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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

How and what are you guys cutting Epic footage?

Rick Darge

Rick Darge

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Trying to figure out my new workflow. Normally with Red MX I would just cut in FCP using the M proxy files. I'm think PP 5.5 for Epic but I heard it's a little buggy and no audio support at the moment. I don't have a Rocket at the moment.
 
I Cashed in my chips yesterday and went CS 5.5 and using it NOW---HOLY CRAP---what a good choice. was on the fence for 4 months and just did it. Not looking back at all now....

....Dear FCP, i'll still come back and use you, but you are no longer my tool of choice. Thank you for years of hard work and perseverance, but you are now lazy and fat and you no longer go to continuing education classes......

EDIT: i run a rocket card....but if you don't have RR card, this seems a no brainer to go CS5 and invest in a NVDIA card. Seems you can get the lowest level card and same acceleration as in big (expensive) card.
 
Does anything cut 5k yet?
 
Premiere is worth working through the bugs for the linear workflow alone. You should definitely get a Rocket though.

Edit: Premiere does cut 5K with the Adobe labs update. (And has the ability to go as high as 10K right now)
 
Resolve -> Avid DNxHD files for the edit.
Back to Resolve for finish, then out to DNxHD high quality with full grade.
Easy as pie.

Might try Avid AMA full R3D access at one point but DNxHD is responsive and quick. Gonna wait till Media Composer 6 before trying AMA properly (best to wait a version or two for everyone else to beta test for you IMHO :).

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
 
Redcine-X pro > prores 4444 > PPro >Smoke.
I have'nt figured out how to use Davinci Resolve yet. I'm still a layer based guy.
 
There are many options and many more very soon, we use a variety of solutions depending on project:
RedCine-X Pro
RedCine-X to Avid (with and without Rocket)
RedCine-X to FCP
R3D to Autodesk Smoke (usually offline in Avid or FCP first)
R3D to Flame Premium/Lustre
R3D to After Effects or Premiere
AJA KiPro Mini to ProRes (and either online directly from Prores or offline Prores, export edl and relink r3d)

hopefully Avid will support Epic R3D directly soon
 
Lots of workable ways to do it, as Greg M and others point out. But for now, the best choice for direct ingest and cutting of native 5K files without any transcoding is Adobe Premiere. With the current support for R3D and the ability to mix just about anything together on a single timeline, it's now my dominant NLE these days.

I'm pretty much a Premiere, AE, Resolve and Nuke guy these days...
 
Greg M said:
hopefully Avid will support Epic R3D directly soon
Click to expand...

I did send Michael P from Avid a drive of Epic footage the moment Epic came out to test with, with best wishes - so I hope so too!

My guess would be they will have the latest Red SDK integrated into Media Composer 6.0.

Probably they are so busy doing the whole 64-bit thing, >1080p support etc, and just are going to sort out everything at once.

Though... I don't want to have to wait half a year beyond that for Media Composer 6.5 so that I can load Scarlet footage directly!

Their other AMA plugins are separate downloads so that they can keep them up to date independent of Media Composer releases. Hope they do something similar with regard to decoupling Media Composer releases from RedCode AMA releases too.

But since Red is so connected to possible Media Composer 6 features, I guess I can understand it for now.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
 
No EPIC AMA in Media Composer yet but I'd imagine V.6.x will sort that out imminently.

As far as AMA releases go, AMA is the responsibility of the vendor to write not AVID. AVID provides the AMA framework(s)

I know for a fact AVID and RED are in close contact and moving things forward as fast as both companies can.

Jason
 
Using CS5.5 and it is fantastic! You can edit directly and you can even change the grade in the RMDs without leaving the software or having to grade and import in REDCineX (You can also blend your HDRx in it with the use of a slider tool...simple) It's the fastest it has ever been and it is the only real way for the time being...no need to transcode which I hate...loving the upgrade to CS5.5.
 
I was on the fence on the Red Rocket card and whatnot. I'm a FCP user through and through, stuck on 7 though until something comes that I can agree with.

Premiere Pro 5.5 I've tried and genuinely like, but I just have a dedicated workflow within FCP that I can't leave right now.

I got the Red Rocket card and it was one of the best decisions I've done in terms of all this workflow.

Call me crazy, but it's almost like a DSLR workflow where I transcode in real time and can cut with a nice proxy of my choice and online to the 5K for grading wherever I want to go.

Someone else said it but the RR card is worth it's weight in gold! The workflow is so easy and I am not talking about just for me. I can convert to PP 5.5 no problem, but in terms of clients, I don't want to necessarily leave them with footage they can't possibly cut.

It really is worth it to buy the RR card. I wouldn't think twice about it.

I offline to ProResLT that looks amazing and I can cut offline and retain so much information.

Just my 2 cents.
 
Eston Diaz said:
@ Neil: Mac or PC?
Click to expand...


It is for PC and I am running a pretty heavy weight GFX card, but I had 5k layers on layers and it just ate through it with no probs at all. I love the fact that you can grade directly in the software and render out playback at real time. The murcury renderer is really fast...and the software in AE and Premier is now 64-bit native.

Vincent Laforet has done a video tutorial that is really worth watching. Its a bit long and a bit slow to start with, but bear with it for the RED workflow
 
OKAY...

