Mics for Driving shoot

[Kim Frank]

Planing a lot of driving shoots for an Indie feature
I was wondering if anyone could recommend an audio recording sollution.
Besides keeping the windows closed and using a trailer.
If there would be 4 people in the car having Dialog,
what microphones would you use?
Hidden Lavs or supercadiol capsels - but where to hide them
and how many, and which ones?
Does anyone by chance have experience with this situation?
Regards
KIM

 

[Noah Kadner]

Depends is this free driving, towed or on a process or green screen stage?

Noah

 

[Kim Frank]

Depends is this free driving, towed or on a process or green screen stage?

Noah

Its gonna be a modern car like bmw7 towed on a low ride Trailer.
( what does 'process' mean?)

 

[Dan Hudgins]

(what does 'process' mean?)

(what does 'process' mean?)

(what does 'process' mean?)

Process means any shot that uses a process to look real but is not, like "blue screen process" or "background projection process" or "shufton process(sp?)" etc.

In the old days various processes were patentded, not that people respected that, so they did their "process photography" in secret so that they did not get sued over violating the "process patent". The best FX were the ones no one could see in the print.

Other "process" were "sodium light background process" and "IR background process" etc. All replaced by green screen process now?

Some process used optical printing to composite while others were done "in the camera" by backwinding/double exposure using fixed mattes (e.g. 2001) or used "Bi-Pack" in the camera (sometimes for stop-motion process).

If you wonder why it is called a matte box, that is because they did "matte process shots" in the camera (2709) by adjusting the matte slides in the matte box, the Mitchell cameras also had mattes inside the camera behind the lens. Traveling mattes could be animated and photographed through using Bi-pack in the camera, first pass for the foreground and second for the plate etc. Special mattes could be made with black cardboard (matboard) and a knife. The fixed mattes were used for split screen process and such.

Plate comes from using glass "lantern slides" for the background, you would blackout the parts with set and motion, shoot, then use a clear glass "counter matte" to shoot the foreground, the glass matte process... You could also do that in one pass with a beam splitter.

Panted backgrounds on glass is another "plate" process, (e.g. StarWars movies 1-3 episodes 4-6). If you paint on the back of the glass you get a smooth surface to light on the front, so texture in the paint does not make false highlights.

Hanging minatures is a "ceiling replacement" process. Sets did not have a ceiling so you could use lights from above, then optical or on set process were used to add the ceiling into the shot.

 

[ericyoung]

I believe two Sanken Cub-01 boundary mics taped to the roof (one for front and one for back seats) have been used to good effect, but probably need windows shut.

Individual lavs with good windshields might work with windows open as long as the actors aren't turning around to each other too much and going off mic or causing clothes rustle.

 

[Stephen Pruitt]

Just use individuals lavs on each of the actors. We did that, and it worked just fine. Simple. Easy. Sounded great. AND, we shot with the windows open.

FYI, we used Sonotrim lavs (probably the best-sounding lavs in the world) and Lectrosonics wireless systems.

Stephen

 

[David Mullen ASC]

Process means any shot that uses a process to look real but is not, like "blue screen process" or "background projection process" or "shufton process(sp?)" etc.

In filmmaking, you also call putting a car on a moving flatbed trailer a "process" shot -- they are called "process trailers". "Poor Man's Process" means when the car isn't moving and lights are used to simulate the motion.

 

[Dan Hudgins]

process...

process...

In filmmaking, you also call putting a car on a moving flatbed trailer a "process" shot -- they are called "process trailers". "Poor Man's Process" means when the car isn't moving and lights are used to simulate the motion.

Well, when the car is on a trailer with the camera mounted to the trailer+car, it is like background projection shooting except the background is real, but the driving is not real. Would it be called process if you just have the camera mounted on the car, but it is driving on the road for real? So "process" implies some kind of simulation (process), something not real?

