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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

IMS news please

This does support the rumor that P&S didn't really follow through.

1. They designed it on their own without consulting RED
2. They sent the final version to RED for eval
3. RED rejected it, saying the i-Cable needed to be cut
4. P&S said it didn't, and emailed photos through
5. Nothing...

If that's it, I don't blame RED. P&S needs to make an effort here and have real conversations about what needs to be modified to make it warranty-friendly.
 
The version I heard was (EDIT: Jarred writes later that this is not an accurate description how things went)
4. P+S redesigned the mount, making the change between mounts a user-serviceable procedure.
5. In the process, the mount became cheaper.
6. P+S sent documentation and photos of the change to RED.
7. P+S did not hear anything
8. P+S saw now reason why the mount should void the warranty, and made the ill-advised decision to publish that on their website.
9. P+S removed the note from their website
10. Silence
11. After some requests by RED users, P+S sent further documentation after IBC to RED
12. Silence

It may very well be true that p+s have been bad communicators, but maybe they could be told what is expected from them to get this thing sorted out.

We do not expect the warranty to be uneffected by a mount change, but please help us understand why Birger and IMS are treated differently. And I do not mean to be a pain in the (spam), I just want to understand why RED does not want me to use IMS.

A simple note like "IMS will never be RED certified" or "RED is waiting for P+S to send us xxx, so that we can evaluate the mount" or "We believe IMS to be harmful to your camera because xxx" or "We at RED want to give our customers more choices in lenses, and are actively working with P+S to resolve the situation." or even "RED does not co-operate with competitors." would soothe our minds.

But all this highly unusual silence and thread deleting really is discombobulating. (I always wanted to use that word.)

Bottom line: I love RED, and I love the idea of the IMS. Why can't RED and P+S be friends?

8467_1222941261.jpg
 
Like I was telling Jimhare the other day, no one can tell what RED has in its sights. What their product road map is. They're creating it as they go. On the other hand, P+S Technik responds to market needs to pick up where the manufacturers left off and fill the gaps, so to speak, hence the development of the IMS. But it's hard for them to keep the eye on the ball, let alone connect. Of course, RED being the ball in this case.

I guess the impasse stems from two parties who don't wish to commit to each other under largely uncertain terms.

And we suffer the consequences.
 
Jarred Land you've offered a few words here. I guess Jim doesn't have time with the design of two new cameras on the way. This may be comparing apples and oranges but I have seen an instance posted on reduser where the Red Handle has broken and many reports of it cracking. Now if this was a third party product I guess it would void the warranty since you could have a camera drop and break. Hmmmmm, interesting dilemma?

This is what I received from P+S, "At the moment, there is still silence fron RED side. I was talking to Ted Schilowitz on IBC, but no reaction at all yet. The ball is on RED side of the field now. P+S TECHNIK's IMS does not harm the RED camera."

I do apologize ahead of time if more recent news has been posted in another thread.

I love my Red camera, I love the replacement of the audio board for free. If you are going the manual route the P+S mount would be awesome. If I had the cash I would own a Birger Mount, and Andy Mount, and a P+S Mount.
Because of my budget I want a manual FD mount 1st and a electronic Nikon mount when it is available. The new top of the line Nikon zooms rival even primes from all SLR makers at the wide end. This is what I've read in reviews.

I think we all know that there has been some B**S on both sides of the fence. So where do the wires go now?
 
Does anyone know what is being done with the i-cable now? I sent a letter to P+S and if I hear anything I will post it.
 
1Dog said:
The new top of the line Nikon zooms rival even primes from all SLR makers at the wide end. This is what I've read in reviews.
Click to expand...

Did I understand it well?

I heard the opposite that Canon...>>quote>>>:

1022.jpg

"Canon Zoom Lens EF-S 10-22mm f/3.5 - 4.5 USM.

This is a great lens. It's so great it makes me want to swap over to Canon from Nikon,
because it's better than my favorite Nikon 12 - 24 mm lens. It's better because it has
less distortion and costs less. I paid over $1,000 for my Nikon; this superior 10 - 22 sells for $700..."

LINK>>>
 
Con's, you can't use screw on filters.....

Con's, you can't use screw on filters.....

http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/14-24mm.htm

"The Nikon 14-24mm f/2.8 AF-S is an ultra-ultra wide zoom. It's not a fisheye; straight lines stay straight. It is intended for use on the D3, D700 and film cameras. It works great on the D300, but you're paying dollars and pounds just to use the center of the image. The 12-24mm DX and Tokina 11-16mm are smarter ideas for the D300 or any other DX camera.

The Nikon 14-24mm f/2.8 AF-S sets a new standard in ultra-ultra wide angle lenses. It is the best on the planet, and by a large margin. The 14-24mm is significantly sharper than any fixed or zoom ultrawide from Canon or Nikon that I've ever used, and I've used both Canon and Nikon's 14mm, 18mm and ultra-wide zoom lenses extensively.

