More info...

[number6]

What if we're very patient? Like super duper patient? Like award winning patience? Can we email you with our phone number and Kelly will personally call us?

Now THAT's a line you would WANT to be first in.

 

[david farland]

Hey Jim, would you at least post roughly how many cameras which have been fully paid for and are waiting shipping? Also, if you don't want to waste time typing up a report each day just call me, tell me what's new in 20 seconds and I will transcribe for post here. Daily updates would really put most of us at ease.

Just how I am feeling.

Matthew

Matthew....In this spirit of openness, could you kindly publish your bank activity statements each day.

If a problem, just give me read only access to your accounts and i can take it from there.

David

 

[Pawel Achtel]

Matthew....In this spirit of openness, could you kindly publish your bank activity statements each day.

If a problem, just give me read only access to your accounts and i can take it from there.

David

That's funny. LOL

 

[Matthew Rogers]

Matthew....In this spirit of openness, could you kindly publish your bank activity statements each day.

If a problem, just give me read only access to your accounts and i can take it from there.

Ummm, I don't think that quite the same thing.... RED has got over $20,000 of my money and I've got no product in my hand. I don't even have info like, "well, you paid on this day, so it should be the third week of may" I just believe that it wouldn't hurt someone at RED at the end of the day to sit down with a beer and for two minutes type out a small report--at least until things are back to normal. I mean, what's going on there? People are getting their cameras without tracking numbers and all sorts of stuff. Maybe it's just the different of how we do business here in Tennessee and how they do it in SOCAL.

Not mad, just a little frustrated that when I ask for information, I don't even get a response back of, "sorry, we can't tell you that."

Matthew

 

[Pawel Achtel]

Not mad, just a little frustrated that when I ask for information, I don't even get a response back of, "sorry, we can't tell you that."

Matthew

Matthew,

I think we got exactly that response in Jim's lastest post. But, I can certainly relate to your frustration.

I planned for a shoot starting end of May based on conservative and published estimate of delivery (in the range of #2600). I sold my HDCAM gear accordingly, ordered Master Prime glass, etc..

The shoot is of extremely rare animals, which just started to bread in a remote area of Southern Australia and will continue to do so for maybe 6-8 more weeks. This has never been filmed before. It took me 5 years just to get a permit.

According to the updated schedule I won't get my camera for the next 3 months :angry03: The animals won't breed for almost 2 years from then....

Renting a replacement would eat up not only the entire purchasing budget, but also the whole budget for the shoot: say, ~$70k

Now, Big Jon says "do not plan on any shoot before taking a delivery". I would ask: Why would anyone buy this or any other camera and not plan to make a film with it?

So, I am as mad as one can be. Not calling Kelly to book a phone call with Jim, I know he is busy and his time is best spent on production and development. I know Red Team is working hard and I have great respect for their transparency and openness, but I can't hide the fact that I'm totally devastated with the delay, which will basically put a 2 year delay on my film....

I had no choice but, based on the information available, I cancelled the shoot. It breaks the heart (and the budget).

 

[Andrae Palmer]

Wow! I really feel bad that your shoot won't happen. Sounds like it would have been an awesome.

 

[Brian Ferguson]

This is the longest wait for a consumer item I've ever endured... when it arrives I've decided to worship it as a deity instead of using it for filmmaking.

Is it really a consumer item? I always considered it a professional item. So maybe you just need to shake it's hand, (support rod) instead of bow...

 

[Jason Ing]

Ummm, I don't think that quite the same thing.... RED has got over $20,000 of my money and I've got no product in my hand. I don't even have info like, "well, you paid on this day, so it should be the third week of may" I just believe that it wouldn't hurt someone at RED at the end of the day to sit down with a beer and for two minutes type out a small report--at least until things are back to normal. I mean, what's going on there? People are getting their cameras without tracking numbers and all sorts of stuff. Maybe it's just the different of how we do business here in Tennessee and how they do it in SOCAL.

Not mad, just a little frustrated that when I ask for information, I don't even get a response back of, "sorry, we can't tell you that."

Matthew

Here in SOCAL, reports don't take two minutes.

 

[Jonas Nyström]

Matthew,

I think we got exactly that response in Jim's lastest post. But, I can certainly relate to your frustration.

