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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Really Annoying ...

AnthonyFlores

AnthonyFlores

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Okay, so I generally like FDTimes (thanks Sanjin) -- especially their coverage of Leica, Angenieux and some other cool things. But it's bit weird how enamored they are with Arri and Sony ... and how they act like Red doesn't exist.

Case in point:

http://www.fdtimes.com/news/sony/new-sony-camera-4k-and-beyond/

On the surface, it appears like just a nice post about Sony's announcement -- but to me it also reads like Red doesn't even exist and this "historic" new development represents the first step in a 4k revolution.

Um ... what???

I know that's not stated explicitly, but the lack of mention of Red -- and indeed their general lack of coverage for anything Red-related seems a bit suspicious to me.

Did Red make some enemies over there -- or are they just too married to Arri and Sony to give Red any props?

Or am I just venting senselessly ... ?

Any thoughts are welcome,

Anthony
 
Hi Anthony. Without suggesting any kind of sinister motives at all, I too have noticed with some interest the almost total lack of coverage of Red related matters which is a pity. It is a definite gap in what is otherwise an excellent publication.
 
careful

careful

Anthony I would be very careful accusing Jon of a foul play.
The guy has absolutely stellar integrity and he's earned it.
Besides I know him personally and NEVER, ever heard any unprofessional comment from him.
I think you should consider the effect on Reduser's reputation posting stuff like this. I know you mean no harm but this is internet- don't forget...
 
OptiTek said:
Anthony I would be very careful accusing Jon of a foul play.
The guy has absolutely stellar integrity and he's earned it.
Besides I know him personally and NEVER, ever heard any unprofessional comment from him.
I think you should consider the effect on Reduser's reputation posting stuff like this. I know you mean no harm but this is internet- don't forget...
Click to expand...

Okay Jacek, I'm sure you are right -- I don't know him personally. Just seems weird to me, and I'm sure the opposite could be said -- even if it's innocent (which it could very well be) why would they publish content that seems to ignore/slight one of the hottest leaders in the Digital Cinema game? (Red)

Again, I'm actually a big fan of FDTimes so sorry if this comes across as slander ... just a bit baffled by lack of Red coverage and the strange implication (which is obviously my interpretation) that it's Sony who is leading the 4k revolution and not Red.

I hope they will at least have some nice Epic mentions in their NAB coverage ....

Anthony
 
I agree; Jon Fauer is a really smart and fair guy who takes great interest in all things that make images. And he has done articles on Red; maybe not the full-bore factory tour ones like he's done for Arri and Cooke, sure, but the camera and company has been covered.
Maybe he has requested such a tour/ interview and been rebuffed by Red. None of us know. But I don't think Jon is a Red-basher by any stretch.
Cheers,
Harry
 
1. I have always found articles I've read on FDtimes.com interesting and insightful. I definitely appreciate what Jon is putting out there for us to read.

2. There does seem to be a relative shortage of articles on RED - the RED category only has five posts, only one of which is really about the camera, and then it's about Scarlet. I can't say what may be available in the full publications - there may be much more RED coverage therein. Nothing, though, about RED EPIC being snapped up so quickly for so many major films lately. Then again, it isn't a camera the average reader can get their hands on either.

3. It does seem odd that the 4K cameras from other manufacturers are generally being written about as though they are breaking new ground with this resolution - it's not just FDtimes. And to be fair, Jon's piece on Sony did, though, focus only on Sony. It didn't talk about REDs developments and contributions, but it didn't mention what Panasonic, Arri, Canon, etc. have in the works, either. And, of course, Sony's approach in their new camera seems (at least to me) somewhat nebulous. They definitely seem to be taking their own approach to things, but then again I don't know any more than anyone else. NAB...

EDIT: Perhaps Jon just feels that there are better places to get news on RED...like here! Where there is ample discussion, first-person Q&A with those who have the greatest and latest, BTS shots, R3Ds to play with, etc.
 
OptiTek said:
Anthony I would be very careful accusing Jon of a foul play.
The guy has absolutely stellar integrity and he's earned it.
Besides I know him personally and NEVER, ever heard any unprofessional comment from him.
I think you should consider the effect on Reduser's reputation posting stuff like this. I know you mean no harm but this is internet- don't forget...
Click to expand...

I don't know Jon personally, but I totally agree with this. Besides, F&D Times (the - great - print newsletter) was probably one of the first publications to acknowledge the existence of Red by putting a picture of the Red One mock-up, the titanium "R" and a short article on the front page back in 2006, while a lot of people online were loudly screaming "scam".
For those who know him only through the FD Times website, he's also a teacher, he's won MANY awards for his work, he's the author of all the Arri film cameras books, director of the great documentary Cinematographer Style (shot on film, by the way), and ASC member.
 
Well... 4K is not Sony's push. They are 2nd. We're glad they finally joined the 5 year old party. Pretty easy stuff.

Jim
 
I'm sorry, I don't know Jon Fauer but I was immediately struck at how much of a press release this article sounded like.
Not to wave the RED flag here but the verbage about Sony "has the potential to be the big breakthrough into practical 4K production" is a little off mark no?

With multitudes of features/TV, etc being or having shot on RED, including award winning and high budget studio pictures, this would seem like a bit of a SONY push...

I'm not accusing anyone of anything or being a format/acquisition warrior, it just bothered me as someone working deeply in 4K prod/post for 3+ years.

