Gordon Prince
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I agree. You fanboys suck. Luis is right.
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Is the RED One ever going to be upgraded to the Monstro chip?
- Thread starter Stephen Pruitt
- Start date
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Jason Ramsey
Former Admin
<mod cap>
no need for rudeness and disrespect.
We're talking about cameras. Folks don't need to get so worked up to the point of being disrespectful to each other. If you can't discuss things in a rational manner, please stop wasting bandwidth
</mod cap>
later,
Jason
no need for rudeness and disrespect.
We're talking about cameras. Folks don't need to get so worked up to the point of being disrespectful to each other. If you can't discuss things in a rational manner, please stop wasting bandwidth
</mod cap>
later,
Jason
Meryem Ersoz
Well-known member
Why doesn't everyone just shut up, sit down, and wait to see what the Dec. 3 announcement brings? This is RED time. Big breakthroughs, sudden changes.
You're dealing with the only company on the planet where the CEO listens directly to the buyers. And then exceeds expectations delivering the goods. Trust the process.
You're dealing with the only company on the planet where the CEO listens directly to the buyers. And then exceeds expectations delivering the goods. Trust the process.
david farland
Well-known member
Yup, I was going by the weight of replies from members/Red....but hey, neither do you by the way!
D
Posts: 1,080p......do I get a little plaque?
FMG battery
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david farland
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1,081...never mind
Roberto B
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stop it.. or when you'll receive the check, it will be outdated..
Steve Sherrick
Well-known member
This is like spending Thanksgiving with a dysfunctional family. :biggrin:
Where's the love?
Jim will tell me what I need to know on the 3rd. If things have changed, I'll plan accordingly. Until then, must keep shooting RED as much as possible. Still so much more to learn.
Luis Otero
Well-known member
Dave,
Please, no insults. We are adults and can communicate without an attitude. So please, refrain from trying to impose your positions by insulting; it does not work with me at all!!! I always have noticed that this is a clear pattern with your postings.
1. There are many other people asking for the same path. Just read other postings in this and other Threads.
2. Mood swings? If so, I also recommend you to write a response, keep it without send it for at least half a day, and then revisit what you wrote.
3. I admire Jim and his ingenuity very much. He was my "model" when I was completing my Doctorate in Business Administration. If the PS part of my posting bothers you so much, I can remove it and send it directly to him, or via Jarred. Would that make you feel at ease? I really hope so... Please let me know so I can proceed with the removal. You see, I can negotiate without manipulation.
BTW, I am a centered person; I do not need to manipulate, just communicate. So I do not fell an ounce of embarrassment since I write what I feel in a courteous manner, trying to convey a message.
3. It seems that you are the only irritated, so do not try to sale your position as the way the entire forum members feel; that is kind of childish. Posting #120 of this thread, authored by Mr. King says it in a way I could not do it: "Speak for yourself. You do not represent the majority, silent majority by the way." Also Gordon said it right on his posting #121.
BTW, thanks Gordon for your willingness to speak your mind without feel intimidated by bullies.
4. I had an excellent Thanks Giving day! Actually, I gave thanks for many things, specially for my wife and "kids", and also gave thanks for the opportunity to be part of this project from the get-go since I have grown as a business person, as well as an artist.
5. I do not have an agenda. To have one, you must have a position (which can be changed as many times as the puppeteer wants). I do have a standing, which uses the reasoning to deal with areas that I feel I can negotiate, not manipulate. If you do not like it, please do not read them since your reactions can trigger an ulcer, and also makes me feel insulted, which I do not appreciate at all. Again: "Speak for yourself. You do not represent the majority, silent majority by the way."
6- To feel and write what I have written I do not need to hear from you that you have an opinion that "you sound like you are an okay fella..." I am not a kid, David. I am intellectually mature enough not to depend on others' opinion to feel good with me, myself and I.
7- We are not defined by the number of postings, as you tried to manipulate on posting #124. We are perceived, analyzed and respected by the quality of our postings, and how much they add to this cyber-community.
