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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Red "Weapon" Name Poll - Change it or not?

Red "Weapon" Name Poll - Change it or not?

  • Keep the name "Weapon"

    Votes: 91 17.5%

  • Please change the name

    Votes: 339 65.2%

  • I could care less what the name is

    Votes: 90 17.3%
  • Total voters
    520
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Not open for further replies.
Jarred Land said:
Appreciate the candid discussion and all the feedback.

The name is here to stay.

There are some of you with genuine security concerns and for those that would prefer we will be offering a "stealth" Weapon without the Weapon branding engraved on it... simple check box at the time of order.
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I suppose putting a rainbow on the case would defeat the whole stealth thing. You do know that unicorns fart rainbows, right?

A weapon masquerading in the guise of a rainbow would be more like "Incognito Weapon" I guess.


Sorry. I'm a dick.

I saw this damn thread pop up again and had to smack it.
 
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Removing the name physically from the camera addresses only (arguably small) part of the issue that some are genuinely concerned about. You will still have to declare the camera on any official paperwork, equipment list, insurance papers, etc and the word will end up being infused into every conversation - for better or worse. In the end RED can call their products what ever they want. I am sure that the decision to go with this name was not made lightly and they have their own reasoning behind it. Our personal like or dislike is irrelevant. My hope is that the sheer quantity of the cameras in the wild and (perhaps ironically) the controversy surrounding the name will make the name itself be well known and recognized. In the end it will be the actual performance of the camera that will decide the fate of how the name is received in the industry (and outside of it). With the name like "weapon" there is not much room for "issues". I am sure RED realizes that and in many ways it makes me confident that not only the weapon is going to be truly revolutionary (yet again), but perhaps more importantly - truly ready for action, rock solid and reliable. Then nobody will care about the name...

:sifone: Peter
 
As Gunkiek pointed out earlier, you identify the camera on all documentation as Red Digital Cinema Camera SN#xxxxx. That positively identifies the gear without invoking any nomenclature that you feel is worrisome.

Here is a cheeky question for illustrative purposes.

If you were stopped at a border crossing and an official asked "What to do have in the trunk?" Would you answer "Jennifer's Body." or would it be perfectly OK to say " A DVD movie."?

Here is another cheeky question.

Why does The Bomb EVF not raise any eyebrows the way people feared it would? Because only the Acme company engraves BOMB on the side of a bomb. Unless you are a six foot coyote, you are fine.


Peter Majtan said:
Removing the name physically from the camera addresses only (arguably small) part of the issue that some are genuinely concerned about. You will still have to declare the camera on any official paperwork, equipment list, insurance papers, etc and the word will end up being infused into every conversation - for better or worse. In the end RED can call their products what ever they want. I am sure that the decision to go with this name was not made lightly and they have their own reasoning behind it. Our personal like or dislike is irrelevant. My hope is that the sheer quantity of the cameras in the wild and (perhaps ironically) the controversy surrounding the name will make the name itself be well known and recognized. In the end it will be the actual performance of the camera that will decide the fate of how the name is received in the industry (and outside of it). With the name like "weapon" there is not much room for "issues". I am sure RED realizes that and in many ways it makes me confident that not only the weapon is going to be truly revolutionary (yet again), but perhaps more importantly - truly ready for action, rock solid and reliable. Then nobody will care about the name...

:sifone: Peter
Click to expand...
 
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To be honest, I've never been a fan of the "military metaphor" Red has been using for its products from the beginning, be it in the names (Bomb EVF, Gunner, tactical this and that, assault plate, battle-tested stuff, Red armory, switchblade, etc...) or in the design. And now "Weapon" for the new system. And I know for a fact that this makes many film-makers around here uncomfortable too.

I guess it's a cultural thing. You "shoot" a movie, around here we "roll" ("tourner", but it's the same in german for instance, "drehen") a movie, you "run and gun" (no idea how to translate that into french), you have "guerilla" film making... Aaton's ideal was a "cat on the shoulder", while Red's ideal seems to be more in the lines of a "weapon" on the shoulder.
Definitely not my thing, but hey, as before, if it's a great camera that produces great images, I'm still in. I'm not going to ditch a fantastic tool just because I'm not fond of the marketing.
Maybe I'll just call it Red "W" ;-)

Oh, and I'll make one exception : using the NATO rails was genius. I hope that stays with the new camera system.

Anyway, can't wait to know what that new "W" is all about :)
 
Nils Ruinet said:
To be honest, I've never been a fan of the "military metaphor" Red has been using for its products from the beginning, be it in the names (Bomb EVF, Gunner, tactical this and that, assault plate, battle-tested stuff, Red armory, switchblade, etc...) or in the design. And now "Weapon" for the new system. And I know for a fact that this makes many film-makers around here uncomfortable too.

I guess it's a cultural thing. You "shoot" a movie, around here we "roll" ("tourner", but it's the same in german for instance, "drehen") a movie, you "run and gun" (no idea how to translate that into french), you have "guerilla" film making... Aaton's ideal was a "cat on the shoulder", while Red's ideal seems to be more in the lines of a "weapon" on the shoulder.
Definitely not my thing, but hey, as before, if it's a great camera that produces great images, I'm still in. I'm not going to ditch a fantastic tool just because I'm not fond of the marketing.
Maybe I'll just call it Red "W" ;-)

Oh, and I'll make one exception : using the NATO rails was genius. I hope that stays with the new camera system.