Jason
 
Jannard said:
Well... 4K is not Sony's push. They are 2nd. We're glad they finally joined the 5 year old party. Pretty easy stuff.

Jim
Click to expand...

Thanks Jim, that's why I felt the tone of the article and the "practical 4k" comment to be a bit strange.

Happy they were one of the first publications to mention the Red One, and hope they will show support/coverage for the Epic at some point with as much enthusiasm as they have this new Sony concept or the Alexa.

That's all I'm saying ...

Anthony
 
Another thing ...

Another thing ...

Not that the publication is expected to follow Reduser or anything, but just little things like this post seem odd to me ...

http://www.fdtimes.com/news/4k/more-k/

When Red or Epic is not mentioned, when it's so clear that Red (and Jim especially) have been the biggest 4k advocates in the industry.

I mean ... are we biased? Does the rest of the industry not see Red as THE 4k pioneer and leader?

I guess it's a compliment to FDTimes, because if it were a lesser publication I wouldn't care -- but since I do really like it, I wish there were more reasonable credit and attention paid to what Red is doing.

Anyway, I've vented enough and will let it go now ...

Anthony
 
With someone with no bias or feet to step on, the article is a press release with a lot of adjectives.

No one should feel the obligation to mention RED when discussing this type of camera, especially a publication sponsored by Sony. Everyone here should just be glad this isn't the way RED provides information about it's company. Such a breath of fresh air to get real news from the real source.
 
Jannard said:
Well... 4K is not Sony's push. They are 2nd. We're glad they finally joined the 5 year old party. Pretty easy stuff.

Jim
Click to expand...

Not to mention there is also now a groundbreaking 5K Camera out! ;)

It is great to see Sony pushing into 4K which will force the others to follow suit. Resolution is a big step, but I feel it's just as important to look at compression options out there. After working with R3D's/Raw Files from Red, it's hard to imagine going back.
 
OptiTek said:
Anthony I would be very careful accusing Jon of a foul play.
The guy has absolutely stellar integrity and he's earned it.
Besides I know him personally and NEVER, ever heard any unprofessional comment from him.
I think you should consider the effect on Reduser's reputation posting stuff like this. I know you mean no harm but this is internet- don't forget...
Click to expand...

Jacek, is Jon more technical or more on artistic side guy?
Sometimes I wonder what prompted him to put this statement in his article:

Behind the PL mount, there’s an 8K sensor: 8768 x 2324 pixel single CMOS sensor (that’s 20.4 Megapixels) — Super35 3-perf size, 16-bit RAW output, 16:8:8.

I see sometimes reporters getting it completely mixed up on tech details but most of his articles are pretty technical....

Andrew
 
that's just their marketing push for new terminology, right next to their Q67 (in my hypothetical garbage can). if we're really lucky, we can record it to tape! so exciting.
 
Looks to me that he was given tech specs by Sony, and copy pasted. I mean, when it's a prototype camera, and the only people with any info on it are Sony, and there is no way to real world test them yet - that's the sort of thing that is going to go out there.

Other than that - the article is clear, probably accurate, and if you can read between the lines actually shows that Sony still doesn't have their game plan together (Debayering for instant viewing or playback will be available with external real time hardware - i.e you can't actually monitor from the camera itself at this point!)

He doesn't actually say anywhere it's the first 4K camera - and I can forgive him the fact for saying the bar has been raised even - because RED has always jumped well clear of the bar when it comes to picture quality and resolution and will no doubt continue to do so. :)

It's a nice peek at what Sony are doing, and we should all be excited that they are doing it - but I think also the opening lines also have all the reservation that is needed "This could be historic".

A few years ago it would DEFINITELY been historic - which is why in histories eyes RED will always be the first.
 
Harry Clark said:
I agree; Jon Fauer is a really smart and fair guy who takes great interest in all things that make images. And he has done articles on Red; maybe not the full-bore factory tour ones like he's done for Arri and Cooke, sure, but the camera and company has been covered.
Maybe he has requested such a tour/ interview and been rebuffed by Red. None of us know. But I don't think Jon is a Red-basher by any stretch.
Cheers,
Harry
Click to expand...

And exactly what Red factory is he going to tour? And when he finds it, can he tell those line workers to get off their duffs, put down the cups of coffee, swallow the danishes, and make us some #$%@! Epics and Scarlets!

But in all honesty, it does read like Sony proofed that article.
 
Andrew M. said:
Jacek, is Jon more technical or more on artistic side guy?
Sometimes I wonder what prompted him to put this statement in his article:

Behind the PL mount, there’s an 8K sensor: 8768 x 2324 pixel single CMOS sensor (that’s 20.4 Megapixels) — Super35 3-perf size, 16-bit RAW output, 16:8:8.

I see sometimes reporters getting it completely mixed up on tech details but most of his articles are pretty technical....

Andrew
Click to expand...

Yeah, I've been meaning to ask what is "16:8:8?" Maybe it's real... or Sony missed a typo, LOL, J/K!
 
I do think, now that I give it some thought, that Sony should be applauded for their push (and from my understanding, it was a rather strong push) to get 4K projectors out in theaters. IMO, this is an important piece of the puzzle.

And the 16:8:8 thing is still a bit of a mystery. I hope it gets some clarification at NAB.
 
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