Looks...

[Lorenzo Straight]

Maybe a silly question, but can we load these looks into Apple's 'Color'. Would be cool to use in addition to RCX. I'm sure the next update to Final Cut Pro will address Red's plug-in for us, right.

 

[Pietro Impagliazzo]

I am increasingly convinced that people who don't want to learn are the problem with Red post.

There are a lot of things to learn. Until you do learn, stuff mysteriously looks bad or good. Once you do learn though - the post is a breeze and frankly the post process is a joy.

A little investment in time goes a long long way with Red!

So ... is there a Reducation class happening right now? Cool to see you guys using the forum as an interactive learning tool!

Lack of readily available properly compiled documentation. That's a pain in the ass and a fact with anything RED.

Fiddling with forums and scrounging the internet is not a nice way to learn, specially if one has a deadline.

REDucation is step one, for who wants to pay and even knows it in the first place. Now the community needs other steps, specially now since RED is a more consolidated system.

 

[Lee Dashiell]

.... Not sure what you guys are smoking.

Jim

I couldn't imagine not using RCX on location and couldn't imagine not having Rocket.

Watching Jannard get fired up on the forums is always priceless conversation.

 

[David Mullen ASC]

I couldn't imagine not using RCX on location and couldn't imagine not having Rocket.

I think what Alexander is referring to is the lack of TIME on a movie set to spend at a DIT station playing with RCX, Red Rocket, etc. I certainly don't have five minutes during a day to spend playing with color-correcting, except at lunch and after wrap. This is one reason I develop looks in pre-production and generally don't play around with them until post-production -- during the shoot, I do not have the time, nor do I feel comfortable making judgements about gamma, color, etc. in a non-controlled viewing environment.

 

[Alexander Ibrahim]

I think what Alexander is referring to is the lack of TIME on a movie set to spend at a DIT station playing with RCX, Red Rocket, etc. I certainly don't have five minutes during a day to spend playing with color-correcting, except at lunch and after wrap. This is one reason I develop looks in pre-production and generally don't play around with them until post-production -- during the shoot, I do not have the time, nor do I feel comfortable making judgements about gamma, color, etc. in a non-controlled viewing environment.

Yes, I lack time as DP to do this.

I chronically lack budget to hire qualified help to do it for me - so if I want it done I have to do it myself. What I do in prep has to be the look until I have time to work with the images again - which really isn't until post.

Thank you David for helping clear up what I'm trying to say here.

 

[Lee Dashiell]

I do this as a DP and make the time to take advantage of it. It's a valuable tool for me.

 

[David Mullen ASC]

How do you "make time" to leave a busy set and color-correct footage?

 

[Dan Kanes]

RCX is an invaluable tool in understanding the red as a "filmstock".

Know your limits, what you want out of it, and what you can do with it.

 

[Jannard]

REDCINE-X is a powerful tool... I don't think anyone doubts that. Each can use it when they want and for whatever they want. But there is no discounting it's power to price ratio.

Jim

 

[John Marchant]

Its worth remembering that 'on set' means different things to different people. We all use the terminology, but there are plenty like me for whom the workplace is not a thronging pressurised movie set, but a busy workplace struggling to accommodate the unfamiliar presence of a film crew. Time pressures exist in all cases, but where multi-role, multi-skill is the norm, so portable and expository tools like RCX fulfill a critical purpose.
Hollywood makes headlines, but Jim and Red know that their customer base is broad so the tools are too.

 

[Jordi Figueras]

REDCINE-X is a powerful tool... I don't think anyone doubts that. Each can use it when they want and for whatever they want. But there is no discounting it's power to price ratio.

Jim

We did all the color correction of a whole 13 chapter series just using REDCINE-X. It saved our asses and make the footage look (almost) as good as possible given our resources.

For me it's a prime tool. Easy to work with and great results. Ok, no secondaries, but we didn't have that time either! People loved the look anyway.

 

[Vincent Laforet]

I am increasingly convinced that people who don't want to learn are the problem with Red post.

There are a lot of things to learn. Until you do learn, stuff mysteriously looks bad or good. Once you do learn though - the post is a breeze and frankly the post process is a joy.

A little investment in time goes a long long way with Red!

So ... is there a Reducation class happening right now? Cool to see you guys using the forum as an interactive learning tool!

Have to agree - the post isn't that bad if you do it right. And that quality you get in return is unmatched by few if any cameras out there... knowing and understanding a little bit of post is a must to get the most out of your camera (even if someone else is doing all the post.)

 

[Tim Sutherland]

Now the only thing left on my wish list for RC-X is that there was an option to have the lift control peg the highlights and adjust the blacks only as opposed to the current method which lifts all values together. I know that's how the ASC CDL chooses to do lift, but pretty much everything else I use pegs the highlights, so it would be more comfortable doing it that way. As it is I end up using the shadow adjustment first, then work with Lift. Maybe my coming Euphonix control surface will help once I get away from controlling via mouse.

Tim

 

[Raphael Varandas]

Worked with a Portuguese DP this month ... Last Week Indeed.
He shoot some amazing stuff on Rio de Janeiro for ESPN USA.
We add his looks to REDCINE X 454 ( RED ROCKET Enable ) and export 1080P Prores 444 to ESPN Television workflow to maintain the DP ID Look.
We have a long time conversation about raw ang rgb and pros and cons , but thanks god and RED - we can shoot 4K in Brazil with a Portuguese DP doing a Color Correction in Portugal while we can transcode the Raw( Full Res) 4K in Brazil, export whith(DP) looks for 1080P for a English Director to an American Television
Thanks JIm, RED.
Cheers

 

[C_Westover]

Epic can load the look in an RMDs directly so that will be easier.

