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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Red Epic-X or Wait for Raven

Scott Lamoreaux

Scott Lamoreaux

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So I'm on the fence about trading in my Scarlet-X for an Epic-X. I want the 5K FF and high frame rates however the Raven also sounds nice as well.

I can't afford the Epic Dragon, Weapon so It's either Epic-X or Raven.

What would you choose?
 
Raven. Dragon sensor is way superior than MX. If you had a Epic-X to Dragon upgrade path still open I'd suggest the opposite, but right now it's sell your Scarlet for whatever you can and get a Raven for sure.
 
raven is more future proof with its weapon body and dragon sensor, but the epic-x will probably rent more and it does 5K motion and better framerate/compression options. and DSMC accessories are really cheap on the used market right now because everybody is dumping them and moving to weapon
 
I always go with the new technology when it comes to camera gear. It's basically a computer with image sensor. Feb/Mar will be here before you know it.
 
Doesn't footage that's shot in 5K downscaled to 4K always look better than 4K? New technology sounds great but those frame rates at 5K got me. Maybe Epic Dragon price will creep below $20k for the body by then?
 
I'm telling you, it's not about framerates as much as it's about the quality of Dragon sensor. Maybe you should look into Epic Dragon kits that are being sold here, a lot of reasonable offers there.
 
Scott Lamoreaux said:
Doesn't footage that's shot in 5K downscaled to 4K always look better than 4K? New technology sounds great but those frame rates at 5K got me. Maybe Epic Dragon price will creep below $20k for the body by then?
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I'm going through the same problem. I haven't had my Scarlet for long, and I'm thinking about either upgrading to the Epic, or selling it and buying a Raven. What do I want more, high frame rate, and Full Frame, or do I want a better sensor and updated body.
 
Does the Raven shoot HDRx?

Does the Raven shoot HDRx?

I'm in the same boat. Does the raven shoot HDRx? How about time-lapse?
I don't see myself upgrading every time Red brings a new camera and the Epic looks just right for my needs.
Especially now that I got a Red Rocket card.
 
I´m also on the same boat. Las week I spoke with RED, and they told me that upgrade to Epic will finalise soon. So, I´m little bit upset what should I do. Selling my Scarlet like whole wold do, or upgrading to Epic it´s still huge machine and gives me possibility use PL lenses and better compression. I wish if RED could give to Scarlet owners some upgrade to Raven or more reasonable price for upgrading to Epic.
 
Irene Valle Luna said:
I´m also on the same boat. Las week I spoke with RED, and they told me that upgrade to Epic will finalise soon. So, I´m little bit upset what should I do. Selling my Scarlet like whole wold do, or upgrading to Epic it´s still huge machine and gives me possibility use PL lenses and better compression. I wish if RED could give to Scarlet owners some upgrade to Raven or more reasonable price for upgrading to Epic.
Click to expand...

I wish i could get some trade in for my epic mx towards raven but they are never going to do that. You have to remember the age of the mx cameras (disregard if you have scarlet dragon). Its not fair to ask red to help out those who have 5 year old technology.

But that being said... I own an epic mx. And i am seriously thinking of moving down/moving up (i dont know wich to call it) to the raven. My reasoning is for the smaller more compact nature of the camera combined with new sensor and the built in microphone.

I am an action sports filmer having built in mics to a camera can really save you in pinch. There has been a lot of times where i was not running a microphone and out of the blue someone interesting with something to say runs by i need to be able to quickly capture that audio with built in mics i can get the last minute audio on setups where i dont run a mic.

Also saving almost 2lbs of wight is huge for me. My bag is already close to 80lbs in the backcountry any weight saving helps.

On top of everything the new sensor is plus! For me having more dr and color science is great! Also auto black shading is awesome as well.

But what you need remember and why the epic costs more than the raven is the mounts. If you are one that does a lot of camera rentals or works on projects where the director whats a certain look from the lens you are very limited by a canon ef mount only. Having the option to change mounts gives tremendous power to the camera. Also the 5k resolution will be superior to the 4k on the raven. Also you loose the name you tell a client you have an epic and they are stoked. Tell i client you have bird and they are confused.... haha

Thats my to cents and why i am switching to raven and what i am lossing.
 
