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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

New Red Mag Please

D

David Adamic

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So a few weeks ago I had a problem where the given solution was to force install the camera firmware again. When a camera is on locations somewhere remote this is somewhat prohibitive.

My request is that you come up with a Red Mag that has just enough storage to hold firmware updates. They wouldn't have to handle shooting 5k at 120 fps, just be good enough to upload new firmware. Preferably at a cost that enables us to have one or two and not care if we ever have to use them. Then we'd have a nice portable means of fixing some of the stranger problems in the field.

This is really not so much of a complaint as a request.

Thanks,

David Adamic
 
$459 is a little too much to just keep firmware on. I was hoping for something small/cheap enough to be in the $100-200 range.
 
right now I keep a file on my laptop that I use for offloading, but I don't / can't bring that on every shoot. I would love a 10GB or so SSD for $75 that was too slow to even record a frame, I just want it to have the firmware on it. I would buy a bunch of these for the current firmware, the current beta, a roll back version, my presets, etc.
 
David Adamic said:
So a few weeks ago I had a problem where the given solution was to force install the camera firmware again. When a camera is on locations somewhere remote this is somewhat prohibitive.

My request is that you come up with a Red Mag that has just enough storage to hold firmware updates. They wouldn't have to handle shooting 5k at 120 fps, just be good enough to upload new firmware. Preferably at a cost that enables us to have one or two and not care if we ever have to use them. Then we'd have a nice portable means of fixing some of the stranger problems in the field.

This is really not so much of a complaint as a request.

Thanks,

David Adamic
Click to expand...

FYI: 9 out of 10 times (if not more) a long-hold of the power button on startup (or selecting "Restore System" from the Maintenance menu) will fix the same problems that a re-install of the firmware will.
 
Trent Lillehaugen said:
FYI: 9 out of 10 times (if not more) a long-hold of the power button on startup (or selecting "Restore System" from the Maintenance menu) will fix the same problems that a re-install of the firmware will.
Click to expand...

Good to know, I'll give that a try. Would still love a cheap SSD for firmware uploads for the 1 out of 10.
 
This has probably been discussed before, but if there is a cheaper SSD introduced that can hold firmware backups (as David Adamic specifies) I'd love the option to have the firmware not wipe itself off once executed. That would mean an option to boot the camera up and confirm the firmware install. I was on a job where the long hold of the power button did not fix the issue we were having and in turn had to reinstall the firmware (first install the earlier build, then the current build) every time the camera had to shut down. The rig had a bebop so it wasn't based on every batter change but it was a chore non-the-less.
 
This is a bit of a weird idea, but the side ssd module is sata based, so how about a gadget that fits in a red mag case but contains a compact flash adaptor and one of those cheap 16gb compact flash cards that sell for about £15 these days.

Alternatively maybe a way of installing from an sd card. I assume theres an sd card slot like there is on the red one?

Freya
 
All these ideas (cheaper 4-32 GB REDmags, REDmag to SD or CF Card etc.) have been presented over and over again. Not saying that I wouldn't like a $100 (or less) SD Card - REDMAG adapter or something similar, because even the 48GB is still relatively expensive for most people, just to keep firmware and presets. Just noting that this is probably not going to happen since RED has been totally silent on these ideas/requests. (of course excluding the 48GB REDMAG which has been produced only because of the ongoing user requests)

My guess is: the shell of the mag, including the electronics but without any memory installed, would probably be over $250 already. (Think about it: the SWAT rails start at $75) But who knows... only time will tell ;)
 
Terry VerHaar said:
No.
Click to expand...

After all this time I still don't see why they omitted these on the new bodies.
Must have to interfere too much with the design of the bodies... but it would have been a cool addition to the SSD modules, to have an SD card slot in there somewhere.
 
Patrick Grossien said:
All these ideas (cheaper 4-32 GB REDmags, REDmag to SD or CF Card etc.) have been presented over and over again. Not saying that I wouldn't like a $100 (or less) SD Card - REDMAG adapter or something similar, because even the 48GB is still relatively expensive for most people, just to keep firmware and presets. Just noting that this is probably not going to happen since RED has been totally silent on these ideas/requests. (of course excluding the 48GB REDMAG which has been produced only because of the ongoing user requests)

My guess is: the shell of the mag, including the electronics but without any memory installed, would probably be over $250 already. (Think about it: the SWAT rails start at $75) But who knows... only time will tell ;)
Click to expand...

I think you are really spot on with what you say here. People never think about the cost of the shell of the mag but it has a cost and if it's only being made in small numbers then it can be more expensive than people imagine!