BTW, congratulations to achieve the 1080p, David!!! Oh, sorry, 1081... I can start an account to collect the monies, as suggested in post #125 by FMG battery. I promise not to pull a "scam", like the Red One. Oh, I miss those days of brotherly love felt on this forum to support the "scam"!!!. Mine is now numbered 711, so I intend that a Seven 11 Station will always be shown briefly on all my narratives, shorts or features if I am lucky enough).
I sincerely hope you had a great day too!
Respectfully,
Luis Otero
Well-known member
3rd...
3rd...
Oh, look, 3rd in a re-arrangement of R3D!!! Good Karma, I think.:shiftyph34r:
What will be re-arranged? Hey, I do not believe in coincidences...:bleh:
3rd...
Oh, look, 3rd in a re-arrangement of R3D!!! Good Karma, I think.:shiftyph34r:
What will be re-arranged? Hey, I do not believe in coincidences...:bleh:
Jannard
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Luis,
It sounds like you are ahead of me in the education department. I am a USC School of Pharmacy dropout. But I have built two businesses from scratch. The 1st one from $300 in my garage that now employs over 3,000 people worldwide. RED is the second.
I realized a long time ago that as hard as I tried, I could never make everyone happy. There were always one or two percent of the people that I just agreed to disagree with. I also know that if I tried to satisfy those last two percent, it would be to the detriment of the business and all the employees that count on a paycheck. In times like these, this is no small issue.
As much as we interact with and listen to our customers... more than any company in just about any industry, this is a benevolent dictatorship. It is not a democracy. Our customers know what they want. They don't always agree, but each opinion that is given with good intent is considered. Many of the changes to the RED program are a testament to that. But.
Our customers do not know the inner workings of our company. They do not know our costs, be they development costs, BOM (bill of materials), overhead, etc. Companies do not stay in business by losing money. Since it is not ever likely that we will share this information, it is up to us to decide what we can and can't do for our customers. If we do a good job, they stay. If we don't, they buy from someone else.
We do not "negotiate" with our customers. We listen carefully, weigh all factors and make our best judgment calls all things considered. That includes customer satisfaction and the financial health of our business. Neither one can be had at the expense of the other.
I have paid close attention to everyone's opinion, including yours. I have listened to the reasonable and the unreasonable (usually uninformed in my estimation) from RED employees and customers. I have to decide what we will do. I sincerely hope that our customers will place themselves in our position (and up against what the rest of the industry does) while forming an opinion of our performance. We certainly place ourselves in the customer's shoes more than you would ever realize.
These are exciting times for RED, our customers and the whole industry. I am anxious to hear the response to our Dec. 3rd announcement.
My best,
Jim
It sounds like you are ahead of me in the education department. I am a USC School of Pharmacy dropout. But I have built two businesses from scratch. The 1st one from $300 in my garage that now employs over 3,000 people worldwide. RED is the second.
I realized a long time ago that as hard as I tried, I could never make everyone happy. There were always one or two percent of the people that I just agreed to disagree with. I also know that if I tried to satisfy those last two percent, it would be to the detriment of the business and all the employees that count on a paycheck. In times like these, this is no small issue.
As much as we interact with and listen to our customers... more than any company in just about any industry, this is a benevolent dictatorship. It is not a democracy. Our customers know what they want. They don't always agree, but each opinion that is given with good intent is considered. Many of the changes to the RED program are a testament to that. But.
Our customers do not know the inner workings of our company. They do not know our costs, be they development costs, BOM (bill of materials), overhead, etc. Companies do not stay in business by losing money. Since it is not ever likely that we will share this information, it is up to us to decide what we can and can't do for our customers. If we do a good job, they stay. If we don't, they buy from someone else.
We do not "negotiate" with our customers. We listen carefully, weigh all factors and make our best judgment calls all things considered. That includes customer satisfaction and the financial health of our business. Neither one can be had at the expense of the other.
I have paid close attention to everyone's opinion, including yours. I have listened to the reasonable and the unreasonable (usually uninformed in my estimation) from RED employees and customers. I have to decide what we will do. I sincerely hope that our customers will place themselves in our position (and up against what the rest of the industry does) while forming an opinion of our performance. We certainly place ourselves in the customer's shoes more than you would ever realize.
