's beeing actually more than 20 years I try to do it with more or less success.
Cliche isn't good or bad, it's more what you are doing with wich is important.
Regards
 
Christiane Kubrick (nee Harlan) singing a German folk song to French soldiers at the end of Kubrick's " Paths of Glory".

....There is no contest ....

Brent
 
Nuka Wølk said:
Scientists have now concluded that the following scene is the saddest...EVER!

Out of 250 collected scenes, tested on an audience of 500 people, this following scene got the biggest emotional reaction from the audience - both men and women.
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Scientists are full of hyperbole. Whilst that scene from The Champ is indeed a bit of tear-jerker it's hardly the saddest scene ever in the entire history of film. What other films did he test? I bet Dumbo wasn't on the list or Bambi or Lassie or ET or Silent Running - when Huey and Duey explode at the end... wow....
 
Liam Hall said:
Scientists are full of hyperbole. Whilst that scene from The Champ is indeed a bit of tear-jerker it's hardly the saddest scene ever in the entire history of film.
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Hehe :D Anyone interested in doing the ultimate conclusion of THE saddest scene in the entire history of cinema should probably be aware of this: IMDB lists 1,633,300 titles, let alone those who are not registered in their database (it doesn't say whether the majority of this number are feature films or something else - probably not).

Also remember: The test was about the saddest SCENE out of 250 works - not the saddest movie. No build up - and shown out of context. This, evidently, also sort of becomes a strong testament to the thought that every scene in a narrative, should be able to stand on it's own :)

Liam Hall said:
What other films did he test? I bet Dumbo wasn't on the list or Bambi or Lassie or ET or Silent Running - when Huey and Duey explode at the end... wow....
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...it didn't say. But I'd love to see the list of those 250 titles :)
 
I'm sorry but this is the most depressing scene in movie history:

 
The two saddest films I've ever watched, that made me lose it completely are the japanese animated "Grave of the fireflies" and "Hachiko" with Richard Gere and Jason Alexander. I don't think you could isolate any particular scene and reach the same degree of emotion that comea from watching the whole film.
 
Luis de la Cerda said:
I don't think you could isolate any particular scene and reach the same degree of emotion that comea from watching the whole film.
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If the scene is well written (if it delivers good structured narrative drama), is well directed, well acted and visualized accordingly to the scenes purpose, then I trust it can stand on it's own. That is in most cases the result of good drama and storytelling - basic study of drama tells you this. You roughly construct a scene the same way you construct an entire film.

Of course not every filmmaker are interested in traditional narrative and the "rules" of good drama - and there are many different ways of doing drama well. This doesn't mean that their scenes can not stand on their own, but some simply can't communicate what they are supposed to without the context of the other scenes and sequences around it. ...And then there are of course some films that just wasn't made with any good storytelling skills.

In the end I personally believe that this isn't really any problem at all, as films were always meant to be experienced as a whole. Just because some filmmakers actively and consciously disregard traditional structured storytelling (I recommend though that you study these things before disregarding them), doesn't mean that they don't know what they are doing.

Anyway, I also don't believe that you will get the exact same emotional response if you see a scene out of context - opposed to experiencing it in a complete film and getting all the "extra" information. But that doesn't mean that it can't communicate it's basic purpose! ;)
 
Luis de la Cerda said:
Have you seen any of the two films I posted?
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I haven't seen either them. At some point when I was developing a short, someone recommended GRAVE OF THE FIREFLIES - but I never got around to it though. This is the first time someone has made me aware of HACHIKO. I'll hopefully get to see them sometime :)

Some of my favorite movies come from Asian cinema, South Korea. I just love how some of the Asian filmmakers do some really ballsy and at the same time - very successful stuff with their storytelling. Very inspiring! :)
 
I dunno I think I've seen more emotionally engaging scenes then that but I probably would have been more emotionally connected to the scene if I had seen the rest of the movie and wasn't spending so much time thinking "Hold on, how did he die? Does he have cancer or something?! Explain yourself movie!".
 
Those who try to use science and math to quantify or pigeon hole emotional or artistic endeavors are completely missing the boat.

"When you have a hammer everything looks like a nail." comes to mind... Hey is that a cliche, a truism or both? ;-)
 
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Craig W. Bickerstaff said:
I dunno I think I've seen more emotionally engaging scenes then that but I probably would have been more emotionally connected to the scene if I had seen the rest of the movie and wasn't spending so much time thinking "Hold on, how did he die? Does he have cancer or something?! Explain yourself movie!".
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Easy - Cause of death: Boxing. Look it up - it happened plenty ;)
 
Scott Crawley said:
Those who try to use science and math to quantify or pigeon hole emotional or artistic endeavors are completely missing the boat.

"When you have a hammer everything looks like a nail." comes to mind... Hey is that a cliche, a truism or both? ;-)
Click to expand...

Agree. I just found it funny and interesting enough to share. Tests and numbers aside - it's all very subjective of course.

But the scene is still interesting for it's emotional impact on some people and the way it made the majority of people react :)

In itself, I actually found the scene very manipulative, to the point where I was very aware of it's mechanics. As if it almost demands and violates one to react before moving on - and in most cases it seems to work, haha :D

Personally, I prefer a little more "elegant" approach. I find that if you in most cases are respectful to your audience, they will give themselves over to the film, eventually leaving them engaged, trusting and vulnerable - and I believe that could result in the same level of engagement as in this case, but without feeling forced and violated :)

I must admit, I haven't seen the entire film, so maybe I'm completely wrong. Maybe it starts out as I mentioned above and when the audience is the most engaged, trusting and vulnerable - maybe that's when this scene was introduced? We all know Italians are born seducers, right? So for the director, Franco Zeffirelli, that would probably be his natural storytelling approach, hehe ;)
 
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