How do many of you graduate to RED ONE?

[omar robles]

So I have been intrigued by the RED ONE camera for a while now. I use the hvx200 alongside a cinemek g35 (which macgregor used for similo) While i am happy with my current set up. I can't help but think that i would be way happier working with the red camera.

I ve observed that many former hvx200 owners have moved up to the RED ONE. My question is how are you doing this? Moving from a 5-6 thousand dollar camera to 30-40k camera. I am a regular on the dvxuser forum and i notice that when a person is selling all their gear they indicate that they have moved up to red one. If i were to sell all my gear i wouldn't come close to being able to afford a red one camera.

So if any of you would be so kind as to share how you can afford such a pricey camera i would appreciate hearing it.

thanks so much

o

 

[Craig Ryan]

Hey man, welcome to the community.

While I don't own a RED One, my background is basically the DVX, and some 16mm film, and I've been learning about RED since it was first introduced way back on DVXuser; so my opinion is of someone who's observed from the sidelines, so to speak.

Generally, it seems that the best way to introduce yourself to RED if you're coming from a prosumer video background is to start shooting RAW stills with a DSLR. This will introduce you to the concept of shooting RAW, and what that means for your post workflow, as well as what to expect while shooting.

The camera itself is much more like a professional film camera or professional grade video camera than a prosumer video camera, so people with film and high end video seem to adapt to it quite well. The RED One seems to bridge the gap between the two actually.

As far as affording the camera; if the camera is a significant investment for you right now, "fugetaboudit!" Most who move up to RED in most cases either have the money to spare if they're doing it as a hobby, or will easily make back their investment with the first few jobs they work. So if you don't fit into either category, it may be wise to rent for now if you want to shoot RED. Jim himself has advised not to invest unless you know it's going to help you out. Coming from the owner of the company, that's quite impressive I might add. That's class.

 

[Noah Kadner]

So if any of you would be so kind as to share how you can afford such a pricey camera i would appreciate hearing it.

CCD- Credit Card Debt... :emote_couch:

Noah

 

[omar robles]

Thanks Craig. I appreciate the response. That makes total sense.

Out of curiosity have you shot with the red?

 

[Craig Ryan]

Actually, I haven't had the privilege to shoot on one yet. I went to the Digital Cinema Society RED One presentation last year here in the Bay Area and got to see some of them up close and personal, but as far as actually manning the gun, nope! Kinda embarrassing considering how much time I spend browsing these forums...heh.

 

[jimhare]

Hi Omar,

It's really a matter of what new opportunities having a Red would open up for you.

Until recently, there really hasn't been an option to improve quality without spending hundreds of thousands. Spending $30k-$100k is pretty reasonable when you consider all the things you could potentially do with the camera.

If you are shooting smaller projects, like corporates or small music videos, and don't see your clients spending more for better quality, or being able to attract larger clients because of your gear, you may end up out of pocket in the end.

But if you feel your equipment is holding you back, and you could attract larger budgets by having a Red, it's a wonderful thing!

I love it because I have a Red every day of the year so if I feel like experimenting or expanding my craft, I have access to it 24/7.

For me it has opened up a world of opportunity and taken me places I only could have imagined with my old set up.

That's probably the best advice I can give you. Have a close look at what you're doing and how it would change with a Red.

If you do decide to proceed, you will need a loan or lease. This means you will need to know that you will earn at least a couple of thousand per month in addition to what you currently do, purely because you have a Red. If you don't think this will happen, this may be a reason not to do it.

All the best,

Jim

 

[Stephen Gentle]

I'm hoping to move up to myself Scarlet from shooting Sony HDV and XDCAM EX cameras - should be a big jump in quality without having to pay very much more money.

Still, you could probably pay off a RED ONE in half a year to a year if you were doing professional jobs.

 

[Brandon Fraley]

...but as far as actually manning the gun, nope! Kinda embarrassing considering how much time I spend browsing these forums...heh.

don't worry Craig, we'll get you behind a camera soon enough PM me, we might even be able to get together next week.

 

[sander kamp]

I don't think it is that difficult to get a closer look at the camera and who are working with it. Find somebody in the neighborhood who has one and volunteer to help on the set, if you are serious and willing to learn that shouldn't be a problem - every production can use some extra hands, especially if they are free. Once on the set keep your eyes open, and talk to people. If you are a nice guy then people will ask you back and you can slowly make your way up until behind the camera. It will take time, but it is certainly possible. Keep in mind that it is not just the camera that makes the difference but also the people, the kind of jobs and the workflow.