These are exciting times for RED, our customers and the whole industry. I am anxious to hear the response to our Dec. 3rd announcement.
My best,
Jim
Luis Otero
Well-known member
Thanks...
Thanks...
Jim,
As I said before, I used Red Co. and your strategy as my "model" at one point, and I highly respect you and your courage and determination: heck, I have the product of your hard work! It is called #711 - Dr. Red. Well, I also have sunglasses from the first business too!
Your words speak louder that insults and innuendoes (call it Mr. Farland), so they are greatly appreciated by all of us. And I think I am speaking for more people that own a Red One than one think.
Your commitment toward us, which includes hearing from the customer base, is remarkable. So, I rest in peace (no, I am not in bed waiting for the black angel) and trust your judgement on the hard balancing act of dealing with the business needs, unknown by the customers, and the fact of the implications of what they are asking for.
I apologize if I used the word negotiation. My wrong... but I was just trying to encourage people to understand that this forum is an avenue of advancing our thoughts, so we should use it effectively, and negotiation came to mind.
Actually, I think that I really know how much you place yourselves in the customer's shoes. That is why you have been successful on this and other endeavors.
Thanks for posting this refreshing and well thought words. And thanks for continue to analize all points of view before making the final decision. So, "don't be mad, be glad" during this decision making process.
And yes, we will rally the 3rd (or R3D?) as we did the 13th; we are very anxious to know!
Warm regards,
Thanks...
Jim,
As I said before, I used Red Co. and your strategy as my "model" at one point, and I highly respect you and your courage and determination: heck, I have the product of your hard work! It is called #711 - Dr. Red. Well, I also have sunglasses from the first business too!
Your words speak louder that insults and innuendoes (call it Mr. Farland), so they are greatly appreciated by all of us. And I think I am speaking for more people that own a Red One than one think.
Your commitment toward us, which includes hearing from the customer base, is remarkable. So, I rest in peace (no, I am not in bed waiting for the black angel) and trust your judgement on the hard balancing act of dealing with the business needs, unknown by the customers, and the fact of the implications of what they are asking for.
I apologize if I used the word negotiation. My wrong... but I was just trying to encourage people to understand that this forum is an avenue of advancing our thoughts, so we should use it effectively, and negotiation came to mind.
Actually, I think that I really know how much you place yourselves in the customer's shoes. That is why you have been successful on this and other endeavors.
Thanks for posting this refreshing and well thought words. And thanks for continue to analize all points of view before making the final decision. So, "don't be mad, be glad" during this decision making process.
And yes, we will rally the 3rd (or R3D?) as we did the 13th; we are very anxious to know!
Warm regards,
david farland
Well-known member
Whoa ...did I hit a sore point!!
I don't fluff round Luis and I don't sugar coat insults.
I've seen requests like yours and others, rise to such a level where the communication is broken between Redusers and Red e.g. Jim's last sabbatical because he had too much of unreasonable requests! And i'd be pissed off too...
If I think you persistantly ask for too much in a relentess fashion that is opposed to what I feel...I'll say it.
As it doesn't represent what I feel is a reasonable request and becomes a pointless argument to the level that it's detrimental to the free exchange of reasonable requests or to the point Red shut down... it affects me...I'll call it for what it is and how it's delivered.
....particularly when it's all boiled down it simply sounds like a 5 year old asking for something he shouldn't or ain't gonna get.
It goes something like....
L: I want a lot for free
R: You can't have it
L: You promised
R: No we didn't
L: yes you did
etc.....
phewie......as I said, I think the constant request is boring, unreasonable and has a good chance of pissing off & closing down the old guy.
But most importantly, I think it's wrong....so I'll say that.
And if you disagree, great....you'r welcome.
I just don't take your stance one bit...I care for reasonable requests, it's when the unreasonable ones become all pervasive that the Reduser/Red communication closes down and that concerns me very much and is the reason for any 'strong' stance on your constant broaches for these freebies.