I planned for a shoot starting end of May based on conservative and published estimate of delivery (in the range of #2600). I sold my HDCAM gear accordingly, ordered Master Prime glass, etc..

The shoot is of extremely rare animals, which just started to bread in a remote area of Southern Australia and will continue to do so for maybe 6-8 more weeks. This has never been filmed before. It took me 5 years just to get a permit.

According to the updated schedule I won't get my camera for the next 3 months :angry03: The animals won't breed for almost 2 years from then....

Renting a replacement would eat up not only the entire purchasing budget, but also the whole budget for the shoot: say, ~$70k

Now, Big Jon says "do not plan on any shoot before taking a delivery". I would ask: Why would anyone buy this or any other camera and not plan to make a film with it?

So, I am as mad as one can be. Not calling Kelly to book a phone call with Jim, I know he is busy and his time is best spent on production and development. I know Red Team is working hard and I have great respect for their transparency and openness, but I can't hide the fact that I'm totally devastated with the delay, which will basically put a 2 year delay on my film....

I had no choice but, based on the information available, I cancelled the shoot. It breaks the heart (and the budget).

I'm really sorry for you - and I have "missed" one producton with my RED next week myself - so I know the frustration. However has Jim always stated "do not plan on any shoot before taking a delivery" or not to plan any shoot on the schedule. I will use my back-up next week.

 

[Michael Brennan]

Pawel, at least rest assured no one else will be shooting your animals on RED.
I feel for you as RED indeed is ideal for self produced programmes like yours.

Given the reasons for the delay are you just a little bit relieved that you don't have to rely on a new camera?

Despite RED allowing refunds a manufacturer taking full payment then not giving new delivery schedule is frustrating to say the least.





Mike Brennan

 

[Pawel Achtel]

Pawel, at least rest assured no one else will be shooting your animals on RED.
I feel for you as RED indeed is ideal for self produced programmes like yours.

Given the reasons for the delay are you just a little bit relieved that you don't have to rely on a new camera?

Despite RED allowing refunds a manufacturer taking full payment then not giving new delivery schedule is frustrating to say the least.

Mike Brennan

Thanks Mike,

I am happy with the explanation from Jim, but heart broken that I may not be able to film something I was obssessed with for the last 5 years. When you spend years of research, observe and film things researchers and scientists had no idea about and spectacular behaviour that simply defies any logic, you want to throw the best equipment at it and film it at its best. Two years ago I had to cancel the shoot because I didn't get the permit. Now I have (exclusive) permit, but I don't have a camera.

It is very difficult to self-fund a $6 mil film - selling all the assets you have and going into huge debt, and additional 2-year delay is difficult to accept, even though I entirely accept the reason for it.

 

[Nick Wolf]

Ahoy Pawel,

You are in Sydney and so are several other owners. Make a few calls and let that community know your situation and cut a deal or some sort of trade off.

You live in a land of swash bucklers matey give`m a whistle, someone will come to your rescue if I know the Aussies right.


DogDay

 

[Lewis-M Soucy]

Dear Pawel, if I had my camera, I'd go and lend it to you just for expenses! I can't believe no one is stepping in to go and meet you in Australia for expenses and a couple of bucks!?...

 

[Pawel Achtel]

Dear Pawel, if I had my camera, I'd go and lend it to you just for expenses! I can't believe no one is stepping in to go and meet you in Australia for expenses and a couple of bucks!?...

Thanks Guys, greatly appreciated!

I already had some encouraging messages, so I am re-assessing the situation and see if I can resurect this shoot somehow.

Yes, the "mateship" is something that makes me proud being Australian.

 

[Nick Wolf]

Pawel

The Aussies Rock big time!
Look forward to seeing some footage.
Keep us posted.

DogDay

 

[Tail Ends]

In response to Tyler Hawes' post of 4/30, credit cards are a mixed blessing for companies. Many vendors of low margin items won't accept them since the rates eat up too large a percentage of their net profit. Secondly, credit card companies are notorious for giving the benefit of the doubt to buyers who complain, forcing vendors to take back damaged products, go through a lot of paperwork and substantial bookkeeping costs. And having a lot of foreign sales makes using credit cards more troublesome.

