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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Lens shopping...

Irmeli R said:
anyone else interested in a holga lens rehousing? it'll also cover the epic 645 format :)

holga-120gcfn-pink_big.jpg
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I'm more concerned with getting the octo-action sampler lens modification. 3D be damned octo-action-sampled-vision is the future of film making.

I could only find the piddling action sampler with its inferior 4 lenses.
http://shop.lomography.com/shop/main.php?cat=Best_Sellers&pro=sss
 
ShadowMaker SdR said:
A completely unrelated question, but if all lenses create image circles, then why are sensors rectangular?
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Because we didn't want to rethink the rectangular frame after hundreds of years of perfectly good use once photography rolled around.
 
32mm image circle?

32mm image circle?

Jannard said:
When shopping for a new lens set, make sure you consider the following:

EPIC 5K is accomplished with a 32mm image circle. The new RED Pro Primes are designed to accommodate that. Those lenses that only do a 30mm image circle (standard S35) will only cover 4K on the new EPIC S35 brain.

Something to keep in mind.

Jim
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Jim,

Slightly off-topic, but I think there's still some confusion in the community about the resolutions and sensor sizes offered by the DSMC brains.

I seem to remember (please correct me if I'm wrong) that all the S35 and FF35 sensors (whether SCARLET or EPIC) share the same pixel pitch, which would mean that an S35-sized crop on a 6K FF35 sensor equates to the same 5K resolution and area of the full S35 sensor.

However, by my calculations, the quoted 30x15mm sensor size of the S35 would require a 33.5mm image circle, and the quoted resolution of 5120x2700 would imply non-square pixels for this area.

Brook and Bruce posted some predictions/estimates in this thread, and I agree that look-around is likely the reason for these disparities, but I've never seen any of this officially confirmed.

Is there any chance you could give us some further information on the active sensor areas and/or look-around?
 
Paul Leeming said:
Given that the best guess as to their origins is that they are rehoused still lenses, probably they will cover FF35 which means they will work just fine on Epic's 32mm image circle.
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Thanks Paul, that makes sense. This would future proof these lenses for those who own them.
 
PaulClements said:
Hi Jim,

Does this mean that when people want to shoot S35, with anything other than Red lenses, they will likely have to crop from 5k, given that the crop from 5k to 4k is likely to be much larger than the 2mm circle of coverage difference?

Isn't that just adding more post production because people are having to crop their footage if they shoot with S35 lenses other than Red's? Thus creating a reason for people to bad mouth the camera when they are shooting with it? Example: "Why did they make the sensor larger than S35? Now we're seeing vingetting on our monitoring and the editor's pissed because he is having to resize everything in post!"

Would it not be worth having a normal S35mm setting on the camera (4.8k or whatever) for lenses that resolve the 30mm circle and having a S35mm+ setting for Red lenses?

Thanks
Paul
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Paul... of course there is a "normal" S35 setting on the camera that shoots 4.5K (roughly) with standard PL mount lenses. So you are safe buying any of the new lenses and shooting with this setup. BUT... if you want to shoot 5K, you will need lenses that cover a 32mm image circle.

There are a ton of shooting options and lens choices. Just trying to make sure our customers aren't disappointed after spending a ton of money because they are ill informed.

Since there are many lenses coming out at NAB that give our RED customers more options (a very good thing), we just want to make sure that you ask the right questions when comparative shopping.

Jim
 
Steven Hilder said:
Jim,

Slightly off-topic, but I think there's still some confusion in the community about the resolutions and sensor sizes offered by the DSMC brains.

I seem to remember (please correct me if I'm wrong) that all the S35 and FF35 sensors (whether SCARLET or EPIC) share the same pixel pitch, which would mean that an S35-sized crop on a 6K FF35 sensor equates to the same 5K resolution and area of the full S35 sensor.

However, by my calculations, the quoted 30x15mm sensor size of the S35 would require a 33.5mm image circle, and the quoted resolution of 5120x2700 would imply non-square pixels for this area.

