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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

pc workstation

oldphart said:
The Xeons are optimized for server work. I would want to see it benchmarked with the actual programs to say which is better suited for rendering. I would not be surprised if the new Opterons actually turn out to be best for rendering - the previous crop would usually beat the previous crop of Xeon at anything to do with huge amounts of data. Intel may have leapfrogged AMD in raw computing, but I think AMD still has the edge in data throughput until Intel manage to make a processor with onboard memory controller. You will need lots of memory, and it is nice to have a system which does not force memory access and disk transfers through the same bottleneck.

In any case, I would recommend to look into a water cooled system - it is more efficient, more reliable, and a lot quieter. For this kind of system, the extra cost is not all that significant.
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OP, supposedly the next generation of processors for both AMD and Intel are meant to be more energy efficient and therefore, probably cooler running. Are you suggesting the water cooling because of the increased number of processors or is that based on current technology? I have run an old XEON workstation with twin 2.0 Ghz processors, and when I added another GB worth of RIMMS to the GB I already had, after some rendering the machine would shut doun to self-protect from excess heat. By making the fan run high speed as default, I never had the shutdoun problem again, although my ears still hear phantom white noise to this day.

So, I'm wondering if the water cooling you suggest is for performance push, or for equipment protection?
 
geoff tompkinson said:
Thanks for this link - what is the exact spec of the system you are so pleased with - there are a lot of options in this link.

Cheers
Click to expand...

Well our system is a dual quad core (X5355) w/ 4gb ram, Nvidia Quadro 4500 video card and Black Magic Multibridge Pro I/O. But I'm sure they have faster systems now.

We are seeing minimum 3X to 4X decrease in render times over our previous dual proc system in XSI and AE renders...and as much as 7X increase in speed of ram previews
 
The Third Man said:
Forget PC, take a Mac, be creative, do something!
Click to expand...

Ok now do we go into a Mac Hardware forum and rain on your parade!?

Plenty of creative work gets done on a PC. And as for Red Workflows what about the people who want to use Avid, or Adobe CS3? These applications are much better developed on the PC side as of right now. Not to mention Scratch.

One thing about going with a smaller integrator is that they can usually put together the whole system, including software installs and configurations that the Big Guys like Dell and HP just don't do. That way you just turn it on and everything is ready to go. No installing software, no board installs, just turn it on and be creative.

RedCine is going to be cross platform and is going to allow converting to whatever format codec you have installed on the Computer. It's an extra step, but native is not the only way to edit this footage.

Chris
 
One last thing. The difference between the Q6800 and the Xeons is that you can have multiple processors with the Xeons, I don't know of any dual proc socket 775 boards that will allow 2 Q6800's. I could be wrong but I never seen it and I deal with this stuff everyday. Other than that, I think they are very similar, if not identical. There may be some cache differences.

Chris
 
the Mac vs Windows thing has been beat to death..
Mac is a PC now
With a Unix based OS.
Move on
 
laboprod said:
Sanjin, I can certify you that our 3D boxes are rendering professional work every day that is beeing sold.
What do you mean by "certified hardware"? Is RED certifying Apple, BOXX, HP or DELL computer to work with REDCINE and RED workflow, that I was not aware? Otherwise I don't think you will get support, from let's say DELL, to make a config to work with it.

Or am I missing something.

antoine.
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Interesting point. Dell does have a certification program for it's workstation class PCs. Silicon Imaging had their software certified for customers using the SI2K mini and a Dell workstation.
 
Chris,

yes I think you are right about difference with Xeon. And I don't know of any dual proc socket 775 boards that will allow 2 cpu either.

Not sure if it is a technical issue or a commercial thing, I mean when it comes for dual cpu board are they trying to make you eat the most expensive cpu?
In both case it is a shame, I buildt years ago a dual PIII with an ASUS board, which was cheaper that the Tyan config and runs very well.

I also think that going for small integrator than DELL and HP might be the right choice.

BTW, please don't start with "religion" here, I think we are all more clever than that.

antoine.
 
angeleye said:
Ok now do we go into a Mac Hardware forum and rain on your parade!?

Plenty of creative work gets done on a PC. And as for Red Workflows what about the people who want to use Avid, or Adobe CS3? These applications are much better developed on the PC side as of right now. Not to mention Scratch.

