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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

New Sony´s F35

The Band Pro(I think) guy, sorry I forgot his name, who was giving the F23 presentation at the Ny Production Tech Expo thing a couple of weeks ago said that Sony was putting the Genesis sensor into a number of F23s to fulfill some sort of production quota or something. Anyway, I suspect that the F35 may be what he was referring to. An F23 with the Genesis sensor. I could be wrong, but...
 
Let’s face it Sony, Red, Panavision, Arri, There all great products. It doesn’t matter if the camera costs 1k, 25k or 300k we all know that it’s the crew and the concept that’s going to make something great. It’s not the camera.

Don’t get me wrong. I’m just as excited as anyone about the possibilities of the Red One and the quality that it offers for the price. I’ve followed this potential film “Miracle” since the beginning.

I was in Baltimore 2 weeks ago and they were filming some Hollywood film with an A list actress. It was 11 at night and there were enough lights and cranes to light 3 city blocks. There must have been well over 150 people on set. What camera was there? A trusty old Panavision.

I commend Sony for making another camera. Look how great Apocalypto looked. I was at a Sony seminar a few weeks ago and they had a PMW-EX1 on display. It was really nice and it’s only 6 grand. I know it’s not going to shoot 4K, but it’s a real camera that I can actually get my hands on. What’s going to make me a better filmmaker? Waiting for the next great thing, or going out and shooting?
 
Bryanstough said:
I know it’s not going to shoot 4K, but it’s a real camera that I can actually get my hands on. What’s going to make me a better filmmaker? Waiting for the next great thing, or going out and shooting?
Click to expand...

Um... going out and shooting with teh next great thing?
There are expressive things that you can achieve with this technology that you can't with other cameras. There is an effect on story rendition here beyond resolution and other specs. Just a thought.

IBloom
 
It's threads like these that make Reduser look like a forum of uninformed camera snobs. Let Sony have their F23. I'm sure it's a great camera. Many talented people would love to shoot with it. Let's keep things in perspective.
 
The reason that we decided to make the RED ONE is that we couldn't see any company making the camera "we" wanted. But that doesn't mean that Sony, Panasonic, Panavision, etc. doesn't make a camera that someone else wants. Obviously they do.

My instincts (known to be wrong half the time) is that Sony will use the Genesis sensor and is precluded from selling that in the US for a contractual reason... pure speculation on my part?. I would also imagine that it is being forced out a bit sooner than they had wished. It does put a lot of pressure on the F23, which customers shelled out a ton of dough for.

We have our own issues at hand. We have to deliver cameras, enable the rest of the feature set and support our customers properly. Not a small task. So I'll now take my nose out of Sony's business and get back to work.

Jim
 
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From Google Translator (can't vouch for accuracy) main F35 specs.

1. Super 35 mm Depth of field equivalent of a single plate CCD (RGB; 1920x1080 dot)
2. PL lens mount compatible. A wide variety of cinema lens is available.
3. Frame Rate: 1P-50P between arbitrary number of frames to imaging changes. Other basic features of the F23, is the same.

Doesn't seem to revolutionary to me...
*****************************************

If this thread shows something, it shows that the red fanatics are consistantly one-eyed.

Not only are they passionate about praising a product that is released as a prototype with many problems, they will wholeheartedly condem another product just because it is not Red. Take the above quote for example.

How "unrevolutionary" is a HD camera that does 1-50 fps progressive with a PL mount and 35mm depth of field. That works as advertised. That is available now to anyone who wants to buy it.

Not long ago this would have been un-heard of. Correct me if I'm wrong, but (not counting Red of course) isn't this one of the best spec video cameras that I could go out and buy right now? Would you rather that the only alternative to Red was 2/3 inch chip cameras? (OK stupid question on this forum!!) And even though I can buy a Red camera now, when will I actually get it? - Nobody can answer that yet.

Anyway, I guess the point is that this isn't nesesarily a bad camera just because it's not Red. I apologise for the author of the above quote, this isn't a dig at you personally, but it seems most of the negative comments about this camera are based around the fact that it's not Red.

Here are some things that it is doing that Red currently is not:

variable frame rate up to 50fps with 35mm depth of field

all video outputs work, all at the same time

PL mount that works

Question: I wonder how many features on the camera DONT work?