Honestly if you can wait till spring, i bet the weapons will go down in price slightly, Ravens will be sent out, always new announcements at NAB. Unless you have projects lined up which would warrant owning your own RED DSMC I would wait. Everything costs the most when it first comes out. And yes the mx Line looks like its on its way out, BUT STILL amazing.
 
I see 2 problems with RAVEN. 1- it´s lenses limitation, and 2- it´s 4K. If we thinking about future, the big screen projectors is on way to change on 4K. So, if you don´t have margen and shooting only on 4K, it limiting you with post. What do you think, do we need extra space and shooting with Epic MX, or running for light weight camera with sensor Dragon?
 
It depends on what you do and what your particular needs are:

DP for hire - Don't buy any camera, rent whatever camera is needed for each individual project.

Indie Filmmaker - If you have a project that needs to be shot before Raven is released, and you have adequate lighting - Use your Scarlet. Otherwise, Raven. Raven has WiFI and auto black shading. Use EF glass and Foolcontrol. Done.

Rental house - Both. All. Keep Scarlet, buy Epic and Raven... and Weapon...

So, I see no point in getting an Epic unless you are a rental house.

4k is always "good enough".

Academy 35 is always "good enough".
 
Jacob Callaghan said:
I wish i could get some trade in for my epic mx towards raven but they are never going to do that. You have to remember the age of the mx cameras (disregard if you have scarlet dragon). Its not fair to ask red to help out those who have 5 year old technology.

But that being said... I own an epic mx. And i am seriously thinking of moving down/moving up (i dont know wich to call it) to the raven. My reasoning is for the smaller more compact nature of the camera combined with new sensor and the built in microphone.

I am an action sports filmer having built in mics to a camera can really save you in pinch. There has been a lot of times where i was not running a microphone and out of the blue someone interesting with something to say runs by i need to be able to quickly capture that audio with built in mics i can get the last minute audio on setups where i dont run a mic.

Also saving almost 2lbs of wight is huge for me. My bag is already close to 80lbs in the backcountry any weight saving helps.

On top of everything the new sensor is plus! For me having more dr and color science is great! Also auto black shading is awesome as well.

But what you need remember and why the epic costs more than the raven is the mounts. If you are one that does a lot of camera rentals or works on projects where the director whats a certain look from the lens you are very limited by a canon ef mount only. Having the option to change mounts gives tremendous power to the camera. Also the 5k resolution will be superior to the 4k on the raven. Also you loose the name you tell a client you have an epic and they are stoked. Tell i client you have bird and they are confused.... haha

Thats my to cents and why i am switching to raven and what i am lossing.
Click to expand...

The first thing to think about is that all upgrade paths from now on start with a Dragonized camera. So, consider stretching to upgrade to Dragon before that option goes away. Then, at some point, you will very likely have an option to move to DSMC2 body factor at a price point lower than current Weapon upgrades. RED has hinted that there will something between Raven and Weapon and I'll bet the upgrade will be quite attractively priced for Epic Dragon owners. Of course, like nearly everywhere here, this is all conjecture.
 
Demetri Zuev said:
I'm telling you, it's not about framerates as much as it's about the quality of Dragon sensor. Maybe you should look into Epic Dragon kits that are being sold here, a lot of reasonable offers there.
Click to expand...

Yes! I recently went Scarlet MX-Dragon mainly because of the IT'S NOW OR NEVER! deadline and the fact that I had the #0123 Scarlet. Then I discovered I REALLY liked the new Dragon sensor, was thrilled to get used to the idea that I now owned a camera which could really be an A camera for delivering production values. The chatter about "noise" (audio and video) that concerned me hasn't delivered those bad results I was afraid of so far but I really haven't been pushing the envelope on exposures so far either! This being said, I am not sorry I moved on from the MX sensor!
 
i wonder how 5k mx compares to raven 4k. Mx has more resolution and wider FOV, raven will have newer color science, more dynamic range, a bit better low light sensitivity. Also how do the built in mics sound on weapon? I know I know, there not ideal and just for scratch, but when you are up in the mountains with a small kit they could be useful in some scenarios.
 
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