One thing about going with a smaller integrator is that they can usually put together the whole system, including software installs and configurations that the Big Guys like Dell and HP just don't do. That way you just turn it on and everything is ready to go. No installing software, no board installs, just turn it on and be creative.

RedCine is going to be cross platform and is going to allow converting to whatever format codec you have installed on the Computer. It's an extra step, but native is not the only way to edit this footage.

Chris
Click to expand...

Wish you the best.

P.S. Mac hardware is also PC hardware (Intel based) that can all PC OS and apps. And that's all about I said before. Hope you've got it.
 
do with trolls as you would do with dogs... ignore bad behaviour, reward good behaviour.
 
Okay,

So the main reason to consider going with xeon over the QX is the ability to have more than one processor.

What about graphics cards Quadro or Geforce ?

The Geforce is obviously more aimed at gamers but does this mean its performance for After Effects for instance is going to be any worse than the Quadro's ?

..
 
number6 said:
OP, supposedly the next generation of processors for both AMD and Intel are meant to be more energy efficient and therefore, probably cooler running. Are you suggesting the water cooling because of the increased number of processors or is that based on current technology? I have run an old XEON workstation with twin 2.0 Ghz processors, and when I added another GB worth of RIMMS to the GB I already had, after some rendering the machine would shut doun to self-protect from excess heat. By making the fan run high speed as default, I never had the shutdoun problem again, although my ears still hear phantom white noise to this day.

So, I'm wondering if the water cooling you suggest is for performance push, or for equipment protection?
Click to expand...

I run my current dual Opteron system close to stock, I recently added water cooling to quiet the system down but see a much reduced core temperature both for CPU and GPU, which certainly will be good for the reliable lifespan of the system. Now my old Mac G4 is the noisiest box in the room.

I tend to keep my old computers running on the network to do background jobs (application servers, rendering etc.) so I may care more about their longevity than most people. Five P4-systems may not be state of the art, but the contribution is noticeable. Besides, I live in a place where you need the extra heating most of the year.
 
number6 said:
OP, supposedly the next generation of processors for both AMD and Intel are meant to be more energy efficient and therefore, probably cooler running. Are you suggesting the water cooling because of the increased number of processors or is that based on current technology?
Click to expand...

To add to my previous reply: While the next generation will be more energy efficient, the total consumption is still expected to increase. If you reduce the power consumption to 2/3 of what we see today and double the number of cores per box, you will still need a huge power supply. Then you add at least twice as much memory and maybe a couple of powerful GPUs and a RAID. With 4k we will be talking lots of Terabytes.
 
The question of Geforce Vs Quadro is a one I deal with all the time. My answer is, if you plan on using 3d apps that take advantage of the open GL properties of the Quadro then spend the money, but if you plan to stay in the 2d world then the Geforce will work just fine.

For Avid, Premiere, After Effects, I'd recommend Geforce, but if you want to use the computer to use Scratch, or 3ds Max, then spend the money. And I do mean money, the quadro is very expensive generally, especially if you want to get that SDI output option.

No religion here, just giving the Third Man a little hard time for raining on our thread. No hard feelings, and it is true that Mac Hardware and PC hardware are the same. I just prefer to build and sell a computer that I can make some money off of. Apple is pretty stingy with it's resellers, it's really not worth the time to sell them from a business standpoint. The Mac is a good option if you want to edit with FCP or use the Studio product, not everyone wants to do so.

Chris
 
oldphart said:
I tend to keep my old computers running on the network to do background jobs (application servers, rendering etc.) so I may care more about their longevity than most people. Five P4-systems may not be state of the art, but the contribution is noticeable. Besides, I live in a place where you need the extra heating most of the year.
Click to expand...

Understand completely. The one thing I hate is to have something repaired, or returned for repair. And in most cases, a small amount of maintenance will keep that from happening.
 
If we are talking about 2D editing of RED material, I think number6 said it best -- wait till the last possible moment then get whatever the most smokin' system is on Dell or Alienware or whatever. A ten thousand dollar quad-core computer from six months ago could get blown out of the water by an 8-core chip that suddenly comes out next month on regular high-end machines.

Also, Third Man, you are like someone coming onto a Christian thread and preaching Islam....haha :)
 
just got myself an intel macbook pro,

now i am investigating running windows on it, there is paralells, vmware, and bootcamp, then there is XP and Vista in all its different versions,

what would be the best combination and easy start for experimenting with the PC side and test out trials of some of those compositing, 3D and video apps
 
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