Anyway, can't wait to know what that new "W" is all about :)
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Leave it as Weapon and stealth if you want it. "W" has a very bad connotation in the US as it refers to President 43, a disaster.
 
scott devitte said:
Leave it as Weapon and stealth if you want it. "W" has a very bad connotation in the US as it refers to President 43, a disaster.
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Scott, Our country is roughly divided, left and right. While you are entitled to your political opinion, according to the generally understood community rules on Reduser, you are not entitled to express your political opinion on these lists. It doesn't make for comity, since some of us don't agree with you and feel like you just threw a stink bomb into the room.

If you just didn't know that politics are not appropriate here - no worriesl. Now you know. If you did know, but thought there were special rules for what you wanted to say - that's not cool. How about we extend the same courtesy to everyone?

Best regards,

Tim Eaton
 
Hahaha yeah true, I thought about this when I wrote it. Was just joking anyway :-)
But from what I recall, "W" loved "Weapons" too ;oP
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Same response to you Nils.

If you just didn't know that politics are not appropriate here - no worriesl. Now you know. If you did know, but thought there were special rules for what you wanted to say - that's not cool. How about we extend the same courtesy to everyone?

Best regards,

Tim Eaton
 
I guess some would say it's a little too soon to refer to some things as "history" rather then "politics."
 
Honestly, after a couple of drinks in a night out, all I can say is this: Red, you are a tool that inspires millions. Storytellers from all around the world use your tools to create hope, movie "magic" that creates sparkles in many kids eyes. Think about it. . Left, right, weapons... What does it all mean in the grand scheme of things? Keep inspiring. Keep that positive energy to help change the World for the best.
 
Scott Crawley said:
Why does The Bomb EVF not raise any eyebrows the way people feared it would?
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Well, it does. I had a TSA agent hold me for a while and I had to do a lot of explaining about the EVF. He was very close to confiscating it. I had to power up The camera and connect it to show it really did what I said it would. A piece of tape now adorns my EVF.
 
Daniel Stilling said:
Well, it does. I had a TSA agent hold me for a while and I had to do a lot of explaining about the EVF. He was very close to confiscating it. I had to power up The camera and connect it to show it really did what I said it would. A piece of tape now adorns my EVF.
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They will do that with ANY electronics that they can not readily identify, or are in the possession of a person they are scrutinizing for any of a myriad of reasons. You only assume it is because of the name. While you may be correct in your assumption, it is still an assumption none the less. My point is there are many more reasonable possible explanations as to why you were asked to do that, and having to demonstrate that your item is what you claim is little more than a momentary inconvenience. It is not cause for alarm on your part.

How possible is it do you think that out of fear and concern that TSA might stop you, that subtle cues in your behavior alerted the TSA? Folks who feel uneasy around security appear very squirrelly and draw the same scrutiny as those who actually have something to hide.

I'm sure the TSA is not 100% idiot free though, so the tape may be a most expedient choice. ;-)

Edit: I am told that it is a matter of policy to ask travelers to demonstrate the function of all electronics. That wouldn't necessarily mean that agents will demand that of every device, but it may be policy.
 
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I have very seldom seen a poll on a forum so clearly communicate a point. That is unless it was a humorous poll... which this is certainly not.
 
Scott Crawley said:
They will do that with ANY electronics that they can not readily identify, or are in the possession of a person they are scrutinizing for any of a myriad of reasons. You only assume it is because of the name. While you may be correct in your assumption, it is still an assumption none the less. My point is there are many more reasonable possible explanations as to why you were asked to do that, and having to demonstrate that your item is what you claim is little more than a momentary inconvenience. It is not cause for alarm on your part.

How possible is it do you think that out of fear and concern that TSA might stop you, that subtle cues in your behavior alerted the TSA? Folks who feel uneasy around security appear very squirrelly and draw the same scrutiny as those who actually have something to hide.

I'm sure the TSA is not 100% idiot free though, so the tape may be a most expedient choice. ;-)
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Scott, you certainly don't know me, or how I behave or how much I travel. I don't apreciatte your assumptions.
the fact that the TSA agent called his supervisor because "that device is a bomb" and "you're not allowed to carry bombs on planes" or "if this is an explosive, charges will be pressed against you". If this is not enough to show that a name can be a problem, then I don't know what koolaid you're drinking from and I have no interest in keeping discussing this. I had an issue with the name Bomb. Simple fact. Has this happened a lot? I don't think so. But it has happened more than once. And that's my point.
 
I made no assumption about your behavior. I asked "How possible is it do you think... ?" Thank you for the clarification. I would definitely continue with the tape. ;-)

BTW, it still could be that it was your appearance that drew the initial attention and the name fanned the flame. Again, the reasons could have been many. Regardless, it does seem fairly clear by your account that the agent was either a dope or busting your balls.

Some of you may find useful info on the TSA blog
http://blog.tsa.gov/2014/07/tsa-travel-tips-enhanced-security.html

Daniel Stilling said:
Scott, you certainly don't know me, or how I behave or how much I travel. I don't apreciatte your assumptions.
the fact that the TSA agent called his supervisor because "that device is a bomb" and "you're not allowed to carry bombs on planes" or "if this is an explosive, charges will be pressed against you". If this is not enough to show that a name can be a problem, then I don't know what koolaid you're drinking from and I have no interest in keeping discussing this. I had an issue with the name Bomb. Simple fact. Has this happened a lot? I don't think so. But it has happened more than once. And that's my point.
Click to expand...
 
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