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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

REDRAY Comments

Stuart,
Do you think 2.5MB/s is enough for a 3D HFR cinemas? DCP offers up to 62MB/s for 3D HFR.

I am looking forward to do tests on December 21st.
 
Philip Orlandic said:
Stuart,
Do you think 2.5MB/s is enough for a 3D HFR cinemas? DCP offers up to 62MB/s for 3D HFR.
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I'm sure the 2,5MB/s apply to 24p/4k only and it needs more with higher framerate and 3D, probably roughly 10MB/s for 48fps/3D, as long as there isn't some magic sauce involved to reduce that a bit more. ;)

DCP uses a different compression, so it actually needs more bandwith to look as good as .RED will do with lower bandwith.
 
Adam Palmer said:
So am I right in saying that the .RED codec can only be played back if you have a REDray? Does this mean that it cannot be used as a 4K finishing codec for YouTube/Vimeo or playback on a PC?

Adam
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Jon said there are no plans for Desktop or Mobile playback. I think for security reasons they are requiring a REDRAY for playback. It's much easier to crack DRM if desktop playback is possible.
 
Brandon J.F. said:
Jon said there are no plans for Desktop or Mobile playback. I think for security reasons they are requiring a REDRAY for playback. It's much easier to crack DRM if desktop playback is possible.
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Thanks Brandon, so the use of this codec is purely in association with ODEMAX distribution and REDray/Projector playback?
 
Adam Palmer said:
Thanks Brandon, so the use of this codec is purely in association with ODEMAX distribution and REDray/Projector playback?
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You don't have to use ODEMAX to view .RED files. You can transfer the file locally to a REDRAY. Any HD (1080p/720p) or 4k monitor can be used with REDRAY. You don't have to use RED's projector. ODEMAX is for distribution, DRM, payments, tracking, etc.
 
F
Phil Holland said:
Also, the concept of having the REDRAY inside the CRIMSON projector is really nice. I can see this being very useful for installation work. Not to mention quick setup and run time for new adopters to this 4K projection platform.
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It is a good idea, but I would also point out that Sony has been shipping digital cinema projectors with an integrated media block (I.e. digital cinema server) for a number of years now. So while Red is not the first to come up with this concept, a good idea is, nevertheless, a good idea...
 
M Most said:
F

It is a good idea, but I would also point out that Sony has been shipping digital cinema projectors with an integrated media block (I.e. digital cinema server) for a number of years now. So while Red is not the first to come up with this concept, a good idea is, nevertheless, a good idea...
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We have one in our Christie 4k projector, too. It's an add-on board, so upgradeable, definitely the way of the future.


JT
 
Would love to see some RGB images from Red Ray as soon as you're able...I've been working on our Symphony for a doc project (originating in 5K and down-converted to 175 10 bit) and noticed I wasn't working in my traditional 10 bit settings in the 1080P project (although it was in RGB)...definitely noticed jaggies around the glasses of our interview subjects and moire in some ties...when I clicked through to 'green' and 10 bit those yucky things went away.
 
Stuart English said:
We can only output what the HDMI format allows us to - i.e. 12-bit 4:2:2 or 8-bit 4:4:4 when we are talking about 4K resolution.

i.e the signal path in the .RED codec is higher resolution than that, we have to downsample to those allowed output bit depths.

This is one of the key reasons our RREncoder allows 16-bit TIFF as an input file format.....


There is a similar explanation with regard to why the specification for Color Space is REC 709....
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Is the color gamut of movies that are played back on the internal REDRAY player on the Crimson projector restricted to REC 709?
 
Brandon J.F. said:
Jon said there are no plans for Desktop or Mobile playback. I think for security reasons they are requiring a REDRAY for playback. It's much easier to crack DRM if desktop playback is possible.
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I guess most of us want computer playback for quick reviews of their own encodes.

So it depends... Are our own encodes already DRM-dongled to just our REDRAY-player or are these files free of DRM. If DRM is only applied when files go through ODEMAX, then there would be no reason to not allow playback of DRM-free files on a computer. Well i guess RR has some hard working special chips inside and normal cpus/gpus are just not up to the task, but thats another problem. It could be solved with a new REDROCKET, hehe. ;)

Yeah, i hope for a new ROCKET with the addition of .RED-support...

BTW, i don't really need computer-playback, REDRAY can access NAS-systems via network, so it can probably access a SMB-shared directory on my workstation too.
 
ODEMAX does the DRM not RCX. Good question though about local playback for files without DRM.
 
Luis Otero said:
Stuart,

Thanks for the explanation. So, if I have a device with HDMI 1.4 input, this will receive the 12 bit 4K signal? Just trying to understand how future-proof this iteration of RR is.

Thanks!
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Stuart,

I still would like to get an answer on the posted question.

Respectfully,
 
Andrew Huse said:
2.5MB/S I don't understand how this is possible
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You can encode any video at any bitrate- no one stops you doing it :)

How 4K will look at 20Mbit- well with sources from RED it will look okish, relatively similar to HD video on eg. Vimeo.
It will be no near DCP spec quality for HD, but as a streaming content it should be ok mainly due to fact that RED footage is quite clean and it's easy to encode.

Is this all what REDRAY will be able to store? What about serious projection on big screens?
 
Joseph Coleman said:
18gb for 2 hour movie. Technically with .RED you could fit a full 4k movie on a 25gb bluray. Hmmm would love to see the quality.
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Don't expect BD quality out of 20Mbits 4K encodes- REDCODEC is not more efficient than AVC and Blu-rays are encoded with 20-35Mbit for HD res using encoders designed for this, with tweaked segment encodes over 2 or more passes. Relatively it will be way <BD quality- there is no magic and as much as RED can do good encodes out of their encoder you can't win with math :)
 
Andrew_HD said:
You can encode any video at any bitrate- no one stops you doing it :)

How 4K will look at 20Mbit- well with sources from RED it will look okish, relatively similar to HD video on eg. Vimeo.
It will be no near DCP spec quality for HD, but as a streaming content it should be ok mainly due to fact that RED footage is quite clean and it's easy to encode.

Is this all what REDRAY will be able to store? What about serious projection on big screens?
Click to expand...


Sorry but you couldn't be more wrong about your assessment of its image quality. I along with many others have seen it in earlier iterations and it's mind blowingly good.
I believe that REDRAY is based on fractal image compression so forget any notion you have about what bit rate it takes to get a certain quality level.
 
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