NAB new announcements...

[Ale Houston]

The funny part is that she's caught up in the gear fetish too... lol. Next thing she'll want an ARRI MB-20 for $5... because every poor indy deserves an ARRI MB-20 to overthrow the WASP system.

I thought this was a problem only in my country, but evidently the need to "destroy the system but hey still give me my goodies" is a worldwide problem.. Hey, I need an affordable production manager.. what about setting daily fees at 10 bucks? after all, if we are going to fulfill the poor indie filmakers dream, why don't fulfill the cold hearted executive producer one?? hehehe..

Besides, there is always the option to rent!

 

[Adam Clark]

priding myself on what i consider to be an almost clairvoyant sense of acronym constituents, WASP was a kick to my ego's groin. so in shame, i googled.

Women Airforce Service Pilots
White Anglo-Saxon Protestant
Web Analytics Solution Profile


could someone please clarify so i can get back to recording my child clipping his toenails on my epic?

 

[Andrae Palmer]

could someone please clarify so i can get back to recording my child clipping his toenails on my epic?

LOL... you would think Kristen would be in favor of the proletariat having 4k cameras to record their kids.

 

[Ces Peynetti]

So, let me see if I understand this correctly. There is a lot of bad stuff out there. The environment is being polluted by High quality videos of Cats and Dogs and cute children. The solution to bring back more "art" and less "nonsense" is to make a 4k camera more affordable? If any that is just gonna bring many more cats and dogs and "nonsense" just like it happened when Video on DSLRs came around, or is it that all of those that can't quite afford the camera are the true artists of today?

How is a camera "too expensive" when if it would have been released by another company at around the same time it would have cost 4-5 times more? Not to worry though, I hear JVC has a 4k camera for $5 grand.

Now that I'm done saying that. I'm freaking excited about next week. Not only will we get a glimpse of the future of cinema, but we'll also most likely be put at ease that we placed our bets on the right horse when we decided to make a big investment in a tool that can help us push our creativity.

 

[Paul E. McCarthy]

I'd tell Kristen to get in her time machine and go back to the 90s and price out an sr3 or xtr prod package . Gear has never been more affordable and the number of amatuers and bad internet trained "DPs" on this site is proof of it. I hope it gets more expensive so i don't need to deal with another "producer" (who thinks they can shoot the smaller gigs) asking me what they need for their scarlet or asking me to bring all my accessories to use with his camera.
If you're good your gear will get paid off quick, if you suck it won't. Go big or go home.
Get out your credit card like the real DPs and buy everything,
Doesn't WASP stand for We Are Satans People?

 

[Cid J Salcido Uyarra]

The tease continues....

Will we get concrete information by Monday?

 

[Steve Sherrick]

Kristen, please re-read your post and consider editing it. There is some VERY offensive language in there. Having opinions is fine. I don't agree with your overall opinion on the matter, but that's okay. But, you crossed the line on a couple of points you made in my opinion. At least have a look and think about how it sounds from an objective standpoint.

 

[Nick Morrison]

I'd tell Kristen to get in her time machine and go back to the 90s and price out an sr3 or xtr prod package . Gear has never been more affordable and the number of amatuers and bad internet trained "DPs" on this site is proof of it. I hope it gets more expensive so i don't need to deal with another "producer" (who thinks they can shoot the smaller gigs) asking me what they need for their scarlet or asking me to bring all my accessories to use with his camera.
If you're good your gear will get paid off quick, if you suck it won't. Go big or go home.
Get out your credit card like the real DPs and buy everything,
Doesn't WASP stand for We Are Satans People?

Haha, that sounds like me. Whats up, Paul. PS - I'm still reading American Cinematographer, thanks to you...I kinda owe you for that...

 

[Jon MIchael Puntervold]

So, let me see if I understand this correctly. There is a lot of bad stuff out there. The environment is being polluted by High quality videos of Cats and Dogs and cute children. The solution to bring back more "art" and less "nonsense" is to make a 4k camera more affordable? If any that is just gonna bring many more cats and dogs...

Hehe, spot on...

 

[Elsie N]

...

I think there are enough bad things shot in 4K now. It's about time that camera makers release affordable 4K cameras so we'll be able to more interesting things, made by more interesting people than the usual WASPs. By the way, the American cinema has always been more interesting when made by foreigners (Germans like Lang, Lubitch, Europeans, or Italians, etc...) I think it's time now to see movies made by Afro-Americans, Mexicans, etc... the ones who can't afford your great and so expensive gear. The ones most of the cinema business usually completely ignores.