All I've heard you say is your RedOne should be a $17K gold credit to spend on whatever you feel whenever you like...for some reason?
But I feel your request and premise is unreasonable and I guess others (& Jim) do to.
But as we know it's Jim's business to structure deals on Red kit.
I can't possibly understand the inner structure/strategies of Red and it's marketing policies.
There's too interwoven/complex for me (as an outsider)to attempt to get in there with a screw driver.
But I will point out where I think there maybe flaws and my position on all this is....I believe Jim's made one 'smallish' omission in his last announcement......and that was not to have a subsidised trade-in for the Epic S35 to the FF35. Comments?
Dave
I don't fluff round Luis and I don't sugar coat insults.
I've seen requests like yours and others, rise to such a level where the communication is broken between Redusers and Red e.g. Jim's last sabbatical because he had too much of unreasonable requests! And i'd be pissed off too...
If I think you persistantly ask for too much in a relentess fashion that is opposed to what I feel...I'll say it.
As it doesn't represent what I feel is a reasonable request and becomes a pointless argument to the level that it's detrimental to the free exchange of reasonable requests or to the point Red shut down... it affects me...I'll call it for what it is and how it's delivered.
....particularly when it's all boiled down it simply sounds like a 5 year old asking for something he shouldn't or ain't gonna get.
It goes something like....
L: I want a lot for free
R: You can't have it
L: You promised
R: No we didn't
L: yes you did
etc.....
phewie......as I said, I think the constant request is boring, unreasonable and has a good chance of pissing off & closing down the old guy.
But most importantly, I think it's wrong....so I'll say that.
And if you disagree, great....you'r welcome.
I just don't take your stance one bit...I care for reasonable requests, it's when the unreasonable ones become all pervasive that the Reduser/Red communication closes down and that concerns me very much and is the reason for any 'strong' stance on your constant broaches for these freebies.
All I've heard you say is your RedOne should be a $17K gold credit to spend on whatever you feel whenever you like...for some reason?
But I feel your request and premise is unreasonable and I guess others (& Jim) do to.
But as we know it's Jim's business to structure deals on Red kit.
I can't possibly understand the inner structure/strategies of Red and it's marketing policies.
There's too interwoven/complex for me (as an outsider)to attempt to get in there with a screw driver.
But I will point out where I think there maybe flaws and my position on all this is....I believe Jim's made one 'smallish' omission in his last announcement......and that was not to have a subsidised trade-in for the Epic S35 to the FF35. Comments?
Dave
András Puiz
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If you deliver something that you truly feel is quite something and way ahead of anyone else, it feels really frustrating if some clueless whiners demand more. Yeah, let the first thousand customers trade in their Ones for Scarlets. And let the first 772 customers get Scarlets for free. That will make everyone happy... Until someone with a serial number below 99 demands a pony and the Golden Gate bridge.
And excuse me, but the idea that first customers are the biggest advertisement and should thus be rewarded is plain laughable. Guess what, if the product is great, all of its customers will be great advertisements. It's part of the strategy. It's included in the price, if you will. I own some Macs, and no month passes by without me turning someone into an Apple customer without trying at all. I even joke around saying that I should get a commission from Apple.
Apparently, some people are saying the same about RED and they're serious.
Hell, I'm not even a RED customer yet (waiting for the Cheap-O-Scarlet to go on sale some time in the distant future), but I'm already annoyed by this attitude of entitlement.
Yeah, I have zero posts, and I'm not even a cinematographer, so I should probably shut up. But I can call bad attitude without those credentials as well. Peace out.
And excuse me, but the idea that first customers are the biggest advertisement and should thus be rewarded is plain laughable. Guess what, if the product is great, all of its customers will be great advertisements. It's part of the strategy. It's included in the price, if you will. I own some Macs, and no month passes by without me turning someone into an Apple customer without trying at all. I even joke around saying that I should get a commission from Apple.
Apparently, some people are saying the same about RED and they're serious.
Hell, I'm not even a RED customer yet (waiting for the Cheap-O-Scarlet to go on sale some time in the distant future), but I'm already annoyed by this attitude of entitlement.
