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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

How do you think canon , and all the concurent s are going to react ?

Madjid El ayari

Madjid El ayari

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How do you think canon , and all the concurents are going to react , now that red humiliate canon with his poor C300 ? And That red had killed also the f35 ? It s must be hard also for the guys who made the Ikonoskop !

I think canon , sony , panasonic are working on something for next year , as canon has already lose a lot of customer completely disapointed ,by their poor project , the 3 nov . This competion his going to serve us .

Thx Red for having put the level really high !

www.madjidelayari.com

I definitely think that red should release a camera under 6000 dollars at least 3k 4:4:4 raw 16bit 24fps, for the people who have a small budgect , in order to please everyone and kill definitely theses company !
 
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Sorry I don t understand what does it minds . But if you mind that it s a west of times thinking that something like this will be released . It minds that you are naive !

Because in 20 years you ll be able to record on high format and medium sensor 8:8:8:8 960fps hdrx 32 bits at 12k on raw , may be on some silicon foveon sensor , with a camera full equiped for less than 20 thousand Euro !

And bielieve it or not but these next 5 and 10 years you are not going to bielieve what is going to be released by all the company involved in the Camera business .

And i definitely think that the people who bought a 5d mark II for filming , because they can not spend more than 6000 dollars , are the bigest number of potential customers wich canon and panasonic ( with the af100 )was going to lose if RED
would have released the 6000 dollars scarlet !!! then RED would have been a bigger company with more money for his research departement , cutomer service etc ..........................for our pleasure !
 
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First reaction , but not enough imo . The C300 in Europe is 33% of the price is was suppose to be, in preorder : 12000 Euro ttc ( VAT inc ) in Europe and it was announced at 17500 Euro vat inc
 
hating on other cameras is such waste of energy ...

why not be big enough te see that there is room in this world for all types of cameras and all types of shooters?

Right down to the little guy who's still shooting mini DV.
 
There s no hate at all ! the c300 is too expensive compared to what red purpose for the same price ! And i think that it is the big company involved in the camera business who hate us , by releasing very slowely some really poor evolution for an expensive price !

The 5d mark II is more than 3 years old and nothing interesting have been released since !!! Canon is not nice at all with his customer !!!

So it s nice to see the pressure comimg from third company ! I hope someone is going for 5000 euro at least build a 2k full frame dng camera !#

www.madjidelayari.com
 
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Madjid El ayari said:
There s no hate at all ! the c300 is too expensive compared to what red purpose for the same price ! And i think that it is the big company involved in the camera business who hate us , by releasing very slowely some really poor evolution for an expensive price !

The 5d mark II is more than 3 years old and nothing interesting have been released since !!! Canon is not nice at all with his customer !!!

So it s nice to see the pressure comimg from third company ! I hope someone is going for 5000 euro at least build a 2k full frame dng camera !#

www.madjidelayari.com
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Hey Madjid,

Congrats for your work, I like your photos on your web site. Very nice.

If all that you're looking for is a €5,000 camera, why not buy a Scarlet with a friend ? When you guys aren't using it, you could even rent it and make some extra cash...
 
Thx . I m glad you like them . Now it s time for me to make a movie , with all the things i have learned , since my first one in 2003 !

But yeah of course I am going to buy a Scarlet on my own . As it s not something you can really share .

I am liitle disapointed too that it is not full frame at 3k or 4K or at least a 1,3 crop fact at 4k ! but it is still the perfect cam for my need .

The concurrence in fact are some sleeping idiots , they are multi billionaires international company and they don t have the capacity to reach what RED did .

Cheers

www.madjidelayari.com
 
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Madjid El ayari said:
I definitely think that red should release a camera under 6000 dollars at least 3k 4:4:4 raw 16bit 24fps, for the people who have a small budgect , in order to please everyone and kill definitely theses company ![/B][/U]
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I'm also hoping Ferrari will sell their cars for under $30k. That way we can all shoot red and drive red =}
 
Kacey Baker said:
I'm also hoping Ferrari will sell their cars for under $30k. That way we can all shoot red and drive red =}
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I ask a question i get some very poor answer !

Are you thinking you are ironic ! ? !

You seem to have forget that Red was very close to release the fixed scarlet for this price wich was 4:4:4 16 bits at 3k , 4k.