Brook and Bruce posted some predictions/estimates in this thread, and I agree that look-around is likely the reason for these disparities, but I've never seen any of this officially confirmed.

Is there any chance you could give us some further information on the active sensor areas and/or look-around?
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, the assumption is wrong. Not every sensor shares the same pixel size. Will post a comprehensive table, or maybe we can get Brook to post one of his masterful charts, showing all the options. Give us a bit of time.

Jim
 
Jannard said:
Since there are many lenses coming out at NAB that give our RED customers more options (a very good thing), we just want to make sure that you ask the right questions when comparative shopping.
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Heheh.. IB/E Optics: "Specifically designed for dia 30 mm CCD Sensors"
 
Lauri Kettunen said:
Jim, also bit unrelated question. Is it possible that RED announced the specifications of the Epic X brain mount before the camera is released?

For all sorts of reason some of us will not be able to switch from the existing lens/mount system immediately to the new RED lenses. Consequently, this will mean some of us will not be able to upgrade R1 to Epic X before the new mounts are available. Taking into account how long it has taken to get 3rd party mounts for R1 it comes in mind that perhaps the transition time could be minimized if the specs are announced to the 3rd parties well in advance.
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I would second this "hope" or request. I "hope" that Red and Birger might be able to work together early on this one....nudge nudge...
 
Does this mean Epic 5k is a new proprietary size that doesn't conform to any known standard?
 
Shawn Nelson said:
Does this mean Epic 5k is a new proprietary size that doesn't conform to any known standard?
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That's not what it means at all... it means that our new sensor size not only covers conventional S35 (and every lens out there), it has additional "elbow room" for many more options. It is taller than the R1 sensor so you have more anamorphic choices. It is wider so you can record 5k with some lenses, including the RED Pro Primes and most still lenses... or any other lens that has a 32mm image circle or larger. If you have standard PL mount lenses, you can record roughly 4.5K (which I don't consider to be a bad thing).

This program just gives our customers a LOT more options, which happens to include all older and current lenses in the market.

I don't see any format standard on the acquisition side. Shoot what you want. Deliver what you want. 2:1 was not really used by anyone until the R1. Now, it is the most shot ratio. Progress and options. That would be us.

Jim
 
Shawn Nelson said:
Does this mean Epic 5k is a new proprietary size that doesn't conform to any known standard?
Click to expand...

It just means that the S35 capture resolution is about 4.5K like Jim said. If you want to capture 5K, you need to expose a larger area of the sensor. Your lenses need to be projecting an image large enough for that. RED is being very upfront about it, because the image circle of S35 and S35 plus a bit are so close. Wouldn't want unhappy customers because of something as small as that.

So, yes, it is 'non-S35-standard'. Proprietary, not really, it is just an image circle. Don't know enough about cinema lenses to know if 32mm conforms to some other standard. FF35 would cover it...
 
Jannard said:
Paul... of course there is a "normal" S35 setting on the camera that shoots 4.5K (roughly) with standard PL mount lenses. So you are safe buying any of the new lenses and shooting with this setup. BUT... if you want to shoot 5K, you will need lenses that cover a 32mm image circle.

There are a ton of shooting options and lens choices. Just trying to make sure our customers aren't disappointed after spending a ton of money because they are ill informed.

Since there are many lenses coming out at NAB that give our RED customers more options (a very good thing), we just want to make sure that you ask the right questions when comparative shopping.

Jim
Click to expand...

Great, thanks for that Jim. It's just that having shot with the Red One on more shoots than I can remember I know all too well how people gripe about the pettiest thing about the camera, and frankly it's stupid and annoying... Give them nothing to winge about!!!

Thanks
Paul
 
This is interesting.

According to Pawel Achtel's tests [link], the Master Primes have these image circles:

75mm: about 37mm diameter
35mm: 31mm diameter
14mm: 31.1mm diameter

How are these things measured? Is there a hard edge outside 31mm (on the 35mm lens), or is it where vignetting starts, or?
 
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