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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Matte Box Woes

I would agree, I guess it would then leave CVB some time to produce a larger version. Then again, if he can figure out how to make a compact 6x6...

I have no idea how he would do it and maintain functionality.
Its something to consider in terms of production.
Which to start with?
A compact 6x6 would probably have compromises and 2 MBs are more expensive...
 
David Mullen ASC said:
Well I think a 4x5.6 mattebox would do the job 90% of the time.
Click to expand...

Cooke and Angenieux zooms are commonly used lenses. If somebody knows a 4x5.6 mattenbox that fits to one of those zooms please let me know since I have to find a suitable mattebox for my Cooke 20-100 and don't want a huge MB 14.

If Curt build on that fits to my Cooke I'll be the first one to purchase.

Hans
 
I agree, 6.6x6.6 would be fantastic. I am in a similar dilemma - I want to go 6.6x6.6 for flexibility with grads, lenses, etc but don't want to buy an MB-14. If Arri made a "MB-21" - eg cheap and lightweight like an MB-20 but that does 6.6x6.6, that would be cool, but they don't. On the other hand, the MB-20 does 5.65x5.65 and 5x6. Would either of those be enough for the big Cookes, etc? I imagine you'd run into problems if you wanted to rotate or move a 5x6 a lot. Are the 5.65s a dead-end or the way of the future?

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
 
Hans von Sonntag said:
Cooke and Angenieux zooms are commonly used lenses. If somebody knows a 4x5.6 mattenbox that fits to one of those zooms please let me know since I have to find a suitable mattebox for my Cooke 20-100 and don't want a huge MB 14.

If Curt build on that fits to my Cooke I'll be the first one to purchase.

Hans
Click to expand...

Hi Hans,

Fairly sure a 4 x 5.65 will work with a 20-100, it does not matter that the top & bottom of the lens are 'matted'.

Stephen
 
Hans von Sonntag said:
Cooke and Angenieux zooms are commonly used lenses. If somebody knows a 4x5.6 mattenbox that fits to one of those zooms please let me know since I have to find a suitable mattebox for my Cooke 20-100 and don't want a huge MB 14.

If Curt build on that fits to my Cooke I'll be the first one to purchase.

Hans
Click to expand...

Hello Hans,

IF I remember right, the big Cookes and Angenieuxs can be used with a 138mm round filter. This I think would be easier to incorperate into a smaller foot print mattebox. This would not let one use the larger grads but you could use all the other standard types, (polas, nets, low cons etc.) and it could be a seperate removable carrier ring for when you are using cine primes or smaller zooms. I'll poke around and try to find front diameters for the larger zooms, or mayby an owner (Stephen?) could chime in with some info.

Chuck
 
We used a 4x5.6 Panavision mattebox on a Cooke 20-100mm all the time on "Big Love". And on the 11:1 Primo zoom as well. Now those matteboxes at Panavision have been modified over the years, some shaved down for anamorphic lenses, etc.

But I believe that you need a 6x6 mattebox on an Ang. Optimo, for example (not that I've ever been able to afford to rent one of those). Some goes for the original T/1.6 9.5-105mm Digital Primo zoom that Panavision built for F900's used on "Attack of the Clones" -- in fact, even a 6x6 mattebox vignettes in the wide-angle end of the lens until you zoom in to 11mm, which is ridiculous.
 
chuck colburn said:
Hello Hans,

IF I remember right, the big Cookes and Angenieuxs can be used with a 138mm round filter. This I think would be easier to incorperate into a smaller foot print mattebox. This would not let one use the larger grads but you could use all the other standard types, (polas, nets, low cons etc.) and it could be a seperate removable carrier ring for when you are using cine primes or smaller zooms. I'll poke around and try to find front diameters for the larger zooms, or mayby an owner (Stephen?) could chime in with some info.

Chuck
Click to expand...

Hi Chuck,

I am not at home but will try to get the info tomorrow.

Stephen
 
Hi Chuck, Stephen and David,

Thanks a lot for your input!

Unfortunately Panavision matteboxes are not for sale AFAIK. Any other clever solution would be gladly appreciated. View Factor?

The Arri MB 15 will fit a Cooke 20-100 and utilises 4x5.6 trays but not 6.6x6.6, biggest size is 5x6 which is pretty odd to me. Unfortunately I cannot rent a MB 15 in Cologne (nearest meaningful town). Does anybody know how heavy it is compared to a MB 14 (bigger) for instance or a MB 20 (smaller)?

Regards,

Hans
 
Wide-open. This was an idea that Jim Glennon, ASC had when he started Season One, to use an older zoom wide-open as a form of diffusion, to be more flattering to the actors. In fact, over time, we found that for close-ups, we still needed to use a little more diffusion.

Personally, I would have been happier if the lenses were a T/2.8 or faster because it was hard to light the interiors at a low enough level that the backyard set outside the windows realistically overexposed.
 
4x5.6 is the best opion

4x5.6 is the best opion

Personally i agree with David, i think the 4x5.6 is the best option.
I personally have everything from 138mm to 4x4, 5x5, & 4x5.6 and some older Series 9's, 72mm screw-ons etc......
If you are fortunate enough to own or even be able to rent one of the big Cooke or Angenieuxs zooms then you can probably afford to cough up the extra $60 p/d rental for a 6.6x6.6 matte box.
I'm guessing a a big majority of RED buyers are moving from DV or ENG/EFP style cameras so they may already have substantial 4x4 & 4x5.6 filter collections, more so than guys out there with 6.6x6.6 sets, and hence a lot of those DV /EFP guys probably can't afford to start buying 6.6x6.6 glass.....
A Schneider 6.6x6.6 85 is $333 the same in 4x5.6 is $250.......
Saving nearly $100 per filter can add up to a fair few extra filters in the kit....
just my 2 rubles worth (0.0774743 USD)...
Paul
 
ND Grads

ND Grads

After following this thread for some time, there's something I was wondering. Are 6x6 filters tray required for moving up and down ND Grad filters? If I understand correctly I can use some 4x5.65, but they'll be fixed, is that correct? So this way, I guess that if the area I want to correct does not fit in the "grad part", then I'm out of luck... right?
 
It depends on the focal length, but yes, with 4x5.6 grad filters you are very restricted in how much you can lift up or push down the filter, and even less so side-to-side (if you wanted a side grad, you'd have to buy vertical grads in 4x5.6).

On a longer lens, you have a little more flexibility in sliding the filter tray up or down before you see it come into the shot. But if the lens is too long or the depth of field too shallow, you may need hard-edged grads just to create or see a demarkation. Grads generally come hard-edged, soft-edged (most common), and then the attentuators.

So 4x5.6 grads are used, just that you are limited to the area that gets the grad.

Since 6x6 filters are square, you can put them into the tray with the grad vertical or horizontal, move them up & down, rotate them diagonally, and not get the filter frame edge into the shot, since they are oversized.
 
I totally agree that if I am renting a big lens, I can rent a 6.6x6.6 matte box. Kurt, why don't you support 5.6x5.6'es and 138mm rounds like the MB-20?

They we could use:
- 5.6x5.6 filters for grads
- 138mm for pola
- 4x5.6 for everythine else

I know 5.6x5.6's are a non-standard size, but they seem like a nice compromise so you avoid buying both horizontal and vertical 4x5.6 grads...

Of course this is nicer for those who don't own a large grad filter collection already ;)

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
 
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