Bruce Allen
Well-known member
Stuart from RED is quoted saying that the Rec 709 color gamut outputting from the RedRay is "stated 12-bit 4:2:2 or 8 bit 4:4:4 output spec is actually the technical spec of the HDMI 1.4 standard at 4K and Ultra HD resolution...
... the actual .RED codec performance exceeds that."
RedRay isn't limited to Rec 709. It's a technical aspect based from current consumer technology. They are prepared to go further, especially with the Crimson Projector.
"However in our CRIMSON projector, where we have an internal REDRAY player and full control over the signal path, the HDMI 1.4 specs for bit rate and frame rate and color gamut are not limitations, so we can use the full capabilities of the .RED file specifcation." -Stuart English
Awesome - thanks Justin!
It only said 709 on RED's page. I had asked about anything being allowed beyond 709 early on in the Q&A thread and read through several pages, not getting an answer. Glad this has been answered now.
I guess I have to wait and see what the full .RED file specification is. Which, as usual for RED, is not specified yet. I've been asking on the forum for color primaries and gamut info for years now and have also personally asked RE this at multiple RED events.
Hope they settle on something. Bonus points if it matches an industry standard.
It would really suck if we had to master for:
- 709
- DCI P3
- UHDTV (there is already a wide gamut space defined for 8K)
- Sony xvYCC
- REDSPACE
I really hope that REDSPACE just turns out to be the same as the already defined, standardized wide gamut space for UHDTV / 8K.
And with the REDCODE raw codec, anyone can make skintones look any way they want. That's one of the reasons I've embraced RED so much. I've been editing, coloring and conforming R3D footage since 2006 and must say that the ability and knowledge I've gained over the last few years regarding color science and skintones has been remarkable.
Justin, sure, you can push overall skin tones to any color you want, using RAW. Or without using RAW, just use a color corrector and push a secondary anywhere you want.
But skin tone is not just one overall color. Skin tone is subtle variation in color across a face. Which I don't think RED picks up well.
I hope that one day RED will be able to pick up those variations in color as beautifully as film currently can. Or just as well as the best DSLR still cameras...
At the moment, acquiring in RED is somewhat like acquiring under lighting conditions with a really low CRI. You can pick up an overall tone but some info is irretrievably lost, IMHO.
I have the ability to make the histogram, luminance, and color values push any way I want, with no hesitation and very little comprises. I'm still confused when people claim that RED footage doesn't have great skin tones. Where are they seeing these images? I've certainly haven't produced any images like those in awhile, unless I purposely desaturated the images.
What RED feature film has great, natural skin tones, in your opinion? To me they all lack variation in subtle skin colorations across the face. Sometimes this works (District 9, Social Network, GWTDT), other times not so much (compare the last Pirates of the Caribbean movie to the ones shot on film!).
So yes, for an actor-centric drama involving some naturalistic skin tones, RED would not be my first choice. Film would be. Then Alexa (although it is overrated in terms of skin tones, it is still better than RED).
So yeah, I guess I am a Tarantino-style old fogey
Anyway, cheers!
Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com