RED WEAPON - the name

[Ketch Rossi]

I can definitely see your points Steve, I however much prefer dramatic names over initials followed by numbers, or viceversa. I really dislike that fashion of naming.

 

[Luke Neumann]

I can definitely see your points Steve, I however much prefer dramatic names over initials followed by numbers, or viceversa. I really dislike that fashion of naming.

I have to agree. Eventually with a company like Sony it's easy to lose track! Sony a7, or a7s, or a7s2, or a7r, or f5, or f55, or f65.

RED names might not be for everyone but they certainly are unique and in that way, much better.

 

[Steve Sherrick]

I have to agree. Eventually with a company like Sony it's easy to lose track! Sony a7, or a7s, or a7s2, or a7r, or f5, or f55, or f65.

RED names might not be for everyone but they certainly are unique and in that way, much better.

Like I said, I'm clueless when it comes to what names will work and what won't. And simplicity in something like R65 would not be really in Red style, but it would be a change of pace, therefore differentiating itself from the other Red cams. Then go back to wild names on the next model. I really don't have a problem with the unique naming, it's just that Weapon is not quite registering...yet.

 

[Luke Neumann]

Like I said, I'm clueless when it comes to what names will work and what won't. And simplicity in something like R65 would not be really in Red style, but it would be a change of pace, therefore differentiating itself from the other Red cams. Then go back to wild names on the next model. I really don't have a problem with the unique naming, it's just that Weapon is not quite registering...yet.

Totally, R65 would be unique in that way. I personally don't care at all! Don't ever give it much thought.

 

[Daniel Stilling]

I really don't care what name it gets, be it 675 or the Kraken or rainbow mist. I just think that weapon evokes security concerns to those involved in that area and a negative connotation in a world full of death and despair.
You can be renegade and cutting edge without being negative and concerning.
My concern is practical. Does the name even have a tiny chance of being a problem somehow? Then it should be avoided like the plague. Hey, call it "The Plague"!

 

[charles lim yi yong]

I really don't care what name it gets, be it 675 or the Kraken or rainbow mist. I just think that weapon evokes security concerns to those involved in that area and a negative connotation in a world full of death and despair.
You can be renegade and cutting edge without being negative and concerning.
My concern is practical. Does the name even have a tiny chance of being a problem somehow? Then it should be avoided like the plague. Hey, call it "The Plague"!

I am in with you, Daniel. PLEASE STOP ALL THESE Ridiculous violent names.

 

[Abiodun Shote]

I

I really don't care what name it gets, be it 675 or the Kraken or rainbow mist. I just think that weapon evokes security concerns to those involved in that area and a negative connotation in a world full of death and despair.
You can be renegade and cutting edge without being negative and concerning.
My concern is practical. Does the name even have a tiny chance of being a problem somehow? Then it should be avoided like the plague. Hey, call it "The Plague"!

My friend was once arrested during a random stop-and-search (while returning from location) by the police when one of his crew unconsciously used the word "shoot" during interrogation. I honestly can't imagine if they had a Red brain label WEAPON with them in that situation. Assembled, yes, its more explainable, but isolated? Its subject to the interpretation/condition/intention of the security officer especially in areas that have delicate political stability.
My suggestion is that Red should have 2 options, "WEAPON" for those that don't mind and simple "W" for those in delicate areas who will prefer not to have an item labelled "weapon" on them.
I certainly would want the latter.
And for those who say they've travelled internationally many times without issues, its true, you might not have issues because most airport officials are a little bit more exposed but internally, especially in Africa, security protocols is a different ball game.

 

[Sam Goldwater]

I am in with you, Daniel. PLEASE STOP ALL THESE Ridiculous violent names.

+1

Whatever the new machine is I'm sure will be great, but it'd be a shame to be embarrassed to refer to it by name. We're talking about cutting edge cinema tools, not Bandai plastic toys for ten year old boys. Epic, Scarlet, Dragon, Alexa, Amira, Penelope are all good names - 'Weapon', besides any travel concerns, is a bit childish.

 

[Cosmo D]

+1 for the name. I'm not a big fan. And I can see some actors & actresses, that are often hypersensitive and like to show to their fans that they fight (or pretend to ....) for good or not so good causes, refusing to be in front of a camera named weapon. Maybe even pushing the studios to not use that camera. I think that we can find many examples where the name could cause trouble that nobody wants to deal with when there is already so much to think about and take care of on a project.

 

[Chris Purka]

Red sure has a way of finding the most high maintenance customers in the world this fighting over the name is so ridiculous to me. People are acting like RED is committing some sort of felony here by choosing a name that actually fits the description. I SHOOT MY CAMERA. It actually makes sense. And people think Red is the only one that does names that could mean something bad? A quick look in my camera bag shows a SHOTGUN microphone, an ATOMOS SAMURI BLADE, a little blower called ROCKET BLASTER that actually looks like a Rocket and gobs of other dangerous cool looking things with cool names. Jeepers, even one of my favorite pieces of software is called NUKE!!!! And there is MAGIC BULLET. The list goes on. So give it a break people, give it a break.

