Welcome to our community

Be a part of something great, join today!

Log in
  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

New RR v3.6.0 renders to all DNxHD. What times do you get?

A

akis

Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2008
Messages
22
Reaction score
0
Points
0
New RR v3.6.0 can render to specific DNxHD bitrates.
I get about 1:3.5 for DNxHD36 QTs and about 1:1 when importing them to Avid.
So that's a total 1:4.5 instead of the 1:7 I usually got when importing QTref directly to MC.
Thanks RED team for that!
 
Andrew McCarrick said:
Now the question is... does that include metadata (timecode, ect.) so we can do Offline to Online?
Click to expand...

MC doesn't take the timecode from the QTs so you still need to generate an ALE. You can do that with MetaCheater or REDrushes.

For any of the 720P DNxHD formats, don't use RR for the ALEs. MC needs special timecode conversion which metacheater does properly.
 
Deanan said:
MC doesn't take the timecode from the QTs so you still need to generate an ALE. You can do that with MetaCheater or REDrushes.

For any of the 720P DNxHD formats, don't use RR for the ALEs. MC needs special timecode conversion which metacheater does properly.
Click to expand...

Right, and this what's holding me back from shooting with RED. I don't want to have to do these ALEs, just to get the footage into MC.

I'm waiting until I can get a clean export from REDCine to directly import to MC, being ready to edit imediately (no ALE, no batch import) and then move straight to another editor for the Online.
 
Andrew McCarrick said:
Right, and this what's holding me back from shooting with RED. I don't want to have to do these ALEs, just to get the footage into MC.

I'm waiting until I can get a clean export from REDCine to directly import to MC, being ready to edit imediately (no ALE, no batch import) and then move straight to another editor for the Online.
Click to expand...

That requires direct transcoding to MXF which Avid is working directly.
 
Andrew McCarrick said:
Right, and this what's holding me back from shooting with RED. I don't want to have to do these ALEs, just to get the footage into MC.

I'm waiting until I can get a clean export from REDCine to directly import to MC, being ready to edit imediately (no ALE, no batch import) and then move straight to another editor for the Online.
Click to expand...

I am not sure that you can have all metadata inside MXF. I believe an ALE will always be necessary. Metafuze currently creates an ALE when transcoding dpx to DNxHD.
Anyway the current(updated) workflow, is very similar to a film workflow (and it should take about the same time):

Film: Telecine to videotape, export ALE --> import ALE to MC, batch digitize.
Red: Redrushes makes DNx36 quicktimes plus ALE --> import ALE to MC, batch import.
 
akis said:
I am not sure that you can have all metadata inside MXF. I believe an ALE will always be necessary. Metafuze currently creates an ALE when transcoding dpx to DNxHD.
Anyway the current(updated) workflow, is very similar to a film workflow:

Film: Telecine to videotape, export ALE --> import ALE to MC, batch digitize.
Red: Redrushes makes DNx36 quicktimes plus ALE --> import ALE to MC, batch import.
Click to expand...

MetaFuze is MAC only right?
 
No. Metafuze is PC only.
 
akis said:
No. Metafuze is PC only.
Click to expand...

Okay. It's just I really don't see the point of all of these extra damn steps. It's such a pain in the ass. Especially since I'll be Acting, Directing, and Editing this film... and I want to be editing every night after we're done shooting.

I'll just end up back logged I guess. Logging footage from Day One on Day One, Editing footage from day one and logging footage from day two on day two, ect.

(I apologize to the Original Poster for stealing the thread.)
 
Creating an ALE takes seconds as does the process of importing the ALE first then merging. Having the metadata up front instead of a sngle timecode as with QT only will save your ass and many hours later when doing the conform - on Avid or not. There are amny example of productions that resorted to used both timecodes when one failed as part of the conform process. Impatience is not what you want to have when dealing with file-based workflows.

Organaizing is key with any workflow. With RED and REDrushes I like to create one folder for my day's dailies. The folder and the ALE will have the same name (nicely done by REDrushes). Organize the folder by shoot day, or shoot day and camera if doing multicamera etc.

Create ALE and QT exports, import ALE, then merge. This should not really hold you back from shooting RED. Metadata is part of any process. If the extra few seconds are important, I suggest getting an assistant on set that is processing DNxHD proxies as the media becomes available. That way, after you wrap you can start editing. You may consider bringing the Media Composer on set as well - once the QT's are made import.

The extra 10 seconds will be appreciated come conform time.

Michael
 
When I try to export a DNxHD file from RR I get nothing but static in the quicktime file. I've downloaded and installed the Avid Codecs. I'm using a Macbook Pro with Quicktime 7.5.5 and RR 3.60. Anyone know what my problem is? Thanks.

EDIT: Problem fixed with some fiddling. When you look for the codecs on the avid website the first place it takes you is to an older version for some reason. You have to search for the newest ones.
 
All things RED related are at www.avid.com/red including the codecs on the Avid resources page. Sign up and get notified of changes,

Michael
 
Andrew McCarrick said:
Right, and this what's holding me back from shooting with RED. I don't want to have to do these ALEs, just to get the footage into MC.
Click to expand...

Why? The ALE tracks a lot more metadata that the QT could reasonably be expected to hold on it's own. And while the MXF is an extensible format, there's no guarantee that MC could even recognise that metadata from the file. You'd still probably need some other tool to extract the info.

While Avid does read and index basic metadata (tape, timecodes) from the MXF essence, most of the extended metadata is held, I believe, only within the instance (ie. the clip in the bin, in the project). This is why you can find a clip in Media Tool and drag it into a bin, but will not get all the metadata that might be recorded against it in another instance.

There are other implementations of media interaction that I have seen with Avid, however, that could be explored. Most notably for me lately is a tool that creates Avid-compatible media, and then when you drag and drop from the converting app into an Avid bin it sends the metadata to the bin, as well as transfers the media into an Avid Media directory. Works very well.
 
Dylan Reeve said:
Why?
Click to expand...

Time... I'm starring, directing, and editing... won't have time to do ALEs, if I want to edit every night after filming.

Before I could do an ALE, I would have to go through the footage, do Circle Takes, process those in RED Cine and do the ALE, and then finally move to Media Composer for the Offline. Probably a 2-3 day process to edit one days worth of material.

What's contained in an ALE anyway?
 
Thank you

Thank you

Hi

I'm delighted that we can directly go to DNxHD 36... (best codec for Red ofline where space is an issue.. SD is just not capable of allowing correct focus/picture decisions)

I'm delighted that we can directly go to a correctly flagged DNxHD 185x (Symphony finishing just got easier and better)

why can't we render to Avid UNCOMPRESSED 10bit for a Fast import and therefore max quality????

2 out of 3 is great.. (that is 2 workarounds I can through away)

Please lets get uncompressed 10bit into Avid (remember if it doesn't fast import its not 10bit)

thanks

Michael Lindsay
 
Avid MC uncompressed 10bit is 4:2:2. You can make a 4:2:2 HDCAM-SR out of it, but does it really worth it?
I think that if you are after maximum quality, you have to go the dpx route.
 
akis said:
Avid MC uncompressed 10bit is 4:2:2. You can make a 4:2:2 HDCAM-SR out of it, but does it really worth it?
Click to expand...

You absolutely need 10bits with Red material at the finishing stage. DNxHD 185x is a great codec but it does put artefacts in your material (slightly more than plain 185).

akis said:
I think that if you are after maximum quality, you have to go the dpx route.
Click to expand...

DPX at the moment is 'not' the way to go for a Symphony finish (DS yes). We do really need uncompressed 10bit HD in symphony (and MC users may appreciate it as well).

regards

Michael
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top