Kristin

PS : I had high hopes, when Jim started his company, that, at last, someone would understand this need shared by a lot of people. I thought that if someone could, it would be him. I understand that a private company needs to make money, and the release of the Red One then the Epic is a good choice, but the abandoning of the Scarlet 2/3" or the idea of an affordable 4K camera is just a betrayal.

Does that mean that only the rich can have access to the 4K future ?

Timeshare?... among like-minded individuals, of course.

ADDITIONAL: If I'm a little more tolerant of Kristin's views it is because as a former insurance agent, I understand the concept of "Attractive nuisance." An example that is often used by the agent trainers is if you have a swimming pool in your backyard and the toddler next door sees it and is attracted to it and falls in and drowns, you are responsible because you did not put up barriers to keep the child out. And while putting up a fence may remove the risk, it still does not remove the attraction of the pool.

Scarlet and Epic would qualify as an attractive nuisance, much like Air Jordans once did. Hopefully Kristin will do nothing illegal to be able to afford a RED attractive nuisance since the liability issue would only be useful as a defense (if caught) when used by a child. '-)

But seriously, those of us who have cameras cannot possibly imagine what it must feel like to know that the planet is moving to 4k and you have no way to affordably achieve that kind of quality. Probably it is even more frustrating to someone with an artists' hunger to see such high end equipment being used for anything less than high art. That would be a testament to the high regard Kristin has for high quality cameras.

Obviously I am trying to get inside Kristin's head and speak from there. Often when I do this it turns out I completely misread the thoughts of the person and just add to the noise.

 

[Hrvoje Simic]

It's about time that camera makers release affordable 4K cameras so we'll be able to more interesting things

Don't see the relation between resolution and ability to shoot more interesting things.

You can make great artwork on a tool in a price range you mentioned, and if it is great majority won't care about the quality of the pixels. If the creative part is pre-conditioned with high technical specs of the creative tool, it migh help re-thinking the motivation and inspiration.

Also, more affordable camera is not going to decrease other production costs, and if Scarlet pricing is a huge issue for an independent motion imaging artist, other production costs will be an even larger one.

Regarding the motivation for the first part of your post...what might help is comapring the availablity, pricing and quality of creative tools today and ten or twenty years ago...when adressing people for whom you think are getting a better deal than you, and you feel like you are stuck with crap.

 

[Andrae Palmer]

But seriously, those of us who have cameras cannot possibly imagine what it must feel like to know that the planet is moving to 4k and you have no way to affordably achieve that kind of quality. Probably it is even more frustrating to someone with an artists' hunger to see such high end equipment being used for anything less than high art. That would be a testament to the high regard Kristin has for high quality cameras.

JVC GY-HMQ10 4K camera is under $5000. If she's creating "high art"... then she ought to be getting paid. Same for anyone that is talented in this industry.

 

[Tim H.]

I think there are enough bad things shot in 4K now. It's about time that camera makers release affordable 4K cameras so we'll be able to more interesting things, made by more interesting people than the usual WASPs. By the way, the American cinema has always been more interesting when made by foreigners (Germans like Lang, Lubitch, Europeans, or Italians, etc...) I think it's time now to see movies made by Afro-Americans, Mexicans, etc... the ones who can't afford your great and so expensive gear. The ones most of the cinema business usually completely ignores.

Does that mean that only the rich can have access to the 4K future ?

This is definitely a growing trend here in America too, where people just wake up and sit on the couch and expect someone to walk through the door and hand them their future. Your future is what you make it. No one owes you anything. If you think you have talent to share with the world then share it, what is stopping you? You need 4K to share your art in the Cinema? Hardly. Can't afford a camera? Then get a fn job, work hard, save your money, and live, sweat and bleed for your passion.

Some of the greatest film makers of our of time did not appear because they could afford the latest camera of their time, they were successful or had the opportunity to share their art with the world because they have TALENT! Some may have had an easier time getting someone to notice it while others just worked harder.... or sorry to say, just had more TALENT than the person next to them. Stop making excuses for your lack of talent by blaming it on the camera. How Sad.

So only foreign film makers make anything worth while in America? Too funny. Poor people and poor countries don't have opportunities? I don't know why but when you mentioned hispanics I thought of Robert Rodriguez, you should read his book "Rebel without a Crew". He did some amazing things to pursue his passion, including making money by being a human lab rat, he went down into Mexico (his native Country) and shot a little film. He got this film noticed which then gave him a chance to make a "Real" movie with a "Real" camera - and now lately what has he given us? Spy Kids? It is what you make it, not all art is art to everyone.