 

[LarryMcPhereson]

"I'm hoping to move up to myself Scarlet from shooting Sony HDV and XDCAM EX cameras - should be a big jump in quality without having to pay very much more money.

Still, you could probably pay off a RED ONE in half a year to a year if you were doing professional jobs."

Yeah this is where it gets interesting for me having shot one only one feature on 16mm and mastering it digitally. I'm not sure I want a Scarlet as many are describing it as a 16mm digital, yet I know I'm not going to be able to afford an Epic unless I make some significant financial gains...

The major problem is factoring all the costs beyond the basic camera body plus that the Red One is a pretty heavy camera and if you're buying you have to take that into account with your tripod, fluid head etc. even if you do start off with a Nikon still lens. Still, it is tempting to think about getting in at that level and trying to work part time as a hand held or lock down B or C camera operator but I sure wouldn't expect a quick pay back. The learning curve and total cash outlay gives every sane individual considerable pause and the Adobe/Apple support is fairly infuriating too...

 

[Jaime Vallés]

Omar, since you already have the HVX200 + G35, at this point I would skip the Red One and wait for the S35 Scarlet. It will allow you to use the lenses you use now (Nikon, I assume) and receive a massive boost in image quality from your current rig, and yet be much, much cheaper than a comparable Red One setup.

The S35 Scarlet brain is $7000, but you need to add an LCD ($1500?), Nikon mount ($500?), CF module ($500?), and side handle w/battery ($1000?) as a bare minimum for shooting. Of course, these prices are my estimates, as no module prices have yet been released. But I'm guessing that (not including lenses or CF cards) one can put together a basic S35 Scarlet rig for well under $12,000. Dollar-wise this is much more manageable than a ~$25,000 bare-bones Red One package.

Hopefully this helps!

 

[Shawn Nelson]

If you understand 35mm optics, Red is actually easier in operation than the HVX group of cameras, IMHO.

I prepared by shooting a lot more with my DSLR. Turn it to manual mode. Red is just a huge DSLR thats full motion and RAW

 

[Steve Murray]

i have been shooting for 15 months with Rosebud. Yes, I'm still paying for her. But I have zero regrets.

If you can figure out a way... buy now.

Why?

First: I think it will be at least 18 months before you can get your hands on a Scarlet S35 (my guesstimate). Sure, maybe only it's only 12... but what if it is 24 months before your number comes up? Are you going to be happy with an HVX for 2 more years? Shooting 720p?

Second: With Build 20 and now B21 the camera is so good that there's no real need to wait for the "new" cameras. Shoot now.

IMHO

Third: Epic-X (R1 owners only) and the 2/3" Scarlet are the first of the new cameras to be shipped. I do not think that you want a 2/3" camera. You will want at least the S35 Scarlet. Or perhaps you want an Epic-X, only way to get one is to trade your R1. That means get to the very back of the line if you do not have a R1 and wait and wait. And you already have 6000+ in front of you.

On August 10 --

We have said that much of the delivery dates rely on a successful ASIC spin. We have also indicated that we are not going to rush to release given market conditions and the overwhelming opinion of our customers to put out a finished product and not a prototype. I wouldn't expect any type of update for a couple of months. The schedule should be more clear by then...

Jim
__________________
"Everything in life changes... including our camera specs and delivery dates..."

Fourth: I figure the first 4500 2/3 & S35 Scarlet's will go to current R1 owners. So, rather than stand in the back of a very, very long line... get an R1 now and shoot.

Fifth: I had HVX200 Serial #90 -- great camera at the time (Jan 2006) and I later added a RedRock for a month and then sold the RR as I hated shooting with it. You will LOVE shooting with the R1 compared to your current setup. LOVE it.

.

 

[LarryMcPhereson]

"First: I think it will be at least 18 months before you can get your hands on a Scarlet S35 (my guesstimate)"

You make some darn good arguments Steve Murray, not to mention no one is exactly sure how the S35 Scarlet will stack up against the Red One by the time we can get one...

Does anybody have an idea as to just how long it takes typically to get a Red One these days on average from the day you place your order?

 

[Daniel García]

I'm sure you can wait till November to make a decision.

 

[Stephen Pruitt]

Yes. . . credit card debt. . . inheritance. . . etc. That's how we bought ours. No regrets at all.

And, yes, the RED is an extremely easy camera to use. I love it.

Oh, and we had an HVX-200 (with the Brevis 35mm adapter) before we bought "Lewis."

Stephen