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S35 Sensor (Epic X) and Nikon DX lenses crop

A

Alexander Alexandrov

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As I understand Nikon DX sensor is approx. 24×16 mm which is ~ 28.84 mm diagonal
RED One Sensor is 24.4x13.7mm, which is 27.98mm diagonal

now: S35 (Epic X) sensor is 30x15mm which is ~33.54 mm diagonal

so, nikon DX lenses will not cover Epic X S35 sensors and thus wont work for (Epic X) S35 sensor, correct?
 
It may not. If the S35 sensor is active edge-to-edge and DX lenses EXACTLY cover 28.84 without any extra leeway.

But we know the active area of the S35 sensor won't be 30x15 (Evin Grant guesstimated once that the active area was closer to 27.7x14.7 and Jim said he was pretty close) and I'd be surprised if the DX lenses didn't offer even a touch of leeway.

So maybe they will
 
Alexander Alexandrov said:
As I understand Nikon DX sensor is approx. 24×16 mm which is ~ 28.84 mm diagonal
RED One Sensor is 24.4x13.7mm, which is 27.98mm diagonal

now: S35 (Epic X) sensor is 30x15mm which is ~33.54 mm diagonal

so, nikon DX lenses will not cover S35 sensors and thus wont work for S35 sensor, correct?
Click to expand...

Just to be clear, "Super-35" is not 30x15mm.

The RED ONE sensor is Super-35 more or less (and a 4K recording uses slightly less than Super-35), and so is the Nikon APS-C sensor, but the upcoming Mysterium-X sensor is larger than Super-35.

A 3-perf 35mm cine frame, Full Aperture (3-perf Super-35) is 24.89mm x 13.87mm -- very similar to the RED ONE Mysterium sensor in size.

But 30mm x 15mm is larger than Super-35. But not as large as Full-Frame 35mm (36mm x 24mm). It's an inbetween size.

Now some Super-35 lenses will cover that larger area and some will not (usually it's the wider-angle ones you have to worry about.)
 
dont forget about look around area guys..

and if your going into this level of detail ( fractions of a mm ), you need to remember when your doing M-X calculations your using the rounded-up 30x15mm numbers by comparison so it's not going to be as accurate.
 
I see why people are confused, as well as myself:
http://www.red.com/epic_scarlet/

RED is calling their larger-than-S35 30x15mm Mysterium-X sensor "S35" and they are calling their S35-sized Mysterium sensor "RED ONE".

So after all that debate we had about what to name the larger Mysterium-X size, RED decided to call it "S35" and call the RED ONE sensor something else, even though it is actually S35 in size?

So now "Super-35" has become 30x15mm, and the actual Super-35 size is now called "RED ONE"? And "RED ONE" is now the name of a sensor size between 2/3" and S35?

And now a bunch of lenses we normally say "cover Super-35" may not actually cover RED's "Super-35" sensor?
 
funny post Mullen.. funny post.. ehehehehe

edit
any proposals for the baptism? :thumbsup:
 
Jarred Land said:
dont forget about look around area guys..

and if your going into this level of detail ( fractions of a mm ), you need to remember when your doing M-X calculations your using the rounded-up 30x15mm numbers by comparison so it's not going to be as accurate.
Click to expand...

Well like with everything else it's fun to speculate until you guys finalize and announce the details.

Actually the speculating is probably more fun than discussing the real thing once it appears.
 
Yup.. speculation is good.. it's not fair to ask you not to speculate if we don't give you all the answers...

As David post clearly shows, things change, keep changing, and will most likely always change in the future.

Definitions, specifications, sizes and standards that we all thought were solid a month ago, a week ago, or even a day ago, change. We don't let legacy slow us down at RED.

We don't let things that we said, printed, or posted in the past dictate or restrict new ideas. I know it's hard for some to come along for the ride. It frustrates people that demand normalcy.

I do sincerely apologize for that frustration, but I do not apologize for the way we execute our evolution.
 
Indeed an exhilirating ride -- frustrations not withstanding -- and the end users/viewers the beneficiaries! Besides, without the changes, think of the loss of all the pleasant hours laid to waste in speculating...
 
Thanks guys for understanding... its an important part of this "open" development approach.

Too many posts like " You guys said this here, then that there, What's wrong with you guys!!!!! " can get a little depressing on our side. We take it though, because just like you accept a little frustration so must we. It is a two way street.

The good news is the changes usually are for the better. Sometimes they are not, and sometimes we just don't have time to update stuff along the way.
 
do not need to apologize
 
While it is true that our (about) 30x15mm sensor is super-sized S35, please note that industry standard S35 is inside the sensor and you have access to it at all times. You also have access to standard (motion) 35mm, S16, Micro four-thirds, 16mm, 2/3" and Super 8.

If you want maximum resolution out of this sensor, you can use RPP's, Master Primes and all sorts of FF35mm and lots of other lenses. There are not many (if any) systems that give you the flexibility of this new system. You just have to learn new stuff to use all the options. And options are a good thing in our book.

Jim
 
Jarred Land said:
Definitions, specifications, sizes and standards that we all thought were solid a month ago, a week ago, or even a day ago, change. We don't let legacy slow us down at RED.
Click to expand...

this is the way to operate and break new grounds. what RED is doing and has already done is revolutionary.
 
All I'm saying is that it is confusing when you use a standard term like "Super-35" in a non-standard way. Look at how I fumbled answering the original question because I didn't know RED decided that the larger Mysterium-X sensor would be called "S35". When someone asks a question like "does this lens cover Super-35?" now that answer might be "It covers normal S35 except it might not cover RED's S35."
 
How about SS35?

Jim
 
I agree with David Mullen. It would certainly ease confusion to refer to the new format with a new name, not using another format's name and then saying, "well, you know, that other format is inside this one, so it's OK"
We all know that Red's specs change, and usually for the better. I think what is being expressed here is the desire for a new and changing format to have its own name.
Jumbo-35?
Max-35?
Ultra-35?
Titan-35?
H35 (Herculean?)
Mondo-35?
Crank up the grill at Red headquarters, mix up a few margaritas, and have all the employees brainstorm... I'm sure a new and creative name will pop out...
Cheers,
Harry
 
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