Anyway, why am I even writing this? It surely is a waste of my time but your post was just off the wall.

 

[Jannard]

Kristin,

I'm not sure what you want but 4K at $300 is just not possible. If you feel betrayed... your expectations were not realistic.

This is hard stuff as evidenced by the others inability to do it either. 5 years ago you could buy a Sony F35 with recorder for $350K. It is a 1080P camera.

You aren't going to get much support for crying about price/performance of RED from me. We have busted our asses to get where we are and we think the industry is better off for our efforts.

This is also a Recon post... so please take your disappointment to another area of the forum.

Jim

No, that's not what I really meant, but if you like to film your dogs, that's fine with me, as long as you don't want me to watch. The problem isn't all those people making money shooting shit work like music videos, commercials, specs, wedding tuff, etc... It's a living, I respect that, there aren't a lot of interesting artists on Reduser anyway. The problem is more with the fact that it pollutes the atmosphere preventing the more interesting forms of art (feature/short films, docs, experimental,...) , which are more valuable to be shot with such top gear like Red's, in my opinion. But sure, it won't fund your gear.

I think there are enough bad things shot in 4K now. It's about time that camera makers release affordable 4K cameras so we'll be able to more interesting things, made by more interesting people than the usual WASPs. By the way, the American cinema has always been more interesting when made by foreigners (Germans like Lang, Lubitch, Europeans, or Italians, etc...) I think it's time now to see movies made by Afro-Americans, Mexicans, etc... the ones who can't afford your great and so expensive gear. The ones most of the cinema business usually completely ignores.

Kristin

PS : I had high hopes, when Jim started his company, that, at last, someone would understand this need shared by a lot of people. I thought that if someone could, it would be him. I understand that a private compny needs to make money, and the realease of the Red One then the Epic is a good choice, but the abondon of the Scarlet 2/3" or the idea of an affordable 4K camera is just a betrayal.

Does that mean that only the rich can have access to the 4K future ?

 

[Chris McKechnie]

Kristin,

I'm not sure what you want but 4K at $300 is just not possible. If you feel betrayed... your expectations were not realistic.

This is hard stuff as evidenced by the others inability to do it either. 5 years ago you could buy a Sony F35 with recorder for $350K. It is a 1080P camera.

You aren't going to get much support for crying about price/performance of RED from me. We have busted our asses to get where we are and we think the industry is better off for our efforts.

Jim

+1 to the RED GOD.

 

[Jake Wilganowski]

We appreciate the effort.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

..And to think I had almost all of the last 20-something posts flagged for deletion until I saw Jim's reply.

Move along. Nothing to see here.

 

[Elsie N]

JVC GY-HMQ10 4K camera is under $5000. If she's creating "high art"... then she ought to be getting paid. Same for anyone that is talented in this industry.

Good point on the JVC Andre, but RED and Redusers like you and me have touted the RED cameras so highly that it has become the aspirational standard. I for one could not contemplate shooting on anything less. And from my observations, true artists do not create for the purpose of making money, but for the making of the art. Artists are not generally good business people.

In my own humble undertakings, I did not buy Epics to make money... I bought them to make movies (which in turn I hope will make money) '-)

 

[Tim H.]

We have busted our asses to get where we are and we think the industry is better off for our efforts.

Jim

Exactly right Jim!!!

I'm not always a big fan of the "fanboyism" in these forums but you can't deny that Jim has risked everything for his passion and desire to make a Camera and take cinema to a new level. If not for Red and Jim's vision none of us would even be talking about 4K this soon - especially at a 10K price point. You couldn't touch a "cinema" camera for under 100K, let alone 10, 20, 30K until Jim lit the match. Thank you Jim!

Jim could have stuck with Oakley, could have sold it and retired on a private island somewhere but instead he risked it all, gave up any idea of sleep and stressed himself Sick. Kristin - what have you done?

While I don't always agree with everything that goes on here, I know it comes from passion and passion I respect more than anything.

 

[Jeff Whitehurst]

Jim, Thanks for saying what I was busting at the seams to say to Kristin. We have been waiting for what seems like forever for a camera like the Epic/Scarlet, and thanks to you and RED we finally have a cinema quality camera which can help give a voice to exactly the demographic Kristin claims you and RED left out. The glass ceiling of crappy prosumer cameras and amateur results is gone forever thanks to YOU. I am super excited to see what you have come up with at NAB, and it's just a damned shame this thread went as far as it did to derail your enthusiasm.