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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

RCX-Pro is getting sooo cool, but what about montoring?

Gunleik Groven

Gunleik Groven

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Really like what has happened with RCX-P

But as there is no way to properly monitor HDRx or GPU effects in it, it kind of bites itself a bit in the butt... :)

The general playout through rocket that was on the roadmap early on, is a thing I've decided NOT to hold my breath for...

Second option would then be to play out through AJA/Decklink...

Is ths on the roadmap?

Hope so!

Keep it up!

Gunleik
 
The monitor issues you're referring to is not possible, as that would require sending the processed signal back into RR. Red doesn't make the card, nor does it design it. It only supplies the firmware for it. As far as hardware goes, Red just re badger it, that is all. The card is right here, made by DVS:
http://www.dvs.de/products/video-boards/atomix.html
So, it's really not up to Red to redesign it...
 
I know... That's why I am wondering when a BM/AJA solution will come

I also knew it was an atomix with special firmware.

Doesn't matter.

I can see stuff out of resolve, but RCX is getting so many cool features now that are RGB and not meta-based, that it would be cool to have a proper way looking at those images...


Cheers!

G
 
Gunleik Groven said:
I know... That's why I am wondering when a BM/AJA solution will come

I also knew it was an atomix with special firmware.

Doesn't matter.

I can see stuff out of resolve, but RCX is getting so many cool features now that are RGB and not meta-based, that it would be cool to have a proper way looking at those images...


Cheers!

G
Click to expand...

BM designs and produces Decklink, Red doesn't. So, it's not so easy for Red, as it is for BM.
Also, Resolve does exactly what you're asking Red to do. They process debayered data and display it. So, technically, it is already done. May be Red can convince BM to open up their SDK for decklink? I guess that will happen right after red opens up their R3D and stops competing with Resolve:-)
 
Sure... I use resolve everyday, now

Still, RCX is getting new and cool features, conforms fantasticly and has a great signalchain internaly. And working with HDRx is sweet with Magic motion.

RCX is becoming the iMovie for r3s Storm tried to become, rapidly. And there are def ways resolve UI-wise does not really make the meta-thingy simple, which RCX does smoothly (naturally).
Tons of projects need to go out in Resolve, but RCX-P is so allmost there for the rest.

I won't put a high-profile TV-show or fearure online in RCX.... For a while, at least. But for many smaller tasks, it is really getting there as a meta/primary grader. With the RGB effects added and everything gettin' into RCX before it gets to the SDK, sometimes one really need it...

remember when RLF was only in RCX and not in the SDK?

Not long ago, and it lasted a while...
 
I don't disagree. But as I said, design of RR is a hinderance right now and it's not up to Red to do anything about it. I can't see BM getting into bed with Red, especially after seeing what happen to Scratch and Storm. May be AJA will. They do not have competing products with Red, as BM does and that may help them to get back into the game. Who knows...
 
My bad, then... And I dunno squat about programming... :)

But when an AJA or BM is installed, it is also available for all Core Video apps? Or not?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Core_Video

It's available on a systemlevel, as far as I have understood. The drivers for the card is not in FCP or Resolve or Color or Quicktime, but these apps can access and use the hardware...

This was how I thought it worked, as the hardware is installed on a system-level, not application level.

So I thought it would be an issue of making RCX-P work with Core Video, or whatever accesses the cards, not the other way around...

But you are probably right.

Would have loved David, Deanan or Rob to jump in on this and clarify!

It's not soooo long ago that Deanan stated that playout through the RR was still on the roadmap.
Now, that this seems to have been dropped, the issue of monitoring in RCX has become a different one...

As it is "Pro" now and all :))

Thanks Jake for your answers!

Cheers

G
 
Gunleik Groven said:
I also knew it was an atomix with special firmware.
Click to expand...

Actually, neither one of you knows. But it's the internet so everyone is right even if you're wrong... :)

Outputting through RR back from GPU is still under evaluation. Non trivial.
 