By lights used to "simulate the motion" you mean that you pan lights past the stationary car/actor to make it look like it is going past street lights and such, so the background would be dark and out of focus? That is, just for night shots?

Did they ever use a moving roll of background painting for the background in driving process shots?

Having the car not moving sounds like a way to avoid noise pick-up...

 

[jimhare]

Stephen, I've found it difficult to get good clear sound from Lavs if they are hidden under the actor's clothing. What's a good trick for not seeing the mic, but getting good sound?

 

[Dan Hudgins]

Where to put mic...

Where to put mic...

What's a good trick for not seeing the mic, but getting good sound?

In another thread someone suggested in the actor's hair, I don't know how well that would work, but it might in some cases.

Anywhere out of the camera's view, like the other side of the neck? (you could use heavy #10 solid copper wire taped to the back of the seat to hold a small mic near the actors mouth on the side hidden from the camera, and shoot just side angles)

For myself, I think anything like that would be done ADR, so the sync would not need to be clean, but there are those here from a TV background that don't like ADR/looping so to each his own...

 

[JosephArthur]

Process means any shot that uses a process to look real but is not, like "blue screen process" or "background projection process" or "shufton process(sp?)" etc.

In the old days various processes were patentded, not that people respected that, so they did their "process photography" in secret so that they did not get sued over violating the "process patent". The best FX were the ones no one could see in the print.

Other "process" were "sodium light background process" and "IR background process" etc. All replaced by green screen process now?

Some process used optical printing to composite while others were done "in the camera" by backwinding/double exposure using fixed mattes (e.g. 2001) or used "Bi-Pack" in the camera (sometimes for stop-motion process).

If you wonder why it is called a matte box, that is because they did "matte process shots" in the camera (2709) by adjusting the matte slides in the matte box, the Mitchell cameras also had mattes inside the camera behind the lens. Traveling mattes could be animated and photographed through using Bi-pack in the camera, first pass for the foreground and second for the plate etc. Special mattes could be made with black cardboard (matboard) and a knife. The fixed mattes were used for split screen process and such.

Plate comes from using glass "lantern slides" for the background, you would blackout the parts with set and motion, shoot, then use a clear glass "counter matte" to shoot the foreground, the glass matte process... You could also do that in one pass with a beam splitter.

Panted backgrounds on glass is another "plate" process, (e.g. StarWars movies 1-3 episodes 4-6). If you paint on the back of the glass you get a smooth surface to light on the front, so texture in the paint does not make false highlights.

Hanging minatures is a "ceiling replacement" process. Sets did not have a ceiling so you could use lights from above, then optical or on set process were used to add the ceiling into the shot.

Its posts like these which really make me feel good about being part of the Red community. To freely share information that in our situation , we typically would not normally make such a scene or a shot . This opens a couple new venue choices for our style of recording. Thank you for explaining .

 

[Adrian Sims]

We're filming in 4x4 trucks towed on trailers through the Queensland bush. Our actors have pockets on their workshirts, so we are cutting holes in the back of the pockets to feed the lapels through from inside the shirts. Clip the mic heads onto a piece of card or folded fabric inside the pocket, on an angle facing their mouths, and 'Bob's your Aunty' - in the pocket, close to the sound source (mouth) and out of sight.

As the actors don't actually have to drive for real, we're also getting them to tape a shotgun mic to their inner-leg, on the shinbone, facing up to their mouths. They can then angle their leg to give the best pickup for our soundguy. The shotgun will serve as back-up audio. Mostly tight, head-high shots in the truck cabins so the shotguns will be well out of frame. Food for thought.

 

[Jon Frost]

I'd go with a Countryman B3 (or B6) Lav just below the level of the pocket top. Alternatively, in the collar of the shirt. Mic each person and if possible, record on individual tracks. This is one of the trial and error deals. Try some test recording with the same truck driving on the road/highway to see what works best before your actual shoot.

Other options:
Button hole with B6 lav
Shotgun with full blimp from below camera line

Let us know how it works out in production please.