 

[Daniel Stilling]

Funny you should mention the rocket blaster. An AC good friend of mine lost his to the TSA because it resembled an actual bomb, therefore, just like with toy guns, it was confiscated.

ridiculous? Yes, but it's the reality we live in.

 

[Cosmo D]

Red sure has a way of finding the most high maintenance customers in the world this fighting over the name is so ridiculous to me. People are acting like RED is committing some sort of felony here by choosing a name that actually fits the description. I SHOOT MY CAMERA. It actually makes sense. And people think Red is the only one that does names that could mean something bad? A quick look in my camera bag shows a SHOTGUN microphone, an ATOMOS SAMURI BLADE, a little blower called ROCKET BLASTER that actually looks like a Rocket and gobs of other dangerous cool looking things with cool names. Jeepers, even one of my favorite pieces of software is called NUKE!!!! And there is MAGIC BULLET. The list goes on. So give it a break people, give it a break.

I don't give a s** about the name, I just don't like that one much, it's too obvious and simple, at least dragon or epic make people dream. I'm just thinking of all the people I will deal with who will care and be a pain in the ass: security, airports, actors, etc. It's a politically correct period, everything is simplified and about symbols. And Red has offices in different parts of the world now where the weapons questions are hypersensitive and important. I just don't want to lose extra time explaining things when I'm working.http://www.reduser.net/forum/editpost.php?p=1472795&do=editpost

 

[Sam Goldwater]

Red sure has a way of finding the most high maintenance customers in the world this fighting over the name is so ridiculous to me. People are acting like RED is committing some sort of felony here by choosing a name that actually fits the description. I SHOOT MY CAMERA. It actually makes sense. And people think Red is the only one that does names that could mean something bad? A quick look in my camera bag shows a SHOTGUN microphone, an ATOMOS SAMURI BLADE, a little blower called ROCKET BLASTER that actually looks like a Rocket and gobs of other dangerous cool looking things with cool names. Jeepers, even one of my favorite pieces of software is called NUKE!!!! And there is MAGIC BULLET. The list goes on. So give it a break people, give it a break.

There's no reason for Red to follow suit with the ludicrous militarisation of camera nomenclature just because the others do. Arri mercifully haven't stooped to it. Red's new brain is a creative, not destructive tool and the name should reflect that.

People are acting like RED is committing some sort of felony here by choosing a name that actually fits the description.

The name simply does not fit the description, that's the point.

 

[Michael Lindsay]

I really like the idea of upgradeing our 3 dragon cameras (..inffered from the interesting little bits of info gleamed from Jarred’s eliptical posts)... very excited!

What I don't like but more importantly really don’t think works is the name!!!... I accept the logic argument to it but know that is is a mistake (at least from a European Brand pov)

As well as making commercials I do at least one or two jobs a year working direct for big brands marketing teams dev creative tools.... I unfortunilty know far more than I wish I did about brand equity.... Most of the £700,000+ I have personally spent on camera kit has all been underwritten by money paid to me for having sellable brand sensitivities.

Red is vearing away from a disruptive, creative empowerment proposition towards something far more limiting for the brand! (and ultimately this effects its customers.. especially those like me that bought creative empowerment!)

Please please if you don't believe me (and I can't belive I am saying this) TEST this direction and specifically 'Weapon' with a group of cross discipline international film/Tv/AD agency creative people!... The market that makes Red successful in the future is bigger than this list

Hopeful

Michael L

ps quick question for the list ..Do you believe in the power of Brand in professional markets.

 

[David Wyatt]

I really like the idea of upgradeing our 3 dragon cameras (..inffered from the interesting little bits of info gleamed from Jarred’s eliptical posts)... very excited!

What I don't like but more importantly really don’t think works is the name!!!... I accept the logic argument to it but know that is is a mistake (at least from a European Brand pov)

As well as making commercials I do at least one or two jobs a year working direct for big brands marketing teams dev creative tools.... I unfortunilty know far more than I wish I did about brand equity.... Most of the £700,000+ I have personally spent on camera kit has all been underwritten by money paid to me for having sellable brand sensitivities.

Red is vearing away from a disruptive, creative empowerment proposition towards something far more limiting for the brand! (and ultimately this effects its customers.. especially those like me that bought creative empowerment!)

Please please if you don't believe me (and I can't belive I am saying this) TEST this direction and specifically 'Weapon' with a group of cross discipline international film/Tv/AD agency creative people!... The market that makes Red successful in the future is bigger than this list

Hopeful

Michael L

ps quick question for the list ..Do you think fundamentally the reason Roger Deakins will never shoot Red is as he, and alexa kit fans think it is, the actual pictures OR are we going to grow up and realise the power of Brand even in professional markets.