You could argue that it is overpriced, fine, but that's really just an opinion. For some people the price might be right for now. If you want to buy a camera that is sold openly as in development, not yet fully functional, some people might say you were mad, but if you want to thats fine too.

To pre-empt the inevitable back-lash, I'm not anti-red, or pro-anything in particular. I have used the red camera (quite a bit), and I like using it. Like other cameras I have seen great footage and bad footage from it. Depends who is using it and how it is used. Its a great camera but its certainly not the best and only tool for every situation. I'm sure that in the not too distant future there will be similar spec cameras but they won't all be red. And then someone will come up with something better. It's all good.
 
While i agree with a lot you are saying, to be fair If you were to call Sony and order this today, you wouldn't see it for at least 6 months. Sony has a long history of prioritizing the big clients over the little guy, I don't see them changing with this. At least RED is fair.

Also to be fair, Sony has never proven a working PL mount, in fact their optical blocks have been proven to be very instable in the past. Hence why some great rental houses redesigned it and modified cameras with more stable materials.
 
Mike Prevette said:
While i agree with a lot you are saying, to be fair If you were to call Sony and order this today, you wouldn't see it for at least 6 months. Sony has a long history of prioritizing the big clients over the little guy, I don't see them changing with this. At least RED is fair.

Also to be fair, Sony has never proven a working PL mount, in fact their optical blocks have been proven to be very instable in the past. Hence why some great rental houses redesigned it and modified cameras.
Click to expand...

Hi Mike,

If I order a Red today I will also have to wait about 6 months I think.

Red's Pl mount is not exactly 'proven' at this time.

Stephen
 
ah, yes, I did think of these issues, but turned a blind eye to them (cheesy grin).. just making a point I guess.

As for the PL mount, I'll be made to eat my words if it doesn't work, but its good to see manufactures going for an option that is both more stable (theoretically) and gives you access to high quality glass. It always baffled me that (even in the days when digibeta was new) people were happy to pay top dollar for camera rental and put a shitty ENG zoom on it. I can remember how suprised I was the first digibeta shoot I went on where we had a Optex converted cine-lens (at the change in colour, resolution, DOF, etc). Same applies to HD Cinealtas, etc.

Kind of the same applies when I go and buy a 10mp slim-line pocket camera with a tiny plastic lens: very high resolution low quality images.
 
3151_1196327331.jpeg


it's design remind's me with this

3151_1196327403.jpeg


very old creative style..:bleh:
 
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it's design remind's me with this
======================

well its pretty much a 'sony-ised' genesis, which as has already been noted in this thread is where the roots lie. Which in turn was designed in the image of a panaflex system, which is evolved from the old mitchell cameras, which are pretty much the classic oldie film camera look.

Then again, you could argue that without the recorder docked, it looks like a box with a lens on the front, which is exactly what the red is.
 
p.s. the motor on that 2B is GARUNTEED to flicker. I have one, Tobin made some serius errors on that one.
 
the F35 doesn't look that bad. I'd shoot with it in a heartbeat, but my only point is at this point it's even less proven than the Red in the field. We should e fair with our criticism. Nothing i perfect Sony nor Red.
 
We don't buy cameras because of looks or do we?

Besides, Universal is fully owned by General Electric. I only wonder how long it takes until Google goes into feature-filmdistribution.
 
I've just noticed that that Sony also refer to their SXRD 4K digital projector as "CineAlta". What's point of a 4K projector if you only have a 2K camera? Or is there something new in the works, like a 48K full RGB CMOS sensor that.
 
I think what the Sony has going for it is that you can probably plug it in to any broadcast truck or any existing HD studio and have it work. No wondering which outputs are enabled, what type of data it spits out, etc. Some people are willing to pay for that.

I would say the Sonys are meant to replace HD cameras, the Reds replace film.
 
Sony has already been fined for overprising...

Sony has already been fined for overprising...

grandpa it burns said:
I think sony is a great company...that is if you like companies that overcharge, treat you like the number you are to them, and take advantage of you at every possible opportunity.
Click to expand...

See here:

http://broadcastengineering.com/news/eu-fines-betacom-1126/

Congratulations, over 47 million euros, Sony!

Needs Sony to sell a real bunch of PS3's to recover from that. I hope not to many people follow the PS3 supercomputer linux cluster approach, otherwise Sony will remain as the company who sponsored more supercomputers than anyone else on the planet...

Cheers,
Axel
 
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