Raven.... Everything Just Changed.

[Terry VerHaar]

So which way would everyone go with these two options?

buying a used Epic-x Dragon 6K kit with everything I need (10 batteries, plenty of media, 3 mounts, cages, ribs, shoulder mounts etc etc etc.)

Or a new Raven with 2 batteries, 1 mini-mag, base I/O, couple swat rails and a handle.

Both are the same price...This will be my first RED

If you are just now buying into RED and have to have the camera soon (but no sooner than early next year, of course), then I'd definitely go for the new DSMC2 body style - which is currently Raven or Weapon. This will give you the most longevity for your accessories. With Raven, there are some limitations but it will let you lean into the future path with RED. If you can wait, and would prefer not to have fixed mount, then wait awhile to see what comes next.

If you have to have a camera before February and decide to go Epic Dragon, let me know because I have a ton of accessories I'd be willing to sell as I migrate to wherever the new Scarlet Dragon path leads me.

 

[sam karr]

So which way would everyone go with these two options?

buying a used Epic-x Dragon 6K kit with everything I need (10 batteries, plenty of media, 3 mounts, cages, ribs, shoulder mounts etc etc etc.)

Or a new Raven with 2 batteries, 1 mini-mag, base I/O, couple swat rails and a handle.

Both are the same price...This will be my first RED

At the same price ....? Dragon with plenty of media, 10 batteries, cages, mounts, ribs, shoulder mounts etc.....
I would buy the Epic, sell it 3 or 4 times the price and buy a Raven or wait for the new scarlet.
Either you're the luckiest guy in the world or it's a scam.

 

[Adam Griffith]

You must keep in mind the current Australian $ vs USD... it's not as crazy deal as you first think.

 

[Matthew Quinn]

In my opinion buying a used red right now SOUNDS like a good idea.. But with how fast things are moving, and some of the prices on the new tech like raven there is really no reason NOT to keep current with the new body type.. Now if the only option was weapon or used epic dragon that opinion would be different

 

[Alex Doctor]

You must keep in mind the current Australian $ vs USD... it's not as crazy deal as you first think.

I could be wrong but what Adam is referring to is that you might be able to find a used epic kit between $20 and $25k AUD

The Raven with just the IO expander is $15500 AUD plus another 10% import so $16.5k without anything else. so they would roughly come in at the same value.

The added bonus of the Raven Adam is that you are in the Weapon world. At the moment the only way for epic to upgrade to lowest version of weapon is another $30k AUD and you wouldn't be able to upgrade the sensor in a couple years without going to weapon first. But then within two years your could pay for your investment and sell the epic then.

So taking out finances, do you require a lighter version of a Red camera for gimbals etc.. or just highest res, still very sexy camera

 

[Adam Griffith]

I paid the deposit for the Epic Dragon kit yesterday. Sorry Raven

 

[Adam Griffith]

I could be wrong but what Adam is referring to is that you might be able to find a used epic kit between $20 and $25k AUD

The Raven with just the IO expander is $15500 AUD plus another 10% import so $16.5k without anything else. so they would roughly come in at the same value.

The added bonus of the Raven Adam is that you are in the Weapon world. At the moment the only way for epic to upgrade to lowest version of weapon is another $30k AUD and you wouldn't be able to upgrade the sensor in a couple years without going to weapon first. But then within two years your could pay for your investment and sell the epic then.

So taking out finances, do you require a lighter version of a Red camera for gimbals etc.. or just highest res, still very sexy camera

I went onto red.com and added everything to the shopping cart that is included in this second hand kit - it came to $75,000 AUD before import so $82,500 to my door with the current exchange rates.
I wont say exactly how much I got it for but it was well less than half the new price.

The raven kit was $33,000ish with only 2 batteries, 1 media card and the base IO plus a couple rails and a handle to get me started.
the downsides of raven to me were - only 4.5k (crop factor), lower light performance over the Dragon, Fixed OLPF and EF mount.
I use the Ronin so either brain will work with that. I dont intend on strapping it to a RPA/UAV so thats a non-issue. I'd prefer resolution over weight saving to answer your question.

Biggest thing for me is: A lot of people are going to be chasing the Weapon and Raven so I figure a lot of 2nd hand parts will be flooding the market soon enough which would enable me to build on the current kit for minimal investment.

 

[Alex Doctor]

You're totally right there have been some great deals since the weapon bodies were announced. I've certainly been able to kit out my camera at a far lower price than expected. The price slashing has calmed down a bit, but sounds like you nearly got a full kit anyway.

I went onto red.com and added everything to the shopping cart that is included in this second hand kit - it came to $75,000 AUD before import so $82,500 to my door with the current exchange rates.
I wont say exactly how much I got it for but it was well less than half the new price.

The raven kit was $33,000ish with only 2 batteries, 1 media card and the base IO plus a couple rails and a handle to get me started.
the downsides of raven to me were - only 4.5k (crop factor), lower light performance over the Dragon, Fixed OLPF and EF mount.
I use the Ronin so either brain will work with that. I dont intend on strapping it to a RPA/UAV so thats a non-issue. I'd prefer resolution over weight saving to answer your question.

Biggest thing for me is: A lot of people are going to be chasing the Weapon and Raven so I figure a lot of 2nd hand parts will be flooding the market soon enough which would enable me to build on the current kit for minimal investment.

 

[Matthew Quinn]

I was just walking my dog, and I started thinking about holding the raven in my hands, all shiny new and bolting rig components to it.. I'm getting excited. Feb isn't far away at all!! I've already started thinking about the first thing i want to shoot with it, and what lens i want to try first, and all that jazz.

 

[Josh K]

Definitely makes the Raven more attractive! Not that it wasn't a good deal before but that I just don't like dealing with smaller sensors.

 

[Troy Bakewell]

Time for another hint Jarred?

 

[Elsie N]

Definitely makes the Raven more attractive! Not that it wasn't a good deal before but that I just don't like dealing with smaller sensors.

I'm liking the extra area on the sides to allow for re-positioning left or right in post taking advantage of the rule of thirds. Not as good as 5 or 6k that allows for even more leeway vertically, but I think we see the center of the frame more intently and will likely always get that part of the framing right.

The good news is this is a Dragon sensor and has a very low compression ratio. That coupled with the Dragon-specific options in Redcine should make for a VERY good picture, even without scaling down.

I know Jim will probably have me thrown off Reduser ("upscaling not spoken here" '-) for even mentioning scaling up, but I think this image should allow for that in limited usage, when necessary.