Yeah, I have zero posts, and I'm not even a cinematographer, so I should probably shut up. But I can call bad attitude without those credentials as well. Peace out.
Josué Ignacio Saldaña
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I remember when I first heard about Red in school... "from the dude that makes Oaks..." times where so frustrating because of the relative low quality one can get back for their $. But as soon as I realized RED was around, I formed an LLC (to spend half the money than otherwise would have been needed) and worked my wife and I worked our butts off alswyas aiming to get the camera debt free. Red hadn't even begun shipping yet. So bamb! we came up with the downpayment and almost a year later, we have the RED. Now it is up to us to turn it into something else... i.e. more REDs. Not to say that some people here are not reputable cinematographers, but if you have a RED and are happy with it... getting more than what you initially purchased... .... .... .... ... ... ... .... I don't get it man! I didn't finish my Business Admin degree w/ UMUC, but am on my second business start-up (can't say I employee 3k peoples, but 12 is a major headache for me). If I am as clear as RED was with me with one of my customers, and they buy it and then I turn around and deliver so much more to the point that this customer is up at 3 a.m. ohhhhin and aaaahhhhhhhhing... then a year later when I am ready to take my work to the next level then all I get is :ranting2: WOW... it blows my mind.... the whole reason why so many of us have the opportunity to even say without any regrets I am a cinematographer is because we are in the pocession of a RED1; why would I want this company to slow down. Even if they create things that go far above and beyond my reach (617 as a prime example) why would I try to cripple them with my words just because I can't get one... or don't see myself involved in a project of that magnitude; however, if the day ever came and I am involved in one then I know where to get one. I am happy with the RED1 and I am very happy with the new line ups as well.... I drool on the screen with the renders, even though I am not reaching for one financially.... but it makes me proud... kinda of like seeing someone you really respect and thank move up in life... YEAH MAN... GO ON!!!!!!!!!!
Josue
p.s. I need the Adobe plug-in :weight_lift: baaaadly
Luis Otero
Well-known member
Dear Dave...
Dear Dave...
Dave,
I will not glorify your non-value added postings and insults any more. I already received a message from Jim, which by the way, is a very professional and encouraging one, as he always responds to non-obnoxious questions, complains or individuals.
He clearly understands and acknowledges the underlining request, and is not searching and reading between lines fictitious claims made by you, such as "you want a free camera?"
Have a great life and a bright future with your Red One, or any upgrade you decide to do in the future.
Respectfully,
Dear Dave...
Dave,
I will not glorify your non-value added postings and insults any more. I already received a message from Jim, which by the way, is a very professional and encouraging one, as he always responds to non-obnoxious questions, complains or individuals.
He clearly understands and acknowledges the underlining request, and is not searching and reading between lines fictitious claims made by you, such as "you want a free camera?"
Have a great life and a bright future with your Red One, or any upgrade you decide to do in the future.
Respectfully,
- Admin
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play nice kids...
Luis Otero
Well-known member
Yes sir...:bleh:
Still owe you a beer, but I am frozen her in Iowa so I cant leave the house...:cold: Cannot wait to move back to Orlando, FL, or better, to Thousand Oaks, CA,,,
Regards!
Jason Ramsey
Former Admin
glad they listen to you
I'm sitting here changing usernames, I could accidentally hit the ban button a couple of times... :devil:later,
Jason
Luis Otero
Well-known member
Listening
Listening
Jason,
Yep, I am glad too, but not surprised. They, Jim and Jarred, always have paid attention to any customer with a reasonable rationale to support the request. Sure, the delivery is as important as the rationale; being rude and obnoxious (like some examples on this thread) will not take you far with them, or anybody, if you know what I mean. :mail1:
Cheers!
Luis
Listening
glad they listen to you
later,
Jason
Jason,
Yep, I am glad too, but not surprised. They, Jim and Jarred, always have paid attention to any customer with a reasonable rationale to support the request. Sure, the delivery is as important as the rationale; being rude and obnoxious (like some examples on this thread) will not take you far with them, or anybody, if you know what I mean. :mail1:
Cheers!
Luis
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