Deanan said:
Actually, neither one of you knows. But it's the internet so you must be right :)

Outputting back from GPU is still under evaluation.
Click to expand...

LOL!

they do look kinda similar in many respects, though... But of course you're right!

Output through GPU as in RR or as in AJA/BM?

Cheers and thanks!

G
 
Deanan said:
Actually, neither one of you knows. But it's the internet so everyone is right even if you're wrong... :)

Outputting through RR back from GPU is still under evaluation. Non trivial.
Click to expand...

I never said, that I know:-) All my musings are based on publicly available information. Red is just one of many companies, that uses this card. And I did say, that getting back into RR is not that simple. Foundry found this out a while ago, when they hoped to do the monitor output for their looks.
 
It's not often that three of the smartest guys in the business come together in one thread. So let me aks you three guys this question: What is the best way you can think of to monitor an RCX Pro image that includes HDRx? Is there anything better than a computer monitor profiled to REC 709?

(I mean best way given the current state of things, not theoretical.)
 
Fuller... :)

You know how to make an introduction that makes it impossible to answer... :)

But you're onto something... That's the current state of stuff.

Of course you could go resolve or even Color if my memory serves me.

Won't get far in Color with Epic r3d's I gues, though (suddenly realizing that I haven't opened Color for other stuff than peeking at channels from Alexa footy for a while...)
 
jake blackstone said:
I never said, that I know:-) All my musings are based on publicly available information. Red is just one of many companies, that uses this card. And I did say, that getting back into RR is not that simple. Foundry found this out a while ago, when they hoped to do the monitor output for their looks.
Click to expand...

You're making an assumption that is incorrect.
 
Gunleik Groven said:
Fuller... :)

But you're onto something... That's the current state of stuff.

Of course you could go resolve or even Color if my memory serves me.
Click to expand...

OK. I just wanted to be sure there wasn't some trick out there that I was missing. Monitoring is kind of the weak spot in the RCX path right now. All good until you get to HDRx. Then you're flying blind. Well, not blind, really, but looking through a bit of fog.
 
D Fuller said:
OK. I just wanted to be sure there wasn't some trick out there that I was missing. Monitoring is kind of the weak spot in the RCX path right now. All good until you get to HDRx. Then you're flying blind. Well, not blind, really, but looking through a bit of fog.
Click to expand...

LOL

that's kinda the point of this thread... :)
 
Gunleik Groven said:
LOL

that's kinda the point of this thread... :)
Click to expand...

Yeah, sorry, I forgot where I was for a minute. :)

In an odd way, it's reassuring that you don't have any better answers than I do on this one. Hope Red has a better answer down the road.
 
it's actually very reassuring...I thought I was missing something obvious. this stuff is coming down the pipeline so fast and furious, it's hard to know what's fully cooked -- or how to cook it most effectively -- sometimes.
 
Since RED is always progressive and RGB, why not monitor with a calibrated HP Dreamcolor? Not bad at all, and the data pipeline will stay fast.
 
BMD do have an SDK for their cards, and I expect AJA do too. However the way applications send video to the cards is using them as QuickTime VOUT devices, which from what I understand from developers is (1) a real pain to implement, and (2) involves QuickTime, with all the gamma, levels and colour inconsistencies that introduces!

Hopefully there will be AV Foundation based SDKs for the cards available soon, which will give developers more control over things.

Or if RED can pull off the (I realise very much non-trivial) trick of sending image data back to the Rocket output from the GPU in real time, that would be ideal. I would love to see the possibility of having a system where the Rocket was the only SDI card, without the need for a BMD or AJA – one more free PCIe slot.

Uli Plank said:
Since RED is always progressive and RGB, why not monitor with a calibrated HP Dreamcolor? Not bad at all, and the data pipeline will stay fast.
Click to expand...

That's fine in some situations, but to fit in to a larger infrastructure HD-SDI is required.
 
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