Lastly, because of fraud, credit card companies require a lot from the vendor to prove that the card used was not stolen, that the shipping address is the same as the mailing address for the card and lots and lots of other rules which, if screwed up by the vendor, allows the credit card company to tell the vendor that they are not going to honor the sale, forcing the vendor to travel to the Falkland Islands (I don’t recall any posts from there) to sue, etc. which is impractical to most businesses. Nieman Marcus, high margins, lots of credit. Red, low margins (or so we’re led to believe), no credit.

I've thought from a business perspective, Red should have raised their prices by now. But because of the egalitarian philosophy, they choose not to. There probably aren't too many readers out there who would prefer a higher price but with the ability to use a credit card than the current policy.

Tail Ends

 

[frazer]

Many of us have got problems with our delivery delays, that's for sure, and I don't expect that mine is one of the worst, but here's my story, just for the record:

I recieved my "almost ready to ship" email, which specified that once money had been received, the camera would take "a minimum of 3-5 days to ship." Well, first off, a minimum isn't really a range (3-5), it's a minimum (3). And based on the fact that a range was specified, I imagined it would likely ship in 3-5 days and would most likely ship within 10 days and I assumed three weeks would be a very conservative estimate. So I took out a loan and booked the camera on a friend's feature starting three weeks after I sent payment. Because it's my friend, and Red rental rates are grossly inflated at the moment, I offerred him a very good deal on my whole package. The camera won't be here to start the feature unless it shows up in the next two days, so the rental I was supposed to get is going elsewhere to subrent a body, while I provide my lenses, sticks, monitor, accessories, etc to the production for free (and I had to ask the subrenter for a deal, to boot).

Meanwhile, my first loan payment will be due in about ten days, and I have no way to generate the money to pay the loan, since I have no camera to rent, so I have to use a credit card, which in effect, more than doubles the interest I'm paying on the loan.

I'm pretty bummed.

Yes, I absolutely understand the problems that Red is facing, but no, I don't understand why Red couldn't have kept me abreast of any and all potential delays, once they'd sent me an email asking me to send them money, lest I would have simply held out on the loan and not offerred my camera for hire.

:-(

 

[Ace]

Thanks Guys, greatly appreciated!

I already had some encouraging messages, so I am re-assessing the situation and see if I can resurect this shoot somehow.

Yes, the "mateship" is something that makes me proud being Australian.

Good to hear that your getting backup.. There are heaps of Australian owners. Post a message in the Australian user group forum.. I'll make it a sticky for you if you want. Perhaps it may help your cause.

 

[Stuart4660]

My sympathies go out to Pawel and Frazer :umm:

Reading the various replies on this thread, it makes me wonder: what is the main reason for buying RED? Is it as a rental item? Operator with own equipment?

RED One was hyped (not specifically by Red themselves) as the ideal camera for independent production. It is also being pushed as a serious contender to replace film and competes directly with Arri, Panavision, etc. - no matter how much they try to deny it :sarcasm: If future production emerges as the main reason then the 'don't plan any shoot til you take delivery' is difficult to live with. Films require planning. Actors and crew need scheduling, locations, studio hire, you name it.

Our main reason for purchasing RED is for production. It is an ideal solution for VFX heavy features: 4K digital, no scanning - love it! Unfortunately there is a limit to how flexible a schedule can be; Pawel's may be an extreme example, but it reflects the reality of production. The original estimated delivery for our #2538 was March, which became May, which is now August. To still shoot this summer we are forced into option 2 which is waste budget set aside for purchase on rental. Hopefully we can still use RED but there is a limited supply in the UK.

This is no reflection on Red who clearly are doing their best to overcome unforeseen and compound problems. However, don't plan til delivery = can't shoot RED if not delivering. One day though .... and then we too will be dangerous.
Stuart G.
Annix Studios

 

[Many Moosh]

We are working hard to reduced the delay. I would much rather spend our time doing that than keeping everyone posted on a day to day basis since it is changing as we solve problems. Give us a bit of time to sift through the rubble of the latest problem and see how quickly we can recover.

Thanks for your patience. Whenever your patience runs out, you can email Kelly with your phone number and I will personally call you.

Jim

First, he was honest with the problem, and then he said he'll PERSONALLY call you. WHOA! Now I don't kiss ass, but I got give Jannard props for customer service. I heard that Red had good customer service and cared for their customers, but I thought it was all hype. I did not believe it untit I read the above post. I am sold.

Keep up the good work guys,