NAB new announcements...

[Will Wernick]

Kristen, I am sorry but this is offbase. No one is entitled to cameras. Those "Pros" you speak of have worked really hard to be able to afford them.

I want a bigger house, so my kids have more space to play, I can have bigger offices, my wife can have a bigger art studio, etc. We have to work really hard to achieve that. No one is going to start selling us big houses for dirt cheap just because we really want one and feel our lives would be better off because of it.

The prices of cameras have come way down. 6 years ago, many of us would not be here discussing owning this level of camera. Let's be thankful the prices are reasonable.

And by the way, I'm a bit offended by the tone of parents filming their kids with RED cameras. Yes, I have done that and I'm very happy I did. My daughter's early years are in archive quality media format. I don't apologize for that. I'm fortunate that it worked out that way.

Couldn't agree more with Steve's entire post. All of the Pros I know work like crazy.

Not sure why Kristen and many are so frustrated. There are tons of great choices out there, many are crazy affordable, but when it comes to the highest end gear, you are always going to have to pay to play.

 

[RayFrisby]

I would love to see RED offer a module that would send a data stream over fiber to a decoder box (RedRayPro?) that could process and display live 4K images with less than 1/50th of a second latency. Would be a terrific I-mag option, immersive environment element, etc. Just hoping...

Cheers - #19

Personally I have felt for the last three-four years that the lack of a Red-Deck has cost Red a lot in terms of sales and mass adoption of the R3D workflow.
IMO this lack of (mass) adoption by Broadcast Stations/ Post Houses/ Festivals etc.. is the biggest stumbling block Red faces at the moment.

Red-Ray cannot just be a Red R3D player but also capable of recording/ converting /playing/ outputting in current industry standards e.g. DNxHD and Pro Res
as well as streaming to the web. The number of third party recorders on the market at present is a testimony to this.

This is why all 4K cameras to be announced at NAB by Canon, Sony, Panasonic will also be able to record in industry standard codecs and be played by Broadcast Stations /Post Houses on
their own decks/players.

Something on the lines of the device below, some adjustments may be need but the basic principal is long overdue.

In my opinion Red needs to produce a stand-alone Red Rocket / Deck with built in
1.8" and 2.5" SSD Drive bays and CF reader with an internal Raid hard dive, with all current
connections including 3G SDI with Audio, Dual Thunderbolt, HDMI, USB, Firewire 800 and
ethernet port.
With a built in proxy module for different codecs and wireless streaming
it could also output in different codecs or stream directly to the internet.
If Red produces such a deck then any CF Card or SSD must be automatically
readable by both Mac and PC, so users can give SSD's and CF Cards directly to the end user.

If the unit could connect to Desktops and Laptops it could
export finished projects directly from the internal hard drive to
current decks such as HD CAM -D5 -DigiBeta etc... or export footage in
different codecs or stream directly to the web, as well as transcoding,
and monitoring output on film sets and other situations.

It would also act as a stand-alone player / ssd offload unit,
with built in export settings for different decks,
meaning it could be used with or without a computer.

The RED ROCKET / RED DECK would also fit into current Broadcast and Post Workflows as well
as Film festivals or other situations.

 

[Charlie_Grinnell]

Canon still can't even record 4k in camera....So not even where the redone was in 07..

correct me if I am wrong but I believe I have heard somewhere that Red owns the patent to "in camera 4k" could this be why all of these new cameras are doing "4k by recorder"? just a thought...

 

[Eston Diaz]

So Red waits for everyone else to "Attempt" 4K just to squash them a few days later. Love It!!!!

 

[Bob Gundu]

What??? How is that even possible? Perhaps a patent to encoding but to own rights to be able to record internally is a stretch.

correct me if I am wrong but I believe I have heard somewhere that Red owns the patent to "in camera 4k" could this be why all of these new cameras are doing "4k by recorder"? just a thought...

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

correct me if I am wrong but I believe I have heard somewhere that Red owns the patent to "in camera 4k" could this be why all of these new cameras are doing "4k by recorder"? just a thought...

I would say that's almost certainly untrue. If it's true I'm patenting in-camera 6k.

Canon has been recording in-camera 4k for ages. Just at 5-8fps. A new framerate isn't patentable.

 

[brett ogden]

What??? How is that even possible? Perhaps a patent to encoding but to own rights to be able to record internally is a stretch.

You need to remember That NOTHING is a stretch for JIM hehe

 

[Michael Millichamp]

Seems that Kodak has re-designed the C300 with state of the art specs...

Edit: Being German, I still prefer this C300.

You stole my joke Martin!

Kodak wins!

End of story!




***I actually found this camera at the Walgreens were I work...

 

[Charlie_Grinnell]

What??? How is that even possible? Perhaps a patent to encoding but to own rights to be able to record internally is a stretch.

Yeah I dunno, i remember I heard that somewhere.

 

[albert rudnicki]

We really can't wait for all the new announcements at NAB. We understand that there will be a few new 4K cameras announced. Finally!

4K delivery is certainly the future and 1080P will finally be buried as the mistake of the past decade. Film will be happy that it went to the retirement home with 4K taking over instead of 1080P.

Fortunately we feel that we have the distinct advantage going into NAB... and coming out of NAB. We hope all of you can stop by the RED booth to see what the real future looks like.

A quarterback doesn't throw where the receiver is... he throws where the receiver will be.

Jim

4k is such an old news...

