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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Projected rental rates for Epic?

My guess is 20%-30% more per day/month depending on your market. But this is just my opinion amd not because of any expertise in camera rental.
 
I would also think that it would depend on what modules are going out with camera.

Brain, lens and handles would not cash as much as Brain, I/O mod, h.264 mod, dual CF mod, ect ect ect.
 
Lucrative and High at first, while the cameras are still scarce, then rental rates will floor as the market gets flooded with scarlets and epics just as how a lot of R1's have dropped in rates because it's so competitive with packages now... then it's back to this moment, all about the talent that comes with the camera, awaiting news on the next epic releases ^____^
 
first.. by the time stage 3 rolls around epics will be pretty saturated (at least in bigger citys)

I dont even want to know what red one rates will be at that point...
red one without Mysterium x = wont get rented PERIOD!
Red One with Mysterium X = 2-400 for a complete package (probably not including lenses.. but maybe.. who knows)

Epic X guys.. at first.. while there are >500
will probably pull in 1000-1200 per day... but most likely there will still be those scroungers in the low numbers who will drop the worth for all of us..


I imagine once quite a few epix x's come out.. 500+
the rates will be similar to RED ONE prices now.

and here is the sad thing about all the modules...

those wont get you anymore money..
people will expect that they just come with the camera..
or move on to the next guy who does have it.. and will do it at the same price as the guy before without...

so yeah.. dont shoot the messenger.. but rentals will still not be a very lucrative biz plan.
 
Zakaree Sandberg said:
first.. by the time stage 3 rolls around epics will be pretty saturated (at least in bigger citys)

I dont even want to know what red one rates will be at that point...
red one without Mysterium x = wont get rented PERIOD!
Red One with Mysterium X = 2-400 for a complete package (probably not including lenses.. but maybe.. who knows)

Epic X guys.. at first.. while there are >500
will probably pull in 1000-1200 per day... but most likely there will still be those scroungers in the low numbers who will drop the worth for all of us..


I imagine once quite a few epix x's come out.. 500+
the rates will be similar to RED ONE prices now.

and here is the sad thing about all the modules...

those wont get you anymore money..
people will expect that they just come with the camera..
or move on to the next guy who does have it.. and will do it at the same price as the guy before without...

so yeah.. dont shoot the messenger.. but rentals will still not be a very lucrative biz plan.
Click to expand...


Not to stir but it seems like the attitude is i can just use a dslr because the least important thing on set is the camera ..

I hope thats not true
 
It's supply and demand.

For pure rentals, the market will quickly get over-saturated with cheap Epic/Scarlet bundles. Even quite well kitted out packages will go supercheap supersoon.

So make it a point that people rent knowledge and competense, and not a camerakit.

The market for that won't get oversaturated anytime soon...

The kit goes with the job...
 
Zakaree Sandberg said:
red one without Mysterium x = wont get rented PERIOD!
Click to expand...

R1's will continue to be used, just as people continue using different film cameras, and all the various digital offers from Arri, Sony, Weisscam, Phantom, etc.
R1's will continue to produce beautiful images for many years to come, just as they do today. They'll continue to be more than just good enough. They might just turn into a viable option for those that otherwise might have opted for a "good enough" solution.

Horses for courses.

I'm still making money with our SD ENG camera.

Kodak just came out with new Super8 stock.
 
Martin Weiss said:
R1's will continue to be used, just as people continue using different film cameras, and all the various digital offers from Arri, Sony, Weisscam, Phantom, etc.
R1's will continue to produce beautiful images for many years to come, just as they do today. They'll continue to be more than just good enough. They might just turn into a viable option for those that otherwise might have opted for a "good enough" solution.

Horses for courses.

I'm still making money with our SD ENG camera.

Kodak just came out with new Super8 stock.
Click to expand...

All true.

The problem will be over-saturation. AFAIK the ratio of R1s to D21s in Norway is something like 60/1. Which in part makes the D21 the "good" choice, even though one could probably argue that it is a more expensive cam to use and one could argue about objective image quality, AC's and DP's really rave over it.

No complaints here, though.

There will allways be place for a digibeta, HDCAM, SRs and def D21s Genesis's and Alexa, as there will be 5Ds (with jello and line-skipping) and other DSLRs.

Problem with R1s will be that there will be an awfull lot around sampling dust instead of light, because many think they can make a quick return on it only because they have it (and some will even be right about that... -:))

When the big projects don't materialise only because they own some kit, it will go for cheap rents.

That said.

The R1 is "good enough" for years to come. Only a tad bit heavy for some applications.

BTW, have you seen the lens-kit you can put in front of your iPhone?

A net-TV thingy will produce all its content with that...

Cheers!
 
Twenty million gerzillion dollars per frame....

Hypothetical.

David
 
I don't know about you guys, but a Scarlet Combo will cover most of my personal needs (fixed + s35).

Thing is the sexyness of Epic-X...

But think that through when budgeting pure rental returns after the initial hey-ho...
 
Complete kits will still go for a reasonable price. Quality MB, FF, head, support, ET accessories, etc. still cost more than the Epic itself. Still gotta have them if you generally want to do quality work. Add lenses and . . .

So yes, there will be somewhat of a race to the bottom at some point, but it will only go so far and probably find a reasonable equilibrium.
 
Jim McKinney said:
Complete kits will still go for a reasonable price. Quality MB, FF, head, support, ET accessories, etc. still cost more than the Epic itself. Still gotta have them if you generally want to do quality work. Add lenses and . . .

So yes, there will be somewhat of a race to the bottom at some point, but it will only go so far and probably find a reasonable equilibrium.
Click to expand...

ah yes, but much cheaper RED accessory options, touch screen focus, possibly built in redmote FF? and the pure low weight of epic (so you don't need heavy duty sticks) will also be thrown into the equation. But either way, there will be people who have the budget and are willing to throw money at latest and greatest, then some really competitive packages out there too. I've seen some really insane R1 packages from rental houses that go out for so dirt cheap, all accessories included.

I just hope things will pick back up by then, budgets swell up more, and the money you save on renting for camera department will go towards wages and other departments...

that's wishful thinking of course.
 
yes Red Ones will continue to be used.. but at least here in LA.. if yours is not mysterium x, the producer/dp whoever moves onto the next guy who has mx.. because MX cameras are going at the same rate that M cameras are goin for..(cheap)

the only reason im going with epic x vs scarlet is
A. epic comes out first
B. insane deal on the epic-x.. probably only a couple thousand dollars more than the top end scarlet once its done and said.
 
Zakaree Sandberg said:
B. insane deal on the epic-x.. probably only a couple thousand dollars more than the top end scarlet once its done and said.
Click to expand...
Not sure about this one. The Epic-X is an amazing value, but an S35 Scarlet brain is $7000 vs the Epic-X brain at $28000. That's a huge difference.
 
depending on what stage he is speaking of, the trade in will make up a brunt of the cost. since r1 money was already spent (and hopefully made back and then some) the cost of epic X over scarlet, cost benefit ratio, epic is the better deal.
 
Scarlet body- 7000 months later

Stage II Epic-X 11,500 after you deduct the price of the pieces that come with it.

the question is, do you feel you can make 4.5k in three months?
 
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