projecting the dailies

[Fergus Meiklejohn]

I'd like to project the dailies every evening, because I think the Director will prefer that experience, being more like a film workflow, and like cinema.. Can we project from REDCINE? RAW debayered or with a simple look created in the app? My hunch is to avoid NLE complications if possible..
The Viper is offered over here with 2K dailies projection as part of the rental package. 2K projectors are so much more expensive than 1080P, can anyone suggest a simple workflow for RED Dailies screening?

thanks amigos..

Also, I have heard some nonsense recently about RED coming from the mouth of a Viper rental house: "workflow is madness.. 12 hours to copy 1 hour of footage..". I'll say no more..:usd:

 

[jimhare]

I saw this done at Fox Australia recently. We shot on the backlot for a few hours and then projected the 'rushes' in 2k. Scratch did a great job of taking all the .r3d files and playing them immediately in multiple resolutions and instant grades. We also played individual clips in Red Alert!

My understanding is the Red Cine will allow you to play multiple clips immediately, applying different ASA and grade options etc.

So I would say what you want to do is possible and completely practical.

And as for copy times, we didn't find anything like that. If you have a fast CF transfer device (like firewire) you can move stuff across very quickly. Maybe they were talking about transcoding or something. Either way, it seems like most of those comments come out of a lack of understanding or good old fashion fear!

Jim

 

[Fergus Meiklejohn]

thanks Jim

yeah I reckon it is "good old fashioned fear" alright. But that's silly. The Viper is a good camera.. I think one of the sources of fear is the difficulty of buying and receiving a RED camera tomorrow. These big production houses have probably made enough to pay for their Viper's already, but they couln't buy a batch of new REDs for delivery next month, even if they wanted to.. I'm sure it'll all have calmed down by the end of next year.

But projection..! Scratch would be great and we can email Lucas directly about pricing..:matrix:
It would be great to be able to project 1080P rather than 2K images from REDCine or Scratch, because the projectors are so much cheaper and the resolution is almost the same. Is that an issue? (are there transcoding times?)
I'm supposing that a MAC Pro, HD-SDi card, BM Decklink pro and a 1080P DLP projector would be the mimimum I would need to project the dailies.. Could I get lighter than that? Could I use a Macbook Pro?

 

[M Most]

I'm supposing that a MAC Pro, HD-SDi card, BM Decklink pro and a 1080P DLP projector would be the mimimum I would need to project the dailies.. Could I get lighter than that? Could I use a Macbook Pro?

Not if you're using Scratch. It runs only on Windows, and requires an NVidia Quadro FX 4500 SDI card for 2K projection. You should also be aware that real time 2K extractions from R3d files are not a reality at this point, at least not at 24 fps. You can, however, play 1/4 res images in real time using Scratch and project that via a DLP Cinema projector, with color correction also done in real time, directly from the r3d file. The only thing you lose is a bit of sharpness.

 

[Stuart English]

Projection

Projection

As soon as we release Build 9 there will be another option for consideration. Playback the files from the RED-ONE via the HDMI port. Yes it will be 1280 x 720p with 3:2 puldown, but its a perfect video format to feed into a low cost home theater projector such as Panasonic's PT-AX200U or equivalant.

In playback the HDMI and HD Preview outputs are "clean feed" i.e there are no frame guides, Surround View or other overlays visible in the video.

 

[Fergus Meiklejohn]

As soon as we release Build 9 there will be another option for consideration. Playback the files from the RED-ONE via the HDMI port. Yes it will be 1280 x 720p with 3:2 puldown, but its a perfect video format to feed into a low cost home theater projector such as Panasonic's PT-AX200U or equivalant.

In playback the HDMI and HD Preview outputs are "clean feed" i.e there are no frame guides, Surround View or other overlays visible in the video.

that's a good idea! Assuming we are transferring the media then wiping and reusing the CF cards, will we be able to copy files to a RED Drive and playback from there?

Also, 720P is cool, but will there be 1080P playback in camera enabled at any point in the future?

 

[Alexis Hanawalt]

I've been wondering about this - specifically how I could project 4k camera tests, etc., at a theatre like the Nuart in West LA. I don't know what file format options there are for feeding a 4k image into that projector, but a close friend is a manager there, so I have access. How did the Red Team set up their demo last year?

 

[Casey Green]

As soon as we release Build 9 there will be another option for consideration. Playback the files from the RED-ONE via the HDMI port. Yes it will be 1280 x 720p with 3:2 puldown, but its a perfect video format to feed into a low cost home theater projector such as Panasonic's PT-AX200U or equivalant.

In playback the HDMI and HD Preview outputs are "clean feed" i.e there are no frame guides, Surround View or other overlays visible in the video.

Hi Stuart,

Thanks for the info. This got me thinkin'. (look out!)

In Camera playback mode, there will of course need to be a GUI to navigate thru the clips, most likely on the LCD/EVF output. (probably showing thumbnails? - say, 9-16 at a time in a grid-type view)

You've probably already thought of this... BUT

If it's not too hard, would it possible to add a thumbnail playback option? (when you move selector to the clip of choice, after a beat or two, it's thumbnail starts playing). This way, if a clip has a black first frame or is difficult to differentiate between other clips, you can watch the thumbnail playing back before selecting it?)

I would think this could be a real-time process that the camera cpu could handle, rather than building thumbnail files?

It would probably be good to allow the user to toggle this option.

What do ya think?

thanks for any incite into the Camera Playback controls. (btw, any UI pics available?)

 

[jimhare]

thanks Jim

yeah I reckon it is "good old fashioned fear" alright. But that's silly. The Viper is a good camera.. I think one of the sources of fear is the difficulty of buying and receiving a RED camera tomorrow.

Hey Fergus,
Exactly right. Viper and Genesis are beautiful! They probably aren't afraid of the RED itself, but the fact that the next year will be a waiting game for many while they decide what to do. Everything is changing, but no one really knows into what exactly. Will it be a sea of owner/operators, or will rental rates come crashing down with lower cost units and plenty of them?

I wouldn't want to be a big rental house right now, simply due to the uncertainty.

Jim

 

[jimhare]

As soon as we release Build 9 there will be another option for consideration. Playback the files from the RED-ONE via the HDMI port. Yes it will be 1280 x 720p with 3:2 puldown, but its a perfect video format to feed into a low cost home theater projector such as Panasonic's PT-AX200U or equivalant.

In playback the HDMI and HD Preview outputs are "clean feed" i.e there are no frame guides, Surround View or other overlays visible in the video.

Thanks Stuart, that sounds great! Will HD-SDI also be active for playback (even if only in the future) or will it mainly be HDMI?

Cheers,

Jim

 

[Sanjin Jukic]

CineformHD

CineformHD

For example, from REDalert you export in CineformHD codec,
then you do a choice of your dailies/rushes,
then you do a bit of the first CC in FCP,
then you export in QT CineformHD and show to your director,
producer, crew etc... dailies/rushes.

So why CineformHD?

Yesterday I downloaded free trail with CineformHD codec for Mac
and found out that QT mov files with CineformHD codec are 2x (2 times)
smaller than Apple ProRes HQ files.

Maybe you just need that smaller files desperately when you are mobile.

AND no any difference in a picture quality.

ALSO playback is very smooth.

LINK>>>

 

[Stuart English]

Playback - HD-SDI ?

Playback - HD-SDI ?

Thanks Stuart, that sounds great! Will HD-SDI also be active for playback (even if only in the future) or will it mainly be HDMI?

Cheers,

Jim

You have the same active output options on playback as you do on record, so yes.