 

[Ale Houston]

"4K video is captured by an approximately APS-H-sized portion of the full image sensor" are you f!"··$ing kidding me?? this is old news... Canon/Sony/Arri will have to step up the R&D and production departments if they want to keep up with this fight for a couple of rounds... and if Red launches a FF 6K or above Dragon, we are looking at another couple of years of Red dominance...

 

[brett ogden]

4k is such an old news...

Not yet Maybe Monday

 

[daniel caruso]

Sorry Kristin, but I will never want a 4K DSLR package. I never jumped on the tini tiny cameras with aweful bokeh and color, and would never want my camera that small or to resemble a DSLR in any way. I love my 20LBS Scarlet, small enough to maneuver, heavy enough to know its there.

I love what Red is doing and can't wait to see what comes next. I just received my cage and honestly, I can never see a camera company becoming close to the DSMC line of owner customization, aside from beautiful images, this feature is one not to be done elsewhere (maybe Arri to an extent). I have invested a lot in my Scarlet package, I only hope Red keeps this formfactor around so I can upgrade pieces when needed.

Despite someone putting out a 4K camera, I think it is only the spec sheet that matters here; Red will always have them beat on image quality, feel of the image, codec, the camera system, and above all, amazing customer support who is always there to help with whatever you need and improve your camera for free. Wish I could make the trip, next year for sure.

 

[Michael Dalton]

I think price will be a big thing. If priced similar, who would take a c500 over an epic. The 1DX C looks like a nice camera, and I'd want one for when weight is an issue. But at 15k, come on. I was really excited about this camera, but not for more then $5000.

Glad to see the 4k revolution has started, and love that lots of 4 gear is coming out. Bigger Better cheaper.

I'm loving my epic more with every announcement.

 

[Nick Morrison]

I never jumped on the tini tiny cameras with aweful bokeh and color

The size of a camera has no effect on bokeh.

Only the size of the sensor and design of the lens itself have an effect on bokeh. The bokeh of a Zeiss 50 1.4 on a Scarlet at 4KHD...will look essentially EXACTLY the same as it does on a 7D...as the sensor coverage is incredibly similar.

I admire your sentiment, and I also like RED a lot, but to suggest that a RED makes your bokeh better is probably pushing it a bit.

But I get where you are going...yes RED better than DSLR!

 

[Carter Cammack]

RED is awesome hardware, but it means so much more than simply hardware.
RED means affordable for the owner-operator DP and not having to rent gear for every test shot.
RED means professional quality everything, from cameras to lenses to body caps - ALL CINEMA GRADE.
RED means 4K/5K RAW workflow. No damaging compression or locked formats.
RED means maximum flexibility and minimum bullshit.

RED has claimed the niche. Others will try to follow, but they will never lead.

 

[BRANDON JAMESON]

brilliant!!!!!!

 

[Zeb B]

RED is awesome hardware, but it means so much more than simply hardware.
RED means affordable for the owner-operator DP and not having to rent gear for every test shot.
RED means professional quality everything, from cameras to lenses to body caps - ALL CINEMA GRADE.
RED means 4K/5K RAW workflow. No damaging compression or locked formats.
RED means maximum flexibility and minimum bullshit.

RED has claimed the niche. Others will try to follow, but they will never lead.

Done and Done . . . next topic

 

[daniel caruso]

that was read wrong Nick, of course size doesn't concern bokeh haha. I just mean I hate the unsmooth nature of 8 bit DSLR bokeh; mixed with AF lenses 7D bokeh is not pleasing. Red bokeh is better, mixed with nice glass, the color depth is a big factor no one seems to get.

A friend just sent me a link to the C500, canon keeps fooling the cinema market. Why do they insist on giving us 8bit color!!? Thats the reason I left the 5000 dollar level cameras. With Red I get 65536 values of color and every sky and sunset is silky smooth in gradation, after grading! It is so frustrating how other filmmakers do no see this, or understand it enough to matter and say hey, don't buy this camera because compared to 35mm cinema, this is a joke! Canon gave the C300 8bit, and now again, 8bit, no clue as to what they are doing. Everytime I grade I love to smooth look of Red's bokeh and my beautiful skies, for the same price!

 

[Nick Morrison]

that was read wrong Nick, of course size doesn't concern bokeh haha. I just mean I hate the unsmooth nature of 8 bit DSLR bokeh; mixed with AF lenses 7D bokeh is not pleasing. Red bokeh is better, mixed with nice glass, the color depth is a big factor no one seems to get.

A friend just sent me a link to the C500, canon keeps fooling the cinema market. Why do they insist on giving us 8bit color!!? Thats the reason I left the 5000 dollar level cameras. With Red I get 65536 values of color and every sky and sunset is silky smooth in gradation, after grading! It is so frustrating how other filmmakers do no see this, or understand it enough to matter and say hey, don't buy this camera because compared to 35mm cinema, this is a joke! Canon gave the C300 8bit, and now again, 8bit, no clue as to what they are doing. Everytime I grade I love to smooth look of Red's bokeh and my beautiful skies, for the same price!

Makes total sense, Daniel. Apologies on my end for being a totally humorless, anal nerd. HAHA. I'm also completely obsessed with bokeh and literally spend many nights just throwing different lenses on my camera for a half an hour and "testing out" bokehs.

But I hear you...8bit depth sucks. I can't tell you how many DSLR shoots I'v done where people's skin tones just fell apart and looked ghastly. And the fall off is a JOKE.