Do you think a products like that are never going to be released in the futur ?
 
I know it s stupid ! But you never know, they knew red was going to release something crazy , and they have release a dead body as a huge events in hollywood in front of everyone :stupid and Insane from a company who has a huge research departement , to release something so poor with no shame ! That s why i think they are going to enter in the uncompressed 16bits data world, now , in order to don t get fuck twice ! Or they ll lose a huge part of their customer .

For this red has just to released a 6000 dollars body with 16 bits data and a way also to get quick compression data straight from all his new cam . Like an atomos ninja with a choice of better control compression . than the af101 and the f3 wich are almost dead will be completely dead too !

It s logical Red is entering in a new Market Panel , and they have taken some part of this market also : between 10 000 and 20 000 dollars . They were this close to take a lot of part of the market panel between the 5000 and 10 000 dollars customers too , but they didn t !!!

If these company don t react they ll lose a lot of customers !

www.madjidelayari.com
 
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Our company ordered a Scarlet, but we will also certainly look at the C300.

I think that everyone got carried away with the specs and didn´t think about the image. From what I have seen of the C300, it looks beautiful (especially skin tones and colour rendition) and will be a fantastic camera for projects that need a fast turnaround or a really simple, light setup. If the street price is closer to $14k, I think we will get one and i'm certain we will make money with it. If it were 10bit, it would be a no brainer... But 8bit should hold up well for alot of work.

Glorious times people:

Sub $1k - Hacked GH2
Sub $2k - 7D, 5DII
$5k - AF100, FS100
Sub $15k - Scarlet, F3, C300 (?)
Sub $50k - Epic
Sub $100k - F65, Alexa

I agree that there is a gaping whole in the $5k-$15k market though. I expect Panasonic to be the 1st to go there.
 
the c300 is released at 16 000 dollars in Europe ..... ! you better buy an other scarlet with an hd sdi recorder !

When you know how to deal with raw dpx , dng , how it works in the real professional color correction world ( not amateur who act like pro ) , you cannot live without it !!!

Camera who compressed the images with a poor or no controL AT ALL over the compression are a pain the ass ! Compression even on hd sdi or hdmi recorder have to be programmed OR controled by a real TALENTED DOP !

www.madjidelayari.com
 
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RED won't release a 3K for 3K camera...or anything less than 4K. The mantra at RED is simple. "4K is the future". RED is creating the future so going anything less than 4K is a bit foolish if your trying to push everyone into 4K.

What will happen or is more than likely is that the Scarlet may see a price drop due to economies of scale when other manufacturers start trying to take on the Scarlet. Yes there is a price rise but this is more than likely due to the parts costing X amount and RED needing to keep a margin that makes it worth them producing such a camera. It's still sub 15K as Jay pointed out. The factors come into play when you start kitting out the Scarlet and taking care of the backend.

Even at 3K the storage for that is still more than your regular 1080p camera, more than what a 7D feature film would create in terms of data. This is what will still stop there being a '3K for 3K' because once you put all the pieces together 3K for 3K would become something closer to 3K for 9K or 10K. Yes its cheaper than the current Scarlet but again, goes against the RED idea of pushing 4K.

Make a 4K cam at 15K. Push your competitors to come in and under cut the Scarlet, as we see the C300 has what appears to be a price reduction in Europe, this is cool, its a step towards Canon acknowledging REDs win for the 4K. Their announcement of the 4K DSLR means they want customers to stay glued to Canon, they knew RED was all about 4K. If 3K was so worth it, why didn't Canon say 'we are announcing a 3K camera for the end of this year for $3,000"? They have the economies of scale, manufacturing facilities and the minds to create such a product, it just isn't worth it.

Jannard and the rest of the RED team have pointed out upscaling from 1080p to 4K when 4K displays become the norm is going to prove a bit of an issue. Unless that whole 'zoom, enhance' tech becomes a reality allowing them to add invisible pixels 1080p at 4K is not going to look as fantastic as 4K on a 4K display or 1080p display. A similar issue, obviously not as great but still an issue, is doing 3K upscaling to 4K. RED is providing the logic of future proofing. Don't HAVE to finish in 4K. Keep the 4K files though, when tech comes into play allowing for enough bandwidth, enough screen real estate, enough of power to play the 4K at a cheaper consumer level, you'll have the thankful ability to re-render you entire 1080p sequence back up to 4K and stay current.

