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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Impractical RX transcode times / is transcoding even necessary?

N

Nathan Adler

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Hey guys,

I apologize in advance if questions along these lines have already been answered. I cruised around these forums a bit and found one thread that sort of addresses my issues but I have more regarding workflow past selecting which files to use for offline.

My issue is similar to the issue posted in the link above: impractically long render times in generating ProRes offline files that are plagued by sporadic crashes. I would just keep rendering: except that RX continually crashes and babysitting a 24 hour render isn't something I can do.

My question is two fold: can I speed these renders up through settings in RX or am I bumping up against the limitations of my hardware and RX's capabilities? From reading that thread it seems that the answer is: yes there are limitations to batch transcoding with RX unless I am using a Red Rocket. Is this correct?

Secondly, if i cannot speed up the transcode process without spending more money (purchasing Clipfinder, more RAM or a better video card or Rocket) is there any good reason I *need* to create offline files to cut with, or can I just edit with the QT refs that the RED generated on set?

I am cutting a short film and really don't see the need in investing in a proper red post system if I dont have to: I would much rather work with what I have.

I was hoping you folks could tell me how practical that would be.

here are my specs:

FCP 6.0.6
RX build 262

2008 build Mac Pro
8core 3gig processor
6 gig 667MHz RAM
Radeon X1900 512 RAM

files are being pulled from a brand new 1tb G-Drive via FireWire 800 that is not raided.

Given these limitations: would it be better just to edit with the QT refs and not transcode?

How would I then online?

I am aware that my setup is not ideal for working with the recent red stuff. If you had to only change two things about my setup, say spend 500 bucks, what would you change?


Thanks for taking the time to read my conundrum! I'm not quite a noob, but not nearly as pro as you guys!

Thanks in advance for your help!



(EDIT: after posting, it seems that linked text appears the same as non hyperlinked text, making it hard to spot hyperlinks. here is the thread I am referring to: http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=51899&highlight=problem )
 
I need to get to sleep, but a couple of short answers for you.

If you are working with RED footage with any regularity a Rocket really makes a lot of sense, or just hiring the trans-codes out.

The biggest bottleneck in your system is likely disk performance, but that shouldn't effect stability, so you have other issues.

While not currently in vogue, or a best practice, the good news is working with the camera generated proxies works pretty well for short form, and is a viable option for the edit.

You can do that, but it doesn't explain the crashing you are seeing, though I'll have to admit that I haven't run super long trans-coding sessions on a machine with so little memory.

For the budget you mention, it's kind of toss up for me, you could probably pick up six gigs of memory pretty cheap, and then raid 0 some internal drives with the remainder of the money.

Steve
 
A couple of possible pointers.

Get the latest RCX (356, now up on Red.com/support) if you want to transcode. If you are transcoding for offlines only, you could use 1/4 debayer to 1024x576 (if it's 16:9), that should give you more than realtime transcode. At least it does wirth clipfinder...
http://www.daun.ch/hamingja/

The crashes could be an indicator of badly copied frames.
Have you tested that the files that crash, actually play back?

You can cut from the proxies, send to color, use clipfinders colorfixer to make the RAW files work properly in color and online from there...

I would suggest you updated to SnowLeopard/FCP7, though.

This would also give you access to the newest color developments in the Color RAW-tab...

First and foremost, do workflowtests before you committ to one solution or an other...

Cheers!

G
 
What they said.

Hiring out for renders gets you top notch files to work with and saves you the horsepower requirements for working natively with RED files. If your post pipe is ready for regular 1080 it might be a very decent quick fix. Just make sure your 1st light is solid. There's (quick) no going back.

Otherwise, buying time by rendering lower rez proxies then relinking to a lengthier higher rez render later is very wise indeed.

While I don't work with Clipfinder anymore with my current workflow. I can highly recommend it. Very worthy investment.
 
Given that you're on older hardware and an older version of FCP, you're setting yourself up for a headache if you try and edit the camera proxies. The RED plugins for FCP6 haven't been updated in AGES, so you're not going to be getting the benefit of the past couple years of development.

Transcode/Rendering without a rocket is always a pain. Couple of suggestions to possibly ease that pain:
-Make sure you're using the latest RC-X. (Stable build, off Red.com/support, not the forums)
-Render low-rez proxies. You didn't mention what you were trying to render to, but by combining your mention of "Short Film" and "24 Hour Render" I'm assuming you're trying to do Full-Rez ProRes. 1/2 or even 1/4 rez will work fine for editing.
-Check your files for errors. Like Gunleik said, constant crashing could indicate bad frames.

As far as a single upgrade for $500... Yerg. I don't think there's any one upgrade that will really help all that much in that price range, other than buying a copy of clipfinder. Maybe rent time on a transcode box at a post house?
 
Thanks for the responses, guys.

From what you've said it looks like the slow transcode time really is due to my hardware and software, and you've given me plenty of ways to go about improving those situations.

What I need to figure out now is that, given that i am NOT going to be finishing with proxies, and that i AM going to be on-lining to something as lossless as possible, do i really NEED to go about fixing my system or can I just edit with the QT proxy refs?

thanks again!
 
Last edited:
Nathan Adler said:
Thanks for the responses, guys.

From what you've said it looks like the slow transcode time really is due to my hardware and software, and you've given me plenty of ways to go about improving those situations.

What I need to figure out now is that, given that i am NOT going to be finishing with proxies, and that i AM going to be on-lining to something as lossless as possible, do i really NEED to go about fixing my system or can I just edit with the QT proxy refs?

thanks again!
Click to expand...

Depending on how much material you have to relate to...

If it is a lot - transcoding will save you a lot of time.

I'd transcode to 1/4 debayer 1024 x 576 (if speed and stability was the main factors)


You could still conform back to RAW for online with clipfinder.



Cheers!

G
 
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