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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

ND filters built in?

E

enrico parenti

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Any luck on getting Neutral density filters built in? I mean the 2/3 fixed lens camera should have them, many time happens that you are following somebody in a documentary and suddenly you have to switch from outside to inside or the other way around, and you don't have an assistant flying to switch filters on the Matte Box...

no?
 
IMO, the fixed-lens version is the only Scarlet on which built-in NDs would make sense. Then again, incorporating them would mean more crap in the optical path that could be undesirable at times. I would prefer mine without any built in. For dynamic lighting conditions as you describe, there are other means by which to handle that.
 
HMP said:
Not to mention for the underwater crowd its an essential feature.

Hugh Miller
Click to expand...

Essential? Only if you are "diving" knee-deep on a white sandy lagoon on a clear day at noon. In the past 15 years of filming underwater I never used an ND filter. :biggrinjester:
 
Apart from the issues that could rise with crap in the optical path, inside indie documentary filmmaking you don't have anyone replacing the ND filters for you.
This means that the quality of your shooting is going to suffer badly, because you will lose some beautiful shots stolen from real life situations.
I care more for that sudden great shot and light then a small loss in optical quality.

E.P
 
many time happens that you are following somebody in a documentary and suddenly you have to switch from outside to inside or the other way around, and you don't have an assistant flying to switch filters on the Matte Box...
Click to expand...

That's why you learn to do stuff like let the guy leave frame, get a shot you can cut with and pick it up again. Actual documentary film making doesn't mean running around pointing a camera at stuff non stop for 25mins.

Kids today.....
 
Nick Gardner said:
That's why you learn to do stuff like let the guy leave frame, get a shot you can cut with and pick it up again. Actual documentary film making .....
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Documentary film making means that you are not often in the position to direct real people like if they where actors, they can leave the scene and leave you there with you're matte box. Sometimes you can sometimes you can't.

When you can't (or don't want) having a switch on the camera helps.
 
I like the idea of built-in ND's. Convenient. Fast. Useful.
 
HMP said:
"In the past 15 years of filming underwater I never used an ND filter."

That must have been extremely limiting for you! :)
I suppose many housings for the 750 or 900 dont support it, but if you had it you'd like it!

Hugh
Click to expand...

Because I usually dive deeper than knee-deep water, I never needed it. :smile5:
 
i personally would be happy to see built in NDs in the fixed lens model.
 
David Mullen ASC said:
It would probably have to be limited to the 2/3" Scarlet because an internal filter wheel would get rather large if it had to rotate in front of, and cover, S35 and FF35. It's also one more thing to get dirty in front of the sensor.
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Sure as h*ll, you're right David - BUT .... I'm nailbitin' waiting for the fixed lens Scarlet - I'm not only shooting docs but even a lot of sports action especially football (the right one, not soccer and yes its really big here in Austria) so I personally would really like to have ND at my fingertips .... maybe I'm just used to it from my Sony-IMX ...... nothing is faster then the filter wheel, when you need it .....
 
ND Filters.

ND Filters.

Hay how about negitive gain?
I use it all the time to slow my camera down.
On digi-beta you can set a -6db.
It works! I just wish I could set it to a lower amount.
 
There isn't even positive gain, let alone negative gain. With a RAW camera, that would require analog gain.

Besides, -3db gain is only a 1/2-stop decrease in exposure, hardly enough to save you from needing an ND filter. And minus-gain tends not to get you more highlight detail anyway. With most video cameras, using minus-gain causes a loss of dynamic range.
 
DDahlquist said:
Hay how about negitive gain?
I use it all the time to slow my camera down.
On digi-beta you can set a -6db.
It works! I just wish I could set it to a lower amount.
Click to expand...

This is not a digi-beta. No gain, no pain.:biggrin:
 
Lets talk negative like your response.
I know it is not a digibeta ,SX beta or Cinalta. It is a digital camera and it has firm wear that can be modified easer than adding a filter wheel. Yes minus-gain causes a loss of dynamic range. But if you could go lower than -3 it will work in a pinch. I was simply offering a possible positive solution to Enrico Parenti question. Enrico has put to the group a situation that he comes across in his shooting environment. So group how about a positive solution for Enrico's real world dilemma?
 
That's what ISO setting does. It is your equivalent of gain, if you like.
 
good point Pawel, but we don't know yet, if there will be any ISO range to run through prior to shooting (thinking about the 2/3) ...... although it is a RAW workflow "fix it in post" won't be an option here - supposing the 2/3 gets only a fixed ISO value - let's say around ISO500 ......
 
Doesn't matter because ND filters are a necessity when shooting in sunlight anyway, so the only question is whether it's feasible to put a filter wheel in or if you just need to add them in front.

I'd point out that 16mm documentary shooters like the Cinema Verite crowd of the 1960's managed to shoot handheld and add filters when necessary, and many were working with color reversal stock of limited latitude. The filter wheel on an ENG camera is a great convenience, of course, but not necessarily a must-have in order to shoot documentaries.
 
well OK, it looks I'm too used to the ENG style shooting - have to rethink my art of work .....
 
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