Couldn't find any instructions on how to go about doing this. Sounds pretty simple, I'm just not finding it. Can someone enlighten me?

I am sorry if I missed it but how again do I load a look from RCX into my EPIC-M?

Me too!

 

[geoffboyle]

RAW + Look = everyone is happy. RAW + changed (improved) Look = everyone is happier. Looks = non-destructive = very good thing.

Jim

This is the approach that we took on Mutant Chronicles in early 2006 but unlike now it wasn't free!

We had to grab DPX files into SpeedGrade and then generate looks that could be used by both our Truelight box and software, this combiination had a list price of in excess of $40K at the time.

It was slow and I had to do the revised grades in my downtime in my hotel room.

Now with RCX it's free and fast.

I think it's truly amazing that this is available to us and I will never shoot RED without a decent laptop and RCX next to me.

 

[Tom Lowe]

Cant wait to try this. Just what I need, actually.

 

[Laura Creecy]

I always appreciate when people share their workflows and found this thread insightful to other's experiences. These are my experience using Looks on set…

I bounce back and forth between post (asst. editor/colorist) and "DIT" and have been working in both capacities with Red since fairly early on. I work in low budget features ($500 - $1.5m) mainly. I have found RCX, and all the variations of programs before, invaluable. I second that it is amazing that Red releases them for free, and that is what makes lower budget and big budget films on an even playing field - when you have someone on board who knows how to utilize the tools. I sympathize with those DPs who have worked with unorganized DITs or DMMs - the reason I started migrating to set was because I was asked based on my post experience and because I was tired of getting harddrives all a mess and missing footage.

Every DP I have worked with works a little different, and generally it depends on their Red experience as well. Depending on the locations/setups/budget at this level I often find it a time constraint for both me, the DP, and camera crew, to take the time to set an in camera look when we are constantly changing setups. Even if we are in one location for several days, there are often several scenes shot there with different lighting setups creating the need for a more tuned in look for each one. The last feature I worked on, I averaged 4-9 unique looks per day. Some could be recycled and then tuned in a little more.

I should first say that I usually make friends with the first and second and kindly and repetitively remind them to shoot me a color chart at the beginning of a roll with each major lighting change, so that there is always a record of proper white balance. I pull these charts into a separate folder (clearly labeled with scene number and description) on the root drive so that they are easily accessible for anyone who may be looking at the drive in post-production. I do this as a secondary precaution in case of any metadata problems. I also like this if there is lighting with mixed color temps or lots of camera filters.

I then spend most of my time getting a pretty tuned in first-light look on the footage. I only grab the DP during a major setup change, or more often at lunch, to go over the first half of the day. After lunch I make whatever changes the DP wanted or transcode (on a rocket). Same thing at the end of the day. If I have any major questions during the day, I of course alert the DP and ask him/her to find a few minutes to come visit my monitor. More often then not, the DP might not even visit my monitor once they trust me, and it can be asked simply "Hey scene 52 looks a little warm to me, was this intended or should I bring it down?" Done.

As far as monitors on set are concerned - because of my background as a colorist, I feel like its nearly impossible to get a true and accurate color grade on set with so many variable environments. Even in a tent, I often have stray light bouncing in from somewhere. I've used just a regular Samsung Monitor/TV to color grade on if there is no budget for something better. Not ideal, but at least I can match color and exposure across two cameras or CU/WS and get a somewhat decent one-light in RCX. At the level I work at, there often isn't money for something better, nor do I have the funds yet to purchase my own hi-end monitor. If possible I try to get production to swing for a duplicate of whatever monitor is being used at video village or what the DP is monitoring on and then match all of those in camera prep as close as possible, so at least we are all looking at the same image. When necessary I always try to remind DPs/Dir/Prod of the nature of the Raw file and the possibilities in a DI with the proper software to create secondaries and power windows.

Having watched so many multiple camera shows as an asst. editor, I really do find this one light on set is appreciated by the editor, but also by the dir and producers who are often sending rough cuts out as film festival submissions before the final color grade. Also, once the final edit is complete - there is usually a reference movie of the offline created and sent off to the post house doing the DI - again if something spontaneously happens to the metadata, the colorist has this to work from long after we all forget what we talked about on set.

I think its great when a grade I might have done on set makes it all the way through post, but I know in the end, its really just a one-light, a first pass to be fine tuned later on.

 

[Marc Wielage]

I agree -- I think your comments are dead-on, and also match my experience here in LA over the years. Thanks for adding your thoughts, LCreecy.

 

[Ricardo Moreno]

Since you ask. Thanks for the complement.
The most important part. It is to know the latitude of your sensor (in the old days your film) the greatest tool for me are the on-board charts. I definitely use my lightmeter, I started with film so I feel powerless with out it. And thats how I give the look by adjusting the relationship and rations between lights. I work faster with it.

In regards to the exposure. I never expose by looking at the monitor. Since the lighting condition can full my eye, I only go by my lightmeter combine with the RED on-board tools which are very powerful. No camera has so many tools. This is one of biggest reason I love red. I expose to try to get the thickest negative, in my shadows and sometimes to blow a little the detail in the middle tones (with light), even if it looks bad and flat. Thats the whole point. The problem is the clients monitor, which we adjust brightness and contrast to compesate (when he is not looking..lol) . I have some RCX presets created in REDCINE X, that I always carry with me, mainly with contrast increments and small color shifts to get the client excited. Once they see the footage they relax and eat.

In my opinion, RedCine X is the second most powerful tool along with the camera. It's designed to deal with R3D files, maybe you wont do the final color on it but it allows you to understand and know the capacities ans accuracy of your sensor, the most important thing to expose the RED.
RM
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