NAB 2008 Analysis

[number6]

I'm wondering if this isn't one of those "Build it and they will come" things? My guess is there are thoughts going through the minds of many of the world's great R&D thinkers asking "This is great... how do we take advantage of this?"

 

[mezmo]

A few years ago an old pal of mine put together a Film and Digital
presentation for a group of Hollywood Majors who had an interest
in lining up both for a side by side comparison. Shot for shot even
lens for lens. The results were projected in tandem with Film and
Digital projectors.
He spent well over a million bucks shooting it, sotra the 'mother of all'
camera tests. The results helped make decisions for the DCI spec and
allowed 'Hollywood' to give the thumbs up to a lot of new Digital tech.

It's interesting to note that 1080p was not considered a viable format
for exhibition by those testing and my old mate. I don't agree and
have made this clear to him at length and over many drinks,(hickups).
1080p is used a lot now in my region (asia pacific) with excellent results in smaller theatres and multiplex venues.
It's a sort of defacto standard for Independant 'first release' exhibition
in many houses. With several hundred screens availabe.
Indie theatre owners like it because they can get a print or copy of a film
as it's released in major theatres and take advantage of P & A at that time.
No more wating for dirty and scratched prints after the large exhibition
chains have finished with them.
But the problem with 1080p is that it's messy, no two theatres seem to
have the same equipment or setup. Companies have sprung up to handle
this problem, but the lease or rental costs they charge for additional equipment are approaching the cost of a 35mm release print anyway.
So as a producer, why bother, just strike a 35mm print and be done with it.

There is a HUGE market here for a simple, elegent, cost recoverable, digital exhibition SYSTEM that outperforms 1080p and has a price point
that's attractive to independant exhibitors. In my region they make up
almost 70% of all theatres owners and most have not yet gone Digital.
The company that comes up with such a system will make a killing, and
who knows, my old friend may have to do his 'mother of all' camera tests
all over again.
Mezmo

 

[garydxd]

Has anyone ever clicked on the link "Gear We Use" on the RED site? Well if you have, then you've probably seen the company QuVIS. It's my theory that the wavelet compression technology RED uses comes from them, but again that's my theory. Their products have been widely used for Digital Cinema Projection around the country. I'm betting they have a little something to do with Red Ray as well.

 

[JoshBertrand]

Even though RedRay uses standard DVD9's it could be spinning the discs faster to read a higher bitrate, right?

As CF's get cheaper and faster that seems like it could also be a great delivery format for theatrical distribution.

 

[Gunleik Groven]

Guessing glasses on:

CF will be the high-end cinema release thingy

DVD's will be your "4k in the shop" solution.

In other words:
CF will be out new DVD's...

 

[Blair S. Paulsen]

The Red brick road

The Red brick road

I wouldn't underestimate the value of showing Red Ray to create an engineering target for display makers. If we hope to see 4K display options for theatrical presentation or DI or home theatre in the nearer term it sure would help if the potential for a sub $1,000 USD player existed.

While the colorimetry, contrast, grey field uniformity, optical precision and lumens of output of the cheaper 1080 projectors is shaky we live in a time of under $5,000 USD units that typically outperform the source material. I sure would love to walk around NAB 2010 looking at 4K projection options under $10,000 that I could use for DI or micro-cinema applications and $40,000 units capable of full theatrical use ala the Sony 4K SXRD rigs.

 

[Randall Nott]

FOOTAGE:

The presentation "Shot on Red" was stunning. I forget sometimes just how talented my fellow Red Users are and it was a pleasure seeing what so many of you have accomplished in such a short time with 1,500 or so cameras out in the world. Congratulations and thank you for helping to prove what an extraordinary piece of equipment the RED has become. I think RED should add another screen and lengthen the running time at NAB 2009. Hell, I'd buy a ticket. The Argentine and Guerilla footage was impressive and captivating and I hope there will be a 4K venue in which to screen it when it comes out. Maybe on a prototype RED RAY?

Gee, going back to the root of this thread almost feels like I'm going off topic. Just wanted to add my thanks to Jeff for the summation and add my own suggestion here.

Footage suggestion: Reverse the order of the clips. Yeah, the Soderbergh teasers were great (and when will he make a 4K "Schizopolis II?"), but the "Headliner" spot should really go to the RED users reel. Partly because the unique community around this camera is a big part of what makes it special, but also the way it was edited together. They didn't just slap a bunch of clips together. The editor, whoever he/she was, put everthing together thoughtfully and artistically and the accompanying score was a perfect match. Only time I've walked out of a demo reel ready to buy the soundtrack.

 

[Rick Darge]

It was cut by Michael Cioni of Plastercity

He did an awesome job

 

[Randall Nott]

It was cut by Michael Cioni of Plastercity

He did an awesome job

Here Here!
Congrats Mr. Cioni!

 

[Barry Green]

Footage suggestion: Reverse the order of the clips.

I'd say the user clips up front was great. The ending "Guerilla" stuff was great. But "The Argentine" stuff in the middle looked weak, and dragged on forever. If you're going to re-cut that reel, trim down that Argentine stuff to maybe 30 seconds max. It felt like it went on for five minutes, and it didn't really do the Red One reputation any favors (2K anamorphic? Not impressive, the Guerilla stuff right after it was shockingly sharper).

Great move to put the red user stuff right up front. Speaks volumes for how Red feels about its users.

 

[Greg M]

I'd say the user clips up front was great. The ending "Guerilla" stuff was great. But "The Argentine" stuff in the middle looked weak, and dragged on forever. If you're going to re-cut that reel, trim down that Argentine stuff to maybe 30 seconds max. It felt like it went on for five minutes, and it didn't really do the Red One reputation any favors (2K anamorphic? Not impressive, the Guerilla stuff right after it was shockingly sharper).

Great move to put the red user stuff right up front. Speaks volumes for how Red feels about its users.

Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder...my favorite footage from the reel was "The Argentine" clips.

 

[Michael Cioni]

Thanks for the kind words, folks. Editing that reel was one of my favorite pieces. I'm really flattered by these posts because my whole goal was to try to create a little "film." So many camera reels are just footage compiled together. For Red, we wanted to make a beginning, middle and end. I also tried to split up the TV, music and features so it wasn't too random.
But you all had a lot to do with it since you gave me great footage. Argentine and Guerilla were both edited by Steven Soderbergh, so I didn't touch them, as they had their own unique look and feel.
But I should also mention that the colorist on all this footage including the Soderbergh footage was the PlasterCITY colorist and my long time friend, Ian Vertovec. As you all know what this stuff looks like in 4K Raw, he really brought the reel to life with his ever-changing grades.
michael

 

[Brandon Fraley]

Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder...my favorite footage from the reel was "The Argentine" clips.

agreed, I preferred the look of Argentine quite a bit over Guerrilla

 

[Finner]

Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder...my favorite footage from the reel was "The Argentine" clips.

I liked the Argentine best as well. For me it just had a much more organic natural feel then some of the ultra clean plastic looking footage.