Pro Res offline to full scratch etc "online" and back?

[Obin Olson]

Ok so If I wanted to cut with prores422 720p offline raw conversions from the r3d, what is the workflow getting an "online" at the end of the day with high quality 10bit files from Scratch or redcine? how do I go from offline finished edit and xml out to redcine? but it's looking for the r3d files correct? not the offline files?

can someone step me through this one so it makes sense for a long form project that we need to end up with 2k color graded at the end of the day..

thanks for help.

I am thinking RedRushes for the offline file renders correct? and then we could start cutting. but what then?

 

[Obin Olson]

Oh yes and what are the render times like to pro res using red rushes? faster then the renders from RedCine? how much?

 

[John Tissavary]

If you are going Scratch or RedCine then your best (i.e. simplest) bet is to cut using the camera generated proxies.

Red Rushes would be the way to go ProRes (as it's nice to batch process), but... unless there's been a new development in r3d-to-ProRes conversions that I'm unaware of, if you do convert you're going to lose all necessary metadata needed for the conform. There may be some tools out there that can track, store, and re-insert metadata, but I'd be loathe to use them on a feature length project as there'll be enough headaches to deal with without having to mind the metadata that is a CRITICAL ingredient in a conform.

If you offline with proxies then conform in Scratch, it's as simple as:

1) offline using camera generated proxies (or RA re-generated). You can also assemble your audio track here.
2) when picture on a reel is locked (i.e. five 20min. 'reels', or timelines, for a 100 min feature), output EDL in cmx3600 format (one layer, no audio)
3) load edl in Scratch, hit the assemble button, and... usually it's that simple.

Please PM me if you have any questions. I use this workflow practically every day.

The RedCine method involves using Crimson, which I have no experience with, but certainly others on this board do.



regards,

JT

 

[Obin Olson]

no trouble/crashing/buggy workflow with proxy files in FCP?

 

[hrrsn.schaaf]

regarding the necessity of crimson...

shouldn't i just be able to export an EDL from FCP and load it up into redcine and have redcine online the material i've cut and then turn it into 4k video? or is crimson a part of the puzzle i am missing? apologies for the very basic inquiries...

h

 

[Steve Sherrick]

Redcine cannot read EDL generated from FCP

 

[Obin Olson]

but can work with xml? so why not edit ref files, export xml redcine it, and relink files in fcp to "online" from redcine?

 

[Scott Simmons]

Explore and read all about Crimson as that is the best tool outside of a Scratch to get back to the .R3D files.

As for proxies, I wouldn't use them ever. They do work but the more you pile on your timeline the less performance you are going to see. layer, fx, multiclips all slow the proxy workflow. And remember, these are Quicktime REFERENCE files. I would never trust Final Cut Pro's media management to be able to track a longform or feature's worth of media via reference files as you never know when you might have to move files, swap drives, switch systems, etc. Transcode to some self-contained format first. At least that is what I would do, no question about it.

 

[John Tissavary]

The problem is that XML is just a general document type like HTML - there's nothing specifying compatibility of content from one app to another.

That is, to my knowledge, what Crimson does... it creates an XML file that RedCine can make use of.

One thing I forgot about, because I've never used it: can someone here verify if the log & transfer utility renders to prores qt's with correctly logged clips that track source .r3d footage in an EDL export? That could be exactly what Obin is looking for...

jt

 

[John Tissavary]

regarding the necessity of crimson...

shouldn't i just be able to export an EDL from FCP and load it up into redcine and have redcine online the material i've cut and then turn it into 4k video? or is crimson a part of the puzzle i am missing? apologies for the very basic inquiries...

h

RedCine does not, as of the latest version, have cut-list or conform capabilities. Crimson is able to generate an XML cut list that RedCine can read, so that's the workaround for now.

The workflow you are describing is currently only possible with Scratch or ScratchCine.

regards,

John T.