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Rent Rates - your opinions

Jonas Nyström

Jonas Nyström

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What could be a fair rate for, let's say a basic RED package with with the 18-50 zoom?
 
I think that if you include a real tripod and head, the on board monitor and EVF, the basic package should be about 900 a day. Every thing else a-la-carte. A red one and 18-50 costs a little less than an hdx900 and an hd lens, so thats actually kind of generous at 900.

Thats just my opinion. But based on math, thats what they should go for.

Nick
 
Sounds way to low for me. For Example a HDW-750p Filmkit goes for 1300 a day here in Sweden. A HDW-F900R "24p" Filmkit goes for 1650 a day. And it is 2/3 chip cameras...
 
I think fair rates should be based on location, what is offered with the rental package, etc.

I don't think there's a set rate, nor should there be.
 
Industry standards are usually 2% of the cost of the kit, not based on whether one camera is "better" than another.
 
When we have decided the rates here on the forum, that's it!!!! ;-)

Of course it can't be a set rate, just want o hear your opinion as a direction. Offered package in this thread for the discussion is a "basic package".
 
Good question & good answer... I was wondering the same thing and digging around online and have seen rental rates all over the place from $900 to $1600 per day for this same basic package.

I personally am Only going to rent my RED package out with a trained tech. I've got many professional shooter friends that want to rent it but it's not like handing off an ENG camera or Film camera... There seems to be several nuances about the system that requires a knowledgeable tech on site.

I'm thinking of a package for $1600 you get the camera, tripod, 2 drives, EVF, LCD, Cooke 18-100, matte box, follow focus, plenty of power etc. Macbook Pro and my tech to setup the camera / break it down oversee answer any and all technical questions about the RED system and be able to check the drives and back them up on the macbook.

Figure $400 for my tech and $1200 towards paying back my gear. Seems to be the safest bet that I can figure to make sure all shoots go smoothly and the gear is handled with care.

It's not worth it for me to rent it out and the gear gets banged up & or you get a call and hear that a $20,000 shoot (talent, location, etc.) is in the toilet because they didn't have the camera on the right settings or something. Mysterious Infrared glow, etc.

Let me know anyone if this sounds unreasonable. May sound cheap to some but really the only people I rent to are shooter friends of mine that give me volume of rentals at this rate.

I have a PD-1 Dolly & track coming next week that I'll rent with it for an additional cost... I'll let you know how it works. I look at it as an expense set of Tripod Legs that I can easily move this 47lb RED rig up and down without 2-3 sets of hands wrestling a tripod every time that I want to change the shot.
 
Jim Exton said:
Industry standards are usually 2% of the cost of the kit, not based on whether one camera is "better" than another.
Click to expand...

Ergo 660 a day for a RED, haven't seen that yet...

And your cam is far better ;-)
 
Russell Fogle said:
Good question & good answer... I was wondering the same thing and digging around online and have seen rental rates all over the place from $900 to $1600 per day for this same basic package.

I personally am Only going to rent my RED package out with a trained tech. I've got many professional shooter friends that want to rent it but it's not like handing off an ENG camera or Film camera... There seems to be several nuances about the system that requires a knowledgeable tech on site.

I'm thinking of a package for $1600 you get the camera, tripod, 2 drives, EVF, LCD, Cooke 18-100, matte box, follow focus, plenty of power etc. Macbook Pro and my tech to setup the camera / break it down oversee answer any and all technical questions about the RED system and be able to check the drives and back them up on the macbook.

Figure $400 for my tech and $1200 towards paying back my gear. Seems to be the safest bet that I can figure to make sure all shoots go smoothly and the gear is handled with care.

It's not worth it for me to rent it out and the gear gets banged up & or you get a call and hear that a $20,000 shoot (talent, location, etc.) is in the toilet because they didn't have the camera on the right settings or something. Mysterious Infrared glow, etc.

Let me know anyone if this sounds unreasonable. May sound cheap to some but really the only people I rent to are shooter friends of mine that give me volume of rentals at this rate.

I have a PD-1 Dolly & track coming next week that I'll rent with it for an additional cost... I'll let you know how it works. I look at it as an expense set of Tripod Legs that I can easily move this 47lb RED rig up and down without 2-3 sets of hands wrestling a tripod every time that I want to change the shot.
Click to expand...

IMHO is 1600 absolutely fair (could be a little biased opinion though).
 
