RCX DNxHD to Avid to AE CS6 to DCP

[Jeff Wong]

So I successfully did an offline edit on Avid MC6 via RCX DNxHD 36's, and then brought it back to RCX for a set of online DNxHD 175's. I'm masking 2.39 so I did a bunch of headroom reframes and rudimentary camera stabilization using Avid's Resize filter.

Now I'm considering a 2K DCP for film festivals, which MC/DNxHD doesn't support, and I'm wondering if there's a way to keep these Avid Resize filter settings when I go from Avid to After Effects CS6. Unfortunately I can't test Automatic Duck (or whatever method) as I don't have CS6 myself and I was going to bring my project over to a friend's PC.

To complicate things further, I would love to keep my RCX settings at the higher res, specifically the HDRX and 'Clarity' slider (does AE have something similar?). So even if I manage to bring my Avid project, Resize filters and all, to AE, I would then have to unlink the DNxHD stuff and link back to either r3d or DPX or something at 2K - is this possible?

And then the final step would be OpenDCP or CineAsset...thoughts?

 

[Bruce Allen]

I would suggest that there is really very little difference between 1080p and 2K for film festival display... not really worth all of the hassle.

Your time spent redoing the 1080p project at 2K would be better spent on pretty much anything else in the finishing chain - eg grading, sound mixing, titles, noise reduction...

That said:

- I think CS6 doesn't need Automatic Duck. You can export your Avid project into Premiere directly (Premiere can read AAF).
- Not sure if there are any way to get your RCX settings to translate across
- Best option would be to render DPX out of RCX and conform in Premiere... but Premiere wasn't smart enough to conform last time I checked
- Possibly you could render DPX out of RCX at 2K, then load into Resolve (it IS smart enough to conform based on timecode in DPX file, etc)... and Resolve can also read the Avid resize settings.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

 

[Luis Otero]

...And then the final step would be OpenDCP or CineAsset...thoughts?

OpenDCP, with footage appropriately graded in true, full-fleshed RGB, and a reliable LUT to transform the conversion to XYZ in order to by-pass OpenDCP's restricted XYZ/Gamma conversion capabilities (only sRGB and Rec.709).

My 2 cents...

 

[Jeff Wong]

Super quick replies, thanks a lot guys. I'm still doing some sound mixing (any guides on what levels I should be at for a theatre?) and one reason I wanted to bring it into AE was so I could do some more noise reduction. As for colour grading, I'm pretty happy with what I've got and can't really spend any more to get it to a post house, hence OpenDCP...

Does After Effects do a proper colour conversion to XYZ? Any guides on that?

 

[Luis Otero]

Jeff,

The sound specs are as well detailed as the color is on the DCI specs. Do not have the link now, but it is pretty easy to searching on the web.

Re: color conversion, any decent software that can use 3D LUT should work to create the correct TIFF in XYX. Since it is easy for me as colorist, I do all color conversion within Resolve (DPX for film-out, the TIFF for DCP, the uncompressed files for Rec.709 and ProRes 422 for sRG ready for web distribution.

 

[Jeff Wong]

Hi Luis,
Do you recommend that I try DaVinci Lite? How hard is it to keep my Avid titles, credits, Resize filter settings if I go from Avid to DaVinci? Is it as simple as Import AAF? Not to mention I have no idea how to reduce noise in DaVinci...

Thanks again!
Jeff

*Edit Just realized I'd have to use DaVinci 9 if I want to use RedColor 3, which is what I used for my online in RCX Pro, and that's not released yet for PC...

 

[Luis Otero]

Jeff,

You can use current Resolve Lite (the Beta that they have available for anyone); they already support the RedColor/Gamma 3, so that should not be an impediment. My recommendation will be biased since that Resolve IS our grading system. The Resolve noise reduction is outstanding, and nothing complicated; it is just a slider...

My son, which is the editor, uses FCP, and I know that if the footage we are grading has the same dimension specs than the one you are editing, the resizing will be maintained. I assume this is the same for Avid footage since is not a function of the editing software used, but Resolve related.

As for the title cards and credits, if the roundtrip works the same in Avid as it works in FCP, they will be reconnected automatically, so that should not be an issue you should worry about. Just verify this before trying it on the Resolve manual, or better, call Dwaine or Mark @ BMD customer support.

But, the area that I need to stress the most is that you MUST start with a real RGB calibrated monitoring system so you can do all those conversions pretty easily, so you can offer such options to your clients, or to yourself if it is your own project. Starting the grading in Rec.709 color space has strong limitations. A lot of people do it, but you are wasting a lot of gamut possibilities, and if it is projected in a big screen via DCP/film-out, the difference is even more apparent.

 

[ericyoung]

Resolve Lite does not have Noise Reduction enabled - you only get it in the full version. Also I've heard it's not the best NR option out there, although I'm sure it's OK.

 

[Jeff Wong]

Unfortunately I don't think I have a proper calibrated monitor at home, though I can take it in to the school's SD broadcast monitors for a colour pass. In any case, can someone tell me if DNxHD files from RCX (MXF wrapped for Avid) are 709 or RGB? I'm considering bringing in my Avid timeline to After Effects and uprezzing from 1920 to 2048. For a couple of problematic noisy shots I will manually replace with raw r3d's that I will work on in AE. I'm still not sure how to smoothly Pro Import from Avid to AE though, are there specific AAF export settings I should be looking for?

 

[Luis Otero]

You are right that the "Lite" version does not have the NR enabled, nor it works with OpenCL, only with CUDA cards. However, I have to challenge that notion that the NR is not the best. It might not be perfect, but it is among the best in the industry. All my projects, once in a while, need some NR help. I do not hesitate to use it while I am grading, nor any of my clients have been disappointed at the results. For me, that is the ultimate test, since they are paying for the end result...

 

[Luis Otero]

... In any case, can someone tell me if DNxHD files from RCX (MXF wrapped for Avid) are 709 or RGB? ...

If you select RedColor2 and RedLog Film it is an exact equivalent to Cineon, which is "pure" RGB. And a perfect starting point speaking as a colorist: low contrast/saturation, high dynamic range. A perfect clean slate to start any grading.

 

[Jeff Wong]

Now I'm trying to online in r3d in AE CS6 from an Avid AAF - how do I relink the r3d's from the MXF's in AE?

I tried conforming in Avid, but because I used imported MXF's from RCX Pro for the offline, when I Linked to AMA for the r3d trims (which came from an EDL from Avid back into RCX Pro), the AMA files had no Tape and only Source File (with .R3D extensions) and the offline MXF's (Tape but no Source File) from the newly decomposed sequence wouldn't relink to the AMA's...

Thanks!
Jeff

 

[MichaelP]

v6 brought the ability to relink between sources being tracked between Source File and Tape. AMA tracks via Source Files, and RCX (and other third party apps) using the Avid SDK track the filename in Tape. But - there was still a limitation for spanned files as the filename doesn't match exactly since AMA puts the full name plus the span (_001) and the extension (.r3d). The next version will address that. For now, you need to export DNxHD at the quality you want to finish at, and relink that media inside the project.

Michael