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RED Drive with shock mount, how much can it take

Peter Osinski

Peter Osinski

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this a question for all you out there that are using the red drive system. It seems to be the most gigbyte bang for your buck, and I was wondering how versatile it really is. Obviously it can work on a tripod or something like that, but how does it do with hand held work. It looks like it would be great for shooting documentaries or reality tv shows, but how likely am I to skip frames if I am just walking around with it on a shoulder mount?
 
Ive never had a problem shooting hand held with my drive. not one dropped frame.
 
Lots of commercials, music videos, etc using my drives in ET shockmounts and no drop frames to report. Not saying it can't happen, but as long as you're using smart practices on set, i.e. swapping media regularly, watching drop frame indicators, checking shots on the computer, etc. you can certainly get by with RED Drives. Using them in the RED cradle, another story. Most of the time they will be fine, but I would be hesitant to rely on that setup for handheld or anything where vibration can be a factor. Now, for loud, bass heavy concerts, aerial shoots and things of that nature you need to go with more bullet proof methods, i.e. RED RAM or CF cards for shortform stuff.
 
I would never trust my livelihood to spinning drives. I'll use them on a dolly, as long as I can always unmount the drive before major repos. Handheld or on vehicles and you are just asking for trouble.

Dropped frames are one thing, but what if the camera receives enough of a jarring to crash the heads? It's much easier than you may think. Just for fun, take an old external drive, hook it up to your computer so it is spinning, then see how well it fares a 1 inch drop onto your desk. 2 inches? 3 inches? I would be surprised if anyone's drives will survive 3 or 4 inches while spinning.

Do you think a camera in the course of a normal day might take a bump like that? How much force does it endure when you snap it into the quick-release plate? Drive the dolly over a cable? Hand it off to a grip who sets it a little too hard down on an apple box?

Shooting aerials with hard drives is (I'm sorry) completely irresponsible. Besides the obvious risk of head crashes and dropped frames from vibration, turbulence and landing/take-off, hard drives are not designed to operate at high altitude. From Wikipedia: "The HDD's spindle system relies on air pressure inside the enclosure to support the heads at their proper flying height while the disk rotates. Hard disk drives require a certain range of air pressures in order to operate properly. The connection to the external environment and pressure occurs through a small hole in the enclosure (about 0.5 mm in diameter), usually with a filter on the inside (the breather filter).[46] If the air pressure is too low, then there is not enough lift for the flying head, so the head gets too close to the disk, and there is a risk of head crashes and data loss. Specially manufactured sealed and pressurized disks are needed for reliable high-altitude operation..."

Please don't make us all look bad by using drives where you shouldn't.
 
RED Drives have been very reliable for me, but only after getting the ET mounts did I have confidence in them.

Handheld has to be based on how much movement will be involved. If it's a relatively static handheld interview, less worries. If you'll be moving around a lot, bumping into things potentially, then CF card or RED RAM for the job. Aerials, absolutely need solid state to do the job. The ET mounts are good but I wouldn't take the risk for aerials.

For what it's worth, most media whether it's film, solid state or hard drives is fragile. Things can go wrong with any format and do go wrong. I've had issues with CF cards, certainly have had issues with film and videotape, and hard drives occasionally go bad. It's all about risk assessment. Given a particular situation what gives you the greatest chance of success for the price point you can afford?
 
I was recently shooting on a drawbridge with a red drive in a red cradle, a truck went by and left me with errors. I also recently was shooting into a car that had 2 12" subs going and this also took out the red drive. It is relative to the vibration and it's frequency but if there is any question use cards or ram drive.
 
Peter Strietmann said:
I was recently shooting on a drawbridge with a red drive in a red cradle, a truck went by and left me with errors. I also recently was shooting into a car that had 2 12" subs going and this also took out the red drive. It is relative to the vibration and it's frequency but if there is any question use cards or ram drive.
Click to expand...

The drawbridge shot would have been fine with ET mount most likely. The one with the subs, I would opt for solid state to avoid any chance of dropping. Although since moving away from the cradle I have not had as much trouble with reasonable amount of bass. In fact, did one shoot in a club where due to how much footage I needed to grab, I went with the drive and was surprised to see no dropped frames with the ET mount. That was a low profile job though and I could take the chance. With a bigger job, I'd probably do it differently just to take out the risk as much as possible.
 
I've been using the drive isolation plate on my Long Valley Handle System for RED for over a year now without a single dropped frame. But if I had to shoot with loud music, gun shots, etc I would think about cards or the SSD.
 
In the entire time these have been out and been tested there have been only two people I have heard from that have had dropped frames WHILE using our shock isolators. One is when the camera and spinning drive were directly next to machine gun fire and the second was when the they were shooting hand held in a concert and they were too close to the woofers. Our shock isolators are for just that, shock. Jumping out of a helicopter with hand-held or connected to a vehicle on a wash board road. Sound waves at the right frequency can be an issue.
 
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