+1 to this sentiment. I think in general the militarised naming goes down a lot worse in European markets. I originally posted about my dislike of the naming of the Bomb viewfinder too, as did many, but obviously these views have been ignored. I do actually love a lot of Red's original & unique naming, particularly phrases like "Epic", "Mysterium", "Unobtanium" (my personal favourite), which feed into comic/superhero/sci-fi & film history lore which seems ideally suited not only to their product but also the kind of films that regularly make use of their product.

Incidentally it should be noted that the "Weapon" naming initially rather childishly made me laugh the first time I saw it because unfortunately for Red the word "weapon" is also British slang for a dickhead:

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=weapon

 

[D Fuller]

I have to agree 100% with this.
It's a two sided thing for me. One is travel, specially international. I know tape will fix a good part of the issues, but sometimes some people gets really hung up on paperwork and what is in it. I know officially the TSA couldn't care more about names, but somehow that memo didn't trickle down to all its agents and I had once to do some extensive splaining to an agent that didn't like my "Bomb". I had to power up the camera and connect it to prove that it was something else other than what it said on the side. It now sports a nice piece of black tape.
I'm in Europe at the moment and when I landed in Amsterdam, I had to go through security again and the agent there got really interested on my camera body, taking it out of my bag and looking through the seams. He even asked what "Dragon" meant. Not in a bad way, he just became curious. I can imagine with "Weapon" and a skull on the side that that curiosity will turn into deeper scrutiny.
The other side for me is that I'm a pacifist. I'm about peace, harmony and progress and not death and destruction. I know these names are not to be taken seriously, but it still has a negative connotation for me, no matter how little importance I put into it.
Jarred ,you know I'm a big proponent of your cameras, love them, and I'm sure this next step will be another big one, but if there is at all a chance that the name is not set in stone, or metal, or carbon fiber, please consider a change.
I know you can't please everyone, and I wasn't even sure I should express this, as in the grand scheme of things this is a minor detail, but I have a feeling that there are more that share this opinion than I thought...

Put me in this camp as well. I agree with everything Daniel has written here.

One more thing. The names of Red cameras have always been aspirational: "One" "Epic" "Dragon" they are names that users could hook their dreams to. This one just doesn't carry that same spirit. "Weapon" feels like a generic name that's trying too hard to be bad ass. Let the camera be bad ass. But let the name fire the imagination like your other ones do.

 

[Abiodun Shote]

I have to agree 100% with this.
It's a two sided thing for me. One is travel, specially international. I know tape will fix a good part of the issues, but sometimes some people gets really hung up on paperwork and what is in it. I know officially the TSA couldn't care more about names, but somehow that memo didn't trickle down to all its agents and I had once to do some extensive splaining to an agent that didn't like my "Bomb". I had to power up the camera and connect it to prove that it was something else other than what it said on the side. It now sports a nice piece of black tape.
I'm in Europe at the moment and when I landed in Amsterdam, I had to go through security again and the agent there got really interested on my camera body, taking it out of my bag and looking through the seams. He even asked what "Dragon" meant. Not in a bad way, he just became curious. I can imagine with "Weapon" and a skull on the side that that curiosity will turn into deeper scrutiny.
The other side for me is that I'm a pacifist. I'm about peace, harmony and progress and not death and destruction. I know these names are not to be taken seriously, but it still has a negative connotation for me, no matter how little importance I put into it.
Jarred ,you know I'm a big proponent of your cameras, love them, and I'm sure this next step will be another big one, but if there is at all a chance that the name is not set in stone, or metal, or carbon fiber, please consider a change.
I know you can't please everyone, and I wasn't even sure I should express this, as in the grand scheme of things this is a minor detail, but I have a feeling that there are more that share this opinion than I thought...

+1.

 

[Per von Koch]

Come. On.

Keep the name. Ridicolus conversation.

 

[Bob Gundu]

Perhaps a solution could be to offer a non-engraved/emblem version?

 

[Jens Jakob Thorsen]

I totally agree. PLEASE change the name. As someone who's been on the RED journey since the beginning, I have to say this makes me groan. I long for the day when RED can be confident enough to step back a bit from the aggressive, macho paramilitary "bad ass" vibe and align its brand around what it really delivers—cutting edge, professional camera equipment to the professional filmmaking community. That doesn't mean you have to be generic or boring. You can still have attitude and be cool and disruptive. But really... "weapon?". Imagine a client or professional associate asking you..."what do you shoot?" And then answering....ughh... "Weapon". It would be embarrassing.

To be blunt, this is a fucking stupid name.

Now that I'm on a rant, I've always felt that way about labeling your gear Red "Pro". Really? What else would it be? Of course it's professional. Is there a 'non-pro' or amateur line? I know that was a reaction to some of the early AKS that were substandard, but 'cmon. Be proud. Confident. You're a leader in your market. Act like it! Spin the baseball cap around. Evolve the brand to reflect the quality and intelligence of your products.

Hire a CMO or an agency to help with product naming and brand.

Don't get me wrong. I love you guys. You know that. I just don't want to have to buy a fucking "weapon."

M

Word! I frequently have to make excuses for this childish nomenclature.