HOWEVER I wasn't quite suggesting an SSD to CF adaptor as such but a mag much like the existing SSD mags. Thus the shell could be the same as the existing SSD shells. It would contain a CF card and adapter but would be sealed up in the same way as the SSD mags are. It's still a problem tho because it means stocking the extra electronics but the mag shell could be as for the SSD drives and the compact flash cards are probably fairly cheap and readily available enough to not be a problem. I'm guessing such an install mag might be possible to make as low as $200 maybe, but would people buy it at that price? I think when people are talking about such a thing for $100 they are probably just in fantasy land and it would need a few people to buy one to make it work out even at $200!

Plus some people would be like "look it's just a case with a compact flash card in it what a rip off". (You can't please everyone!)

I think this idea is definitely doo-able if there was genuinely enough demand, but would there really be that much demand at $200?

Freya
 
Here's what I do...

When prepping, I copy the desired firmware(s) I may need and black shade or other files I might need to a couple SSDs in the kit, the last ones I'll use. Then I have them right where I need them. If I'm cycling media / offloading then it doesn't matter anyway because I obviously have a computer with the proper files and means to put what I need on an SSD. If I didn't happen to bring those files on the offload/ media management system(s) to my remote location, then I'm just an idiot.

Most jobs I tend to work alone or with one assistant. There are plenty of times I don't offload in the field or bring any means to do so. Having pertinent files on my media is convenient and saves the day. I don't see where I need a special SSD option just for that. If RED did offer such an SSD, I'd probably pick one up if the price was right -- like $50 to have enough storage to keep a couple firmware revisions I could choose between to flash the camera and a few black-shade files or something, maybe some LUTs.

I have changed firmwares on jobs before, sometimes rolling from beta to a release or vice versa, not usually for a problem. The one time I did have a serious firmware issue, Deanan had to send me a new firmware anyway. Nothing else I could have done. That was early on with the EPIC and there was a fan control glitch.
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
Here's what I do...

Most jobs I tend to work alone or with one assistant. There are plenty of times I don't offload in the field or bring any means to do so. Having pertinent files on my media is convenient and saves the day. I don't see where I need a special SSD option just for that. If RED did offer such an SSD, I'd probably pick one up if the price was right -- like $50 to have enough storage to keep a couple firmware revisions I could choose between to flash the camera and a few black-shade files or something, maybe some LUTs.
.
Click to expand...

See $50 just isn't practical. That's probably less than the cost of the parts!
Can you have more than one update on an SSD at the same time and select from them?

Freya
 
Freya said:
I think you are really spot on with what you say here. People never think about the cost of the shell of the mag but it has a cost and if it's only being made in small numbers then it can be more expensive than people imagine!

HOWEVER I wasn't quite suggesting an SSD to CF adaptor as such but a mag much like the existing SSD mags. Thus the shell could be the same as the existing SSD shells. It would contain a CF card and adapter but would be sealed up in the same way as the SSD mags are. It's still a problem tho because it means stocking the extra electronics but the mag shell could be as for the SSD drives and the compact flash cards are probably fairly cheap and readily available enough to not be a problem. I'm guessing such an install mag might be possible to make as low as $200 maybe, but would people buy it at that price? I think when people are talking about such a thing for $100 they are probably just in fantasy land and it would need a few people to buy one to make it work out even at $200!

Plus some people would be like "look it's just a case with a compact flash card in it what a rip off". (You can't please everyone!)

I think this idea is definitely doo-able if there was genuinely enough demand, but would there really be that much demand at $200?

Freya
Click to expand...

Thats one of the solutions I was including in "something similar": a standard CF enclosed in a REDMAG shell. CF to sata is less than $10 on ebay from china. But still as I said: the SWAT rails start at $75 and even the standard REDmag shell will be (metal alone) not far from that or even more, if it would be sold separately. But who knows! If there's high demand - and the REDmags are being sold a lot methinks - the price could possibly be lowered. If this comes down to $50-100, I'd assume these would be a "pick-up-item" on most everyones next order.
 
Patrick Grossien said:
If this comes down to $50-100, I'd assume these would be a "pick-up-item" on most everyones next order.
Click to expand...

I would definitely get one. Everyone would I think.

I would think they could have the camera detect the card type (firmware vs. media) so the data wouldn't be wiped after reflashing the bios and media could not be recorded to the mag. Maybe they could even have it so you could store multiple bios versions (e.g. beta and release versions) and the camera would ask which you wanted to use when flashing.
 
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