Scarlet and EPIC will move into the future with Dragon, you'll see 5K get better dynamic range, you'll be seeing more possibilities for 5K with FPS (which I'm sure a lot of you would love 300fps at 5K). I have no clue what the Dragon sensor will bring but it will never be a step backwards. You set your cameras for people to buy. You tell them the path that they will take is an upgradable one. They invest in technologies to help provide the ability to edit and store their investment. They will never have to make any of it redundant or say its overkill. All the accessories etc. will be usable on the next big upgrade. This is what RED is about and this is why Scarlet and EPIC are brother and sister. The future is easy for those that will jump from a Scarlet to an EPIC. It's a stepping stone.

RED said they were a profesional company. Sony, Panasonic, Canon and Arri all see this, they will all come out with their own versions of 4K,5K and the like. The fun starts now after Scarlet. When that pricing means Canon and the rest with the large facility plants that can help them manufacturer on economies of scale, cut their prices on the 4K cameras. You will at some point in time be able to buy a 4K for Sub $10K, for Sub $8K and so forth. Being the big boys means if you can't fight on specs, you fight on price, aim for the masses.

When you think RED stratergy, think Apple. They evolve and sure they kill tech before it even needs to die. They create what appears to be the future, its arguable, but it forces competitors to re-invent and under cut them in anyway possible. RED kill their competitors on specs alone. They will continue to do so. They kill them on price. Now competitors will have to aim for similar specs and kill RED on pricing. It's the only way to stop RED eating anymore of the pie then they already have been.

This is the one of the single most important reason why 3K for 3K is so pointless. You'll eventually be having 4K for 4K. Because of what RED has just done to the competition. C300 is 16K in europe or 20K in the states (around there, haven't followed much on the changes). Its a 1080p camera. RED is 9K body, around 25K with the backend supported (storage etc. and a bare bones able to work Scarlet but that price is flexible obviously). RED shoots 4K. C300 shoots 1080p. 1080p has its place but it just means that the DSLR like 4K that Canon will bring out either has to be MAJORLY better spec'd 4K then the RED Scarlet or it has to under cut in the pricing area. effectively over taking the C300 as their flagship cinema camera.
 
Madjid El ayari said:
When you know how to deal with raw dpx , dng , how it works in the real professional color correction world ( not amateur who act like pro ) , you cannot live without it !!!]
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Quotes like this just make you sound like a fanboy. I know how to work a RAW workflow, I know when to work a RAW workflow. I also know that not all projects need it and I certainly can live without it.
 
Jay Birch said:
Quotes like this just make you sound like a fanboy. I know how to work a RAW workflow, I know when to work a RAW workflow. I also know that not all projects need it and I certainly can live without it.
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Agreed that not all projects require RAW.

Most projects can get away with quicker turn arounds, the use of a proxy module or similar, like Ki Pro mini etc. means that you could edit in Pro-Res quickly off the bat and switch to RAW for grading but in the end some productions just need it to get out straight away, TV Ads and other similar stuff that would be heading to 1080p would more then likely not worry much about RAW.

RAW is awesome to have but some people on a schedule don't really need to work the RAW files. Hence cameras like the C300 and 7D will always be around. 1080p is enough for most things, until the TV industry get back up and say 'its 4K time!' and start marketing 4K as the new 1080p.
 
I'll be shooting both. Scarlet will be my stay at home personal projects camera - a recent ad agency client I just picked up has already specified to me they want c300, for fast post-codec 1080p delivery
 
Imran Farouk said:
Agreed that not all projects require RAW.

Most projects can get away with quicker turn arounds, the use of a proxy module or similar, like Ki Pro mini etc. means that you could edit in Pro-Res quickly off the bat and switch to RAW for grading but in the end some productions just need it to get out straight away, TV Ads and other similar stuff that would be heading to 1080p would more then likely not worry much about RAW.

RAW is awesome to have but some people on a schedule don't really need to work the RAW files. Hence cameras like the C300 and 7D will always be around. 1080p is enough for most things, until the TV industry get back up and say 'its 4K time!' and start marketing 4K as the new 1080p.
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Just saying that is better to control the compression over an hdmi or hdi recorder !
 
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