Pretty much what Russel Fogle is saying + tech.

Maybe the tech want more...?
 
If you don't mind me asking rgd have you had many rentals and were the people renting the gear able to fully figure out this new system and work it properly?

I just feel like this camera hasn't been out long enough for the general shooting community to know it well enough & pick it up and start using it without some kind of hiccup.
 
kowboy said:
I think fair rates should be based on location, what is offered with the rental package, etc.

I don't think there's a set rate, nor should there be.
Click to expand...
__________________________________________
Agreed Kowboy,

In my location there are going to be a really large number of owners, which include DPs, ACs, producers, you name it. So the body kit, even the basic package with Red lenses (only) is going to be very common here. And the ROI breakeven point just doesn't make high pricing a fair or sustainable thing in my specific market.

These are my firm pre-discounted kit offerings:

http://www.chatercamera.com/4k_Red_Camera.htm#

Ultra Primes, Super Speeds, Arri Shift Tilts, Cooke 18-100mm, Optimo 24-290mm, Arri MB14, Arri MB20, Arri FF4, OConnor 2060, OConnor 2575, etc would all be separate line items built on top of the Body Package.
 
Since I will only be renting my Red back to myself for my own projects I'm going to price it as I've priced all my cameras and lenses. 100 day payback. The total cost of the package divided by 100. Conservatively figuring 50 days a year, that's a 2 year payback. While I may be upgrading to RED 2 by then, the investment in the Arri Matte Matte Box, FF-4, Filtration and other new accessories should pay-off long after that window.

I've owned an SRII for 15 years. It was paid off in 100 days. Yes, I've had maintenance, upgraded to S16, but that camera supported me and my family for years. And the SuperSpeeds I invested in back then are still viable.

I could rent it for more, but I want to shoot it.

I'll be around 900 for a full cine set-up with Red lenses. That'll include my hi-def field monitor, support, and media back-up.

The liteweight documentary package @ $750

Add $200 for the Superspeeds and 105mm macro
Add $135 for the Zeiss 10mm
Add $50 for the Peleng 8mm
Add $85 for the Century/Canon 300mm


I'll rent the Optimos or Cookes when they're needed.


The CMOS and firmware will change, no doubt, but the system on which Red is built is still classic film gear. That stuff will be around years after it's paid back if you price it to keep working.

But, if I were renting it out to others, I'd factor in more maintenance, insurance, as a steeper upgrade curve.

max
 
You don't have to low-ball the day rate. People will pay for a 35mm 4K equivalent. The ideal price is something that is affordable to producers at all levels yet keeps the camera working about 60 - 70% of the time. Yes, there will be a lot of cameras out there, but not everyone who owns one will be compelled to rent theirs out, some won't rent unless they go with it, the pool of cameras available in any market will probably reflect the volume of projects in that market.
IMO, anything less than $1200 a day will put your camera in the hands of crews that through inexperience, ignorance or incompetence, could abuse or damage it. What good is a $600 day rate if it only guarantees that at some point your RED gets shipped back to Lake Forest for a tune up. I'd balance the desire to generate income with the need to properly value and protect your equipment.
 
Jeff Coatney said:
You don't have to low-ball the day rate. People will pay for a 35mm 4K equivalent. The ideal price is something that is affordable to producers at all levels yet keeps the camera working about 60 - 70% of the time. Yes, there will be a lot of cameras out there, but not everyone who owns one will be compelled to rent theirs out, some won't rent unless they go with it, the pool of cameras available in any market will probably reflect the volume of projects in that market.
IMO, anything less than $1200 a day will put your camera in the hands of crews that through inexperience, ignorance or incompetence, could abuse or damage it. What good is a $600 day rate if it only guarantees that at some point your RED gets shipped back to Lake Forest for a tune up. I'd balance the desire to generate income with the need to properly value and protect your equipment.
Click to expand...

wow, excellent point :)
 
why call it LOW BALL ?
the cost of the camera is very reasonable ... 1000's can own it ..

so lets look at it from a different POV !!
why does one HI BALL it and charge 35mm rates or cineAlta rates ...
RED gave us a super price to own a 4k camera NOT 35mm/sony cineAlta prices ... based on whatever you call the established % thing that equal a day rate that has been around for years those charging 600-700 for the basic's are NOT low balling it - based on that standard they are actually HI BALLING it ...
 
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