The 14-24mm does things no lens before has done. It is sharper wide-open at 14mm in the far corners than my fixed 14mm f/2.8 is stopped down at f/5.6! For sharpness, the 14-24mm is blazingly sharp and devoid of any coma or softness at every aperture, everywhere in the full film and FX Digital field. It's just nuts! Optically, if you're looking too close, it makes the other ultra-wides look like poo-poo. Of course if you're just taking pictures, any of the other lenses (20-35mm, 17-35mm, 18-35mm) works fine, and they take filters which the 14-24mm can't."
 
There is no question... the 14-24mm from Nikon kills everything out there in the same category from any company..... and i say that being a Canon (until recently) guy.
 
Martin Weiss said:
The version I heard was
4. P+S redesigned the mount, making the change between mounts a user-serviceable procedure.
5. In the process, the mount became cheaper.
6. P+S sent documentation and photos of the change to RED.
7. P+S did not hear anything
8. P+S saw now reason why the mount should void the warranty, and made the ill-advised decision to publish that on their website.
9. P+S removed the note from their website
10. Silence
11. After some requests by RED users, P+S sent further documentation after IBC to RED
12. Silence
Click to expand...

This is not an accurate depiction of what actually happened.. not that it really matters that much at this point...

Just to be clear and so everyone knows.. the IMS mount voids your RED ONE warranty.

P+S took that notice off their website for some reason, but i want to make sure people understand that is not because the problem went away...
 
Thanks, Jarred. Very much appreciated to get some rumors cleared away.

Could you let us know what the problem you mention is? Just so that those considering the IMS can make an informed decision. Is it the famous iCable? And in that case - is that problem that the IMS "pushes" that cable into the camera body?

Thanks.
 
it wasn't just the cable.. it was a combination of issues, including the complete removal of the structural part of our lens mount ( which by itself voids the warranty) .. and although not a reason for the rejection the mild deception that was marketed to the customers doesn't help much.

And to kill the rumors... RED is not trying to just bury the IMS adapter for some sort of protection to sell RED LENSES or what have you..... I personally was the one that even tried to make this marriage happen in the first place.

I personally requested the mount be sent to RED during NAB so we could approve the changes, which we never received, and only after I again personally requested it again at Cinegear then a week later with an email follow-up did we actually receive it... and we tested it and unfortunately our suggestions were turned away.

Remember.. there is alot of things we know ahead of time that affects how these decisions are made.... for example the changes we made to the ipin system for the Audio Upgrade program that will happen shortly, the side effects of heat, etc. etc. etc. There are many things to consider besides looking at it like just changing a couple screws...
 
It does not hafta be Nikon.. Birger makes a great solution ( and i think he is starting to get them out faster) , and there are more options coming soon :)
 
:) I know about Erik´s mount, and would love to have one. I might even have posted on that thread once or twice... Problem is, my camera gets here pretty soon, and Erik has only started deliverying the first few mounts.

Today, the option is PL or Nikon.

In a few weeks/months time it will be even more exciting.

And maybe, maybe one day P+S gets proactive again...
 
To be honest I knew it from the beginning that my installation of IMS voids the RED warranty (btw, I installed IMS by myself).

Sorry, but I couldn't resist because I wanted to try out on RED more still lenses that I already have.

It was sort of a "mad scientist" step but it worked well.

Until today I didn't have any issue with my RED or IMS.

Everything works perfect.

If RED team make request and want to have a look up at my RED with IMS,

please let me know that (PM or email)

and I will sent my RED to California by Fedex immediately.

-------------------------

I did't try out Nikon 12-14mm zoom till today but Ken Rockwell sometimes sounds controversial:

"What About Canon?

I'd buy the Canon 10 - 22 mm lens in an instant if I had a Canon digital camera. The Canon 10 - 22 mm is better than any of these four lenses, including the Nikon."

Quote from Ken Rockwell's "Digital Wide Zooms" test that includes four lenses:

Nikon 12 - 24 mm f/4, Tokina 12 - 24 mm f/4, Sigma 10 - 20 mm f/4 - 5.6 and Tamron 11 - 18 mm f/4.5 - 5.6.

LINK>>>
 
Thanks for the offer Sanjin, And by all means, anyone can install the mount if they choose.. We arn't trying to tell anyone what they can and cannot do... its your camera.

But when it comes time for the free warranty upgrades and time for the camera/sensor/EPIC/ etc upgrade program... camera's with voided warranties dont get those emails.
 
Jarred Land said:
Thanks for the offer Sanjin, And by all means, anyone can install the mount if they choose.. We arn't trying to tell anyone what they can and cannot do... its your camera.

But when it comes time for the free warranty upgrades and time for the camera/sensor/epic/ etc upgrade program... camera's with voided warranties dont get those emails.
Click to expand...

Thanks Jarred for the reply.

At the end of the game I'm screwed anyway.

But if I would pay for the upgrade (RED) and of course for a full price of Epic how it is about my status in that way?
 
Jarred Land said:
It does not hafta be Nikon.. Birger makes a great solution ( and i think he is starting to get them out faster) , and there are more options coming soon :)
Click to expand...

Thank you Jarred for answering these begging questions. For myself and others that are not big companies but very independent, $ for lenses simply isn't there. The "more" options make owning RED even better. 8)
 
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