Since we are talking about this, instead of starting an other thread I'll add on this one... So thanks Rick for starting this... ;)


I have now done 4 EPIC vs. ALEXA Test shoots, and 3 went with EPIC all the way, for more then one reason not worth mentioning here...

But my last one went with ALEXA... I asked why, and they replied that EPIC files were not easy to work with, and that the ALEXA files were better, problem was that their Editor never worked with R3D files,
and the producer completely disregarded my comments about insuring that the EPIC files be handled by some one that already had experience editing RED ONE files...


So what I am going to do at the new Studios in MILAN, is offer Monthly EPIC Workshops, form acquisition to Post and Delivery.

I'll bring periodically in some of the best EDITORS, FX, & COLORIST, I know form around the Globe for this events and be done with it...

But the question here for now is this...


It is my understanding coming directly form RED, at list I thinks I understand so, is that all R3D files be handled as much as possible inside RCX-PRO, and only when done there take the files to
the EDITING SW Program of choice, for us will be RCX-PRO, Adobe PP & AE and IRIDAS (depends on what Adobe will do) or RESOLVE
plus some plug ins form the Foundry and others for finishing FX etc.

Now with the capacity of Adobe PP that can ingest directly the R3D files, will this not take the best out of the R3D's??


It is imperative that for the good and the success of our Studios, and our Projects, as well as our representation of RED in Italy and Europe, our deliverables be at the highest level... So I am all hears... Thanks.
 
KETCH ROSSi said:
Now with the capacity of Adobe PP that can ingest directly the R3D files, will this not take the best out of the R3D's??


It is imperative that for the good and the success of our Studios, and our Projects, as well as our representation of RED in Italy and Europe, our deliverables be at the highest level... So I am all hears... Thanks.
Click to expand...


HI Ketch,

You don't have anything to worry about. What Red and others have been promoting is the idea of not rendering from your R3Ds until as late as possible in the workflow. Editing in PP/AE the native R3Ds will not change anything of the R3Ds unless you render. So the optimal workflow in that case will be to edit in PP, expoert XML, import in Resolve, and in Resolve grade and perform your master render. In this workflow, ony one render is happening from the R3Ds, and that is in Resolve after the edit and color grading is complete. This will generate the highest quality finish using those tools. If you need to do additional work with plugins from the Foundry that would have to require a separate render as there is no supported plugin architecture in Resolve yet.
 
Hey Rick,
The benefits of using Davinci Resolve are relative, so there is really no way to answer that. The benefits of Resolve over using the limited native color correction tools in PP and the clunky layers interface of AE are a significant savings in time. If you are grading only a handful of clips in a project, you can probably get a similar result using the tools in AE. But once the clip count starts to climb and the stacked layers in AE become a navigation nightmare, taking the project out of Adobe-land into a formal color grading app of any flavor is a huge win.

Comparing Resolve to Apple Color is more of an apples-to-apples. And Resolve eats Color's shorts for breakfast on all levels, especially now that it can accept PP XML.

In a nutshell Resolve is really really fast once you scale your hardware up to meet your needs. I can grade 4K projects in real-time. That includes adding any reasonable number of secondary corrections to a primary grade. The motion tracker in Resolve is fantastic. 9-times out of 10 you throw a mask on a object and tell it to track it and it just works, and only in a few seconds. In Color that success rate is about 40% and takes forever. The quality of the keys in Resolve are very good. Personally, I love the interface. My productivity was almost doubled on long-form projects over Color, and that was when I was still learning the tools. It does a good job of supporting third party control surfaces (like the Tangent Wave), and that also impacts performance.

There is more, but probably the best thing you could do is download the free version and try it on.

I will say however, that getting a system that can do real-time 4k is not trivial. You need a late model MacPro, 2-3 NVideo video cards (CUDA), fast RAID, etc.
 
Paul Nordin said:
HI Ketch,

You don't have anything to worry about. What Red and others have been promoting is the idea of not rendering from your R3Ds until as late as possible in the workflow. Editing in PP/AE the native R3Ds will not change anything of the R3Ds unless you render. So the optimal workflow in that case will be to edit in PP, expoert XML, import in Resolve, and in Resolve grade and perform your master render. In this workflow, ony one render is happening from the R3Ds, and that is in Resolve after the edit and color grading is complete. This will generate the highest quality finish using those tools. If you need to do additional work with plugins from the Foundry that would have to require a separate render as there is no supported plugin architecture in Resolve yet.
Click to expand...

Okay, this is somewhat different form what I have been telling people to do, as what I did understood was not to exit RCX till as much as work was done to the R3D's.

Still can't understand then why an Editor, can get good results out of an Alexa file and not do good job on an R3D file when using PP for both.


Then if one chooses to bypass RCX-PRO completely, all they need to do is load the footage in R3D directly on to PP, and do the necessary workflow, then Render, and exporting in DPX files to yield best resolution?

Really need to take a good CRASH editing class form some good when I find some time, too many words I still quite don't get, he he.

And the lessons on Lynda.com, are just simply some what confusing and too them boring...

But they sure did made me a Good Photoshop Artist since 3 Years ago when I first started... ;)
 
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