Help - Panchro classic/i Vs Ultra Prime

[Manoj R C]

Dear All,

Yes, I know most of you wouldn't have got an opportunity to use new Panchro classic/i which Cooke announced last Sep.
So I'm not expecting a scientific answer from you. Need just 'your' opinion.

I'm in the market to buy a new set of prime lenses. Initially, almost decided to get Cooke mini S4i, but based on feedback from many DPs, decided not to go for it (Mainly because it does only 2.8). Ultraprime is nice but it's slightly expensive. That's when I decided to go for new Panchro classic set. It's relatively faster and it's Cooke. Though UPs are more expensive than Panchros, which one would you recommend or rather which one would you like to use. Please remember, this is for rental purpose. So want to get opinion from rental houses as well.

Thanks & Regards,
Manoj

 

[Dan Kanes]

I think you can't go wrong with Cookes.

The f2.8 lenses are a hard sell even though sensors are so fast these days.

I'd absolutely buy those Panchro i new lenses though.

 

[Sean Keen]

Ultras is much wider rental purposes

 

[paul engstrom]

Hi Manoj,

A few more things to consider:

I would say it's a little early to speculate how well these will rent -- especially in each individual market. Might be awesome. Might not be 'vintage' enough. Might be too 'vintage' for your market, meaning they might be a bad choice for the numerous projects that require a better controlled image. You can certainly get an excellent set of used Ultraprimes with significant depreciation already accounted for...

Good luck with your quest!

 

[Matt W.]

Ultra Primes have a clinical look. Yes they are flawed (CA, breathing, barrel distortion, etc.) and more flawed than you might expect, but still clean and contrasty. Nice lenses. Unexciting, but solid. RPPs and CP2s get maligned for being somewhat boring, but the UPs are a real big step up from that. They have character, but that character is "clean" and "nice." "Crisp yet "polite."

Cooke S2/S3s are my favorite but man are they messy. Color matching is tricky. The 75mm is yellow often, but the Classics will fix color matching at least while in theory retaining the other characteristics. Still, tons of longitudinal CA, particularly in macro with diopters, nisen bokeh that's so strong it gives an almost "anamorphic" look, soft corners, etc. These are my favorite lenses on digital, but I'm an Alexa guy–I like digital that looks like film and these have a real physical character. Not to everyone's taste. If you like Panavision C Series I think you'll like these. Good performers, but you really feel the lenses. Very distinct look.

(I can send links to some material shot on both btw, PM me. Not sure it matters to you if your primary interest is in rental.)

None really cover anything more than S35....

So that's what I like in terms of look. In terms of rental purposes, I got nothing. Here in LA, I find those are some of the most commonly used lenses I encounter. UPs for tv and for a clean look, S3s as a throwback. But it's a big big market here.

I would look at your competition and see what they rent and at what rates and even post ads for both lenses at the rates that will make you a profit and see what you get the most replies to without answering back (unethical? maybe, but not terribly) just to see how demand is in your area. Not under your name, but under some bogus name to see what the market will bear without it coming back to you that you tested the waters at the expense of others' time. But it's hard to say. These lenses are worlds apart. I feel like UPs are bread and butter and Cookies are sea urchin, you know? Some people are gonna crave the weird stuff and go for it every time, but no one's gonna turn down bread and butter there just might be a million places that sell it that you've gotta undercut now.

Fwiw I love sea urchin. (And bread and butter.) Don't know what your market is like but like every restaurant here is putting sea urchin on everything and most people get their own bread and butter because they know a local store that has it cheap so they don't look around... not true everywhere. Cannot speak to your market. But both sets of lenses are excellent, just for extremely different tasks and for very different reasons.

 

[Michael Lindsay]

What do you do? What is your business? (Your profile says IT Program Manager)

You say rental but what is the proposition?

Are you going to use them yourself? Or is it just as a rental but then how?

I really think there is no simple answer unless someone knows your situation.. even people in your market will struggle to give advice that amounts to more than their experience and preference (which may not be relevant)..

I say this not to devalue any of the above thoughts (Matt's lens breakdown was great and Dane's opionions are very valid)..

Ps If I was to guess I would say if you are connected enough to make them a big success you probably already know the answer but are just looking for encouragement?... if you are not then you may struggle without some luck..

PPS I own ultraprimes and am down for a set of the new Pancros so I have thought about this a fair bit and am happy to offer advice but need to know a bit more

 

[Manoj R C]

Thanks everyone for your wise and precise responses. After going through these replies, I think I could safely bet on UPs and that's what I'm going to do. Checked with Duclos and I was told that delivery estimate is around 8 months !!

Side note : Yes my current day time job is Program Management, but soon will be launching my rental company in India.

 

[paul engstrom]

Save a lot; purchase a good condition used set. If you're unsure about them -- have them sent to Duclos for an evaluation.

You never mentioned India. Our Indian clients love Ultra Primes. You'll need a 14 and a 135.

 

[Manoj R C]

That's right. Indian DPs love Arri products ( Who doesn't?!! ). I'll keep an eye on used UP kit and I shall get 14mm & 135mm as well. Thanks